De-masted sail boat

[Cargile]

You don't see many. There are many over the hill Motorsailers with ample living room and a decent engine but rarely do you see them de-masted. Aesthetics be damned. Thanks

[Kettlewell]

The masts are just so useful, even if you rarely sail. Just putting up the main while motoring can make for a steady passage instead of a rolling mess. Plus, it is wonderful to have the backup for when the motor dies on you.

[Hartleyg]

Also, a keelboat without a mast has a NASTY rolling motion. The usual description is "vicious".


Hartley

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Hartleyg

Also, a keelboat without a mast has a NASTY rolling motion. The usual description is "vicious".


Hartley

Exactly. You can convert a sailboat to a powerboat, but doing it well isn't as simple as just removing the mast. It'll likely require changes to the keel and other changes may be desired as well to get comfortable roll behavior.

[Thomas1985]

Kettlewell nailed it. Stability of sailboats is unparalleled.

[Knotical]

It seems like OP is referring to motorsailors, which have different above and under water characteristics than a typical sailboat - more interior space, protected helm, wider body, shorter rig, powerful engine, shorter underbody etc., I reckon their stability will not be affected that much without masts.

Now, regarding their looks, I am not sure if it makes a difference whether they have masts or not - they both look ugly (apologies to MS owners)

[SailingHarmonie]

Originally Posted by Cargile

You don't see many. There are many over the hill Motorsailers with ample living room and a decent engine but rarely do you see them de-masted. Aesthetics be damned. Thanks

I don't quite know what the point is. You want to sail, buy a sailboat, you want to motor, buy a motorboat.

But one thing that needs pointing out, a proper sailing rig is way, way, WAY more reliable than any mechanical motor. That doesn't matter much if you are sailing across the bay, but when you 1500 miles from land getting home can involve a rather expensive towing contract if you are a motorboat without a working motor.

[Benz]

As far as dispensing with aesthetics, anyone remember the Island Packet model that had the masts optional? It was shortly before the company went belly-up.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Benz

As far as dispensing with aesthetics, anyone remember the Island Packet model that had the masts optional? It was shortly before the company went belly-up.

Yup, the PY / SP Cruiser, which came as either a motorsailor or powerboat. Someone on TF had the non-sailing version and added a rig to it (albeit a bit smaller than the factory sail rig). I can't remember if the smaller rig was due to the non-sailing version having reduced ballast or anything like that.

[Cargile]

Originally Posted by Hartleyg

Also, a keelboat without a mast has a NASTY rolling motion. The usual description is "vicious".
Hartley

Thanks. I have heard/read that but to me it is counter intuitive. With the weight of a keel pulling the straight down I would think it would mitigate roll and keep the boat upright. Apparently not. Any further comment on why my intuition is wrong is welcomed.

[Cargile]

Originally Posted by SailingHarmonie

I don't quite know what the point is. You want to sail, buy a sailboat, you want to motor, buy a motorboat.
But one thing that needs pointing out, a proper sailing rig is way, way, WAY more reliable than any mechanical motor. That doesn't matter much if you are sailing across the bay, but when you 1500 miles from land getting home can involve a rather expensive towing contract if you are a motorboat without a working motor.

Spoken like a true blo boater, "I don't quite know". I am not remotely interested in sailing. Entirely too much work. Too old. Thanks for the info.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Cargile

Thanks. I have heard/read that but to me it is counter intuitive. With the weight of a keel pulling the straight down I would think it would mitigate roll and keep the boat upright. Apparently not. Any further comment on why my intuition is wrong is welcomed.

It works pretty much like you're thinking. The issue becomes that with all that ballast down there and no heavy mast up in the air combined with the typical sailboat hull shapes, you end up with a boat that is effectively too stable. It won't roll all that far without a lot of force, but it will have a very short roll period, so the rolling motion it does have will be very fast and violent. That's typically more unpleasant than a boat that rolls a bit further, but more gently.

[Montanan]

The appearance of a boat as seen from off the boat loses significance once one gets on the boat. Pure aesthetics is mostly about vanity and little about function of form.

There are many "pretty" boats that one would not desire. A lot like persons.

The mast does significantly enhance roll motion and comfort and of course provides for motive force when equipped with sails.

Thus there is "beauty" when one sees the function of a form.

[donradcliffe]

I spent a week on a mooring without a mast when I was rerigging. Every time a powerboat went by my pots jumped off the stove.

[JPA Cate]

When our first Insatiable was dismasted roughly 70 miles from the harbor, I had to hold the kettle on the stove, to make our morning coffee and tea, and I toasted the bread on a cooking fork, because the motion would have tossed the toaster off the stove. Apparently, having the mast up there actually provides resistance to rolling, and slows the viscious roll. Certainly, using the mainsail adds to stability through that same roll resistance.

Hull shape can contribute what's called "form stability". I don't have a real good grab on the concept, but having a chine near the waterline can make the boat less likely to roll than having a round body shape; having flatter sections aft helps, as well.

Ann