Dismasted by an aircraft carrier

[double u]

so Lodesman, the Cole incident was unavoidable? Nothing they could have done?

[El Pinguino]

I was in Aden a few times in the early 60's when it was a stable British colony. We were warned not to go ashore as there was a risk of either getting shot or blown up.
A little later ( '65) was at college in the UK with Maktari, an Adenese arab. Come the hols he went up to London for a few weeks. He found that ratbag racist landladies didn't want no stinking wogs on their premises so flew home. He was driving his dad's Thunderbird when it was shot up by some locals who held a political grudge.
We were no end envious - most of us had spent our hols with a maiden aunt or similar.

Aden is a shithole, always has been a shithole.
USS Cole should never have made that port call. Was it asking for trouble? I think so - the phrase 'sitting duck' comes to mind.

[double u]

the "common people" were very friendly though, on all 3 visits. Absolute "alien" culture though!

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by CarinaPDX

Really???? I have read about it and can confirm his recollections. So instead of not believing him perhaps you should do some more reading?

You got a link? Care to cite these references?

[boatman61]

Aden in 1965 The NLF and FLOSY began a campaign against British forces in Aden, relying largely on grenade attacks. One such attack was carried out against RAF Khormaksar during a children's party, killing a girl and wounding four children.


Being in the RN at the time we constantly practised riot control and... were very wary of young children approaching as it was rumoured that they often carried the grenades..
Methinks you lot were more engaged in the coming horrors further East in Vietnam at the time...

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I was in Aden a few times in the early 60's when it was a stable British colony. We were warned not to go ashore as there was a risk of either getting shot or blown up.
A little later ( '65) was at college in the UK with Maktari, an Adenese arab. Come the hols he went up to London for a few weeks. He found that ratbag racist landladies didn't want no stinking wogs on their premises so flew home. He was driving his dad's Thunderbird when it was shot up by some locals who held a political grudge.
We were no end envious - most of us had spent our hols with a maiden aunt or similar.

Aden is a shithole, always has been a shithole.
USS Cole should never have made that port call. Was it asking for trouble? I think so - the phrase 'sitting duck' comes to mind.

Curious how you say "stable British colony" during a period when not one, but two guerilla groups were actively trying to oust the Brits.

Not really a "port of call" - it was a fuel stop. Should have only been a few hours. The alternative was Djibouti, also a shithole with a worsening political climate.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Curious how you say "stable British colony" during a period when not one, but two guerilla groups were actively trying to oust the Brits.

Not really a "port of call" - it was a fuel stop. Should have only been a few hours. The alternative was Djibouti, also a shithole with a worsening political climate.

Wot.???
No RAS facilities..???

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Wot.???
No RAS facilities..???

Nope. That was discussed in the investigation, and the USN simply doesn't have the resources to keep tankers stationed all over the globe to support the odd single ship transit. Cole had just gone 3000 miles and still had to get to the Gulf of Oman.

[Sequoyah]

I try to stay out of the way of objects massing more than Sequoyah. So far, so good.

[double u]

ther u go, Lodesman:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ng_South_Yemen
(& the house facades pockmarked with bulletholes are a very much correct recollection.
btw: in the 86 war a yacht was sunk through gunfire in Aden harbour, curiously named "Innocent Bystander"

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by double u

ther u go, Lodesman:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ng_South_Yemen
(& the house facades pockmarked with bulletholes are a very much correct recollection.
btw: in the 86 war a yacht was sunk through gunfire in Aden harbour, curiously named "Innocent Bystander"

Originally Posted by double u

3 visits: 1/87, 1/93 & 1/99: before each visit some sort of uprising/rebellion/"war" - bulletholes everywhere. Been there, seen it..

The "86 war" was more like an attempted coup d'etat - less than 2 weeks long, and a full year before your visit. While technically "before" your visit, it's kind of like me saying there was a civil war in the US before my last visit. But I accept that in a piss-poor country they probably didn't have the means or will to patch the bullet holes left behind. I'm not entirely sure what the list is supposed to prove - other than the tenuous link between the 86 rebellion and your first visit; I don't see any sort of uprising before either of the other visits, as you claimed.

Again all of this is years removed from Cole's visit.

Originally Posted by double u

so Lodesman, the Cole incident was unavoidable? Nothing they could have done?

Was 9/11 unavoidable? Was the Boston Marathon bombing unavoidable? Is there nothing they could have done?
To sit there with the benefit of 20/20 hindsight passing judgment is a little unfair. There was no intelligence to give warning of this event, they didn't announce their arrival. It was to be a quick stop just for fuel, but the terrorists obviously had inside information, and the luxury of being able to sit around all set up to launch a surprise attack at short notice.

All of this to say, that the Cole incident is not at all like the CDG's yacht-collision. It's way off topic.

[double u]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

....All of this to say, that the Cole incident is not at all like the CDG's yacht-collision. It's way off topic.

these incidents have the imho most important fact in common:
very capable warships that did not guard their "perimeter" (or whatever ir is called in Navy diction).
2 RIBs with armed soldiers intercepting any approaching boat in Aden harbour? Excessive precautions? A fast patrolboat (or maybe 2?) driving circles around the carier?: excessive precautions for France's single most expensive military asset?
You tell me Lodesman (seems you have some personal ax to grind there? Comparing US civil war >100 years ago to teh Yemeni recurring wars/uprisings,...?)

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

The sailboat skipper was completely in the wrong. Warships have exclusion zones. If they had detected him they probably would have fired on him !!

If there had been advance notice by radio it might have been only in French. AIS was not mentioned, but having Class B transmitter on the sailboat would have alerted the carrier to avoid or warn the boat.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

Curious how you say "stable British colony" during a period when not one, but two guerilla groups were actively trying to oust the Brits.

Not really a "port of call" - it was a fuel stop. Should have only been a few hours. The alternative was Djibouti, also a shithole with a worsening political climate.

You failed to notice my invisible emoji, it was hidden in the second sentence.

Djibouti and Aden were chalk and cheese. Mid 60's to early 70's we would get a couple of nights in Djibouti, top run ashore. The French did a far superior style of colony.
If you wanted a real shithole, peaceful at the time but still a shithole, Assab was the place to go.

'Cole'? Wooda, couda, shouda established some sort of perimeter - I bet they would these days.

Bullet holes on facades? They don't bog them up with camel dung and straw and repaint their residences after every 'event'.

Djibouti

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

You failed to notice my invisible emoji, it was hidden in the second sentence.

Silly me

Djibouti and Aden were chalk and cheese. Mid 60's to early 70's we would get a couple of nights in Djibouti, top run ashore. The French did a far superior style of colony.
If you wanted a real shithole, peaceful at the time but still a shithole, Assab was the place to go.

I think the operative word is "were" - in 2000, 2 years of hostilities between Eritrea, Ethiopia and Somalia, with poor old Djibouti in the middle, would have made it or Assab dodgy places to stop.

Dunno about French colonies. My impression is they up the cuisine and maybe add a little je ne c'est quoi, but are generally less concerned about the welfare of their charges than the Brits - generally. Hard-pressed to think of a former French colony that has "made it."

'Cole'? Wooda, couda, shouda established some sort of perimeter - I bet they would these days.

Yep. Benefit of experience. Love the pic - the Renault 8 reminds me of my childhood.