Hailing Port and Tax Implication

[chrisjs]

Just to be clear I did not mean 91 years!! Should have read (1-2 years).

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by Jbingham

comes down to one simple thing. being caught. Here is the deal. if you live in MA. and operate in MA even if you are documented, they also want you to register the vessel in MA. if you register it, then you have to pay taxes or prove that you have paid taxes in the past. end of story.

Well, it is really more than just avoiding being caught. I won't advocate for anyone paying more tax than what is due, but I do take exception to people who try to avoid paying taxes, yet use and benefit from the services that taxes pay for. When anyone avoids paying the taxes they owe, they are stealing from the rest of us who pay taxes and force us to pay more than our fair share.

We can argue all day and night about taxes and programs and this is not the place to do that. However, would anyone walk into a restaurant and expect to get a meal for free? Would anyone tie up in a marina and expect to dock free? When you fail to pay taxes that are owed, you are in effect stealing from from your neighbors, requiring them to pay more.

With boats and cars, states want to know that you paid someone sales tax. If you buy a boat in NY and pay the sales tax, you shouldn't have to pay the sales tax again MA. Some states may want you to pay the difference between the tax rates, i.e., if the tax rate in MA is higher than the tax rate in NY, they may want the difference.

The sales tax issue is separate from property tax. Some states treat vehicles and boats as property and tax the value of the boat in much the same way a homeowner pays property tax.

At least in NY you have to register a boat with DMV and pay an annual registration fee and pay sales tax when you buy the boat. If you operate a boat in NY that is unregistered in NY or any other state, you'll be ticketed.

[Jbingham]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

Well, it is really more than just avoiding being caught. I won't advocate for anyone paying more tax than what is due, but I do take exception to people who try to avoid paying taxes, yet use and benefit from the services that taxes pay for. When anyone avoids paying the taxes they owe, they are stealing from the rest of us who pay taxes and force us to pay more than our fair share.



We can argue all day and night about taxes and programs and this is not the place to do that. However, would anyone walk into a restaurant and expect to get a meal for free? Would anyone tie up in a marina and expect to dock free? When you fail to pay taxes that are owed, you are in effect stealing from from your neighbors, requiring them to pay more.



With boats and cars, states want to know that you paid someone sales tax. If you buy a boat in NY and pay the sales tax, you shouldn't have to pay the sales tax again MA. Some states may want you to pay the difference between the tax rates, i.e., if the tax rate in MA is higher than the tax rate in NY, they may want the difference.



The sales tax issue is separate from property tax. Some states treat vehicles and boats as property and tax the value of the boat in much the same way a homeowner pays property tax.



At least in NY you have to register a boat with DMV and pay an annual registration fee and pay sales tax when you buy the boat. If you operate a boat in NY that is unregistered in NY or any other state, you'll be ticketed.

That's one interpretation Dave. I'm not seeing this as an argument however nor does your response base itself fully in facts.

As warren buffet who pays 13% tax and would gladly pay more. So you tell me. I'm a Vermont resident and property owner, a Massachusetts business owner and property owner and a boat owner moored in RI.

Take that to a tax professional or registry and see what they tell you. Ask 5 times get 5 different answers.

If this isn't the place to ask questions from our fellow sailors what is? The RMV? Ha!!

It always kills me when folks participate in forums that they don't feel are relevant.

[Dave Lochner]

Originally Posted by Jbingham

That's one interpretation Dave. I'm not seeing this as an argument however nor does your response base itself fully in facts.

As warren buffet who pays 13% tax and would gladly pay more. So you tell me. I'm a Vermont resident and property owner, a Massachusetts business owner and property owner and a boat owner moored in RI.

Take that to a tax professional or registry and see what they tell you. Ask 5 times get 5 different answers.

If this isn't the place to ask questions from our fellow sailors what is? The RMV? Ha!!

It always kills me when folks participate in forums that they don't feel are relevant.

JBingham,

I'm not interested in trolling or arguing irrelevant points. The OP said:

Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

This Mass tax issue I'll admit is very confusing to me, but I am under the impression that if the boat does not enter Mass for 6 months after purchase, than no tax is owed to Mass. I hope that is correct, because that's what I'm counting on

I may be misinterpreting GalaxyGirl's statement, but it sounds like she is looking to avoid paying MA Taxes although she will be using the boat in MA. I was responding to that statement and the comment by another poster about not being caught.

In that context, I think my comments are reasonably relevant and reasonably accurate.

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by Dave Lochner

JBingham,

I'm not interested in trolling or arguing irrelevant points. The OP said:



I may be misinterpreting GalaxyGirl's statement, but it sounds like she is looking to avoid paying MA Taxes although she will be using the boat in MA. I was responding to that statement and the comment by another poster about not being caught.

In that context, I think my comments are reasonably relevant and reasonably accurate.

Of course she doesn't want to pay any more taxes than she is lawfully required to pay, do you? That's why you learn what the tax laws are and then then decide whether it's more important to you to have your boat that you bought outside of Mass brought into Mass immediately, or to save the tax money and abide by the requirement to use it elsewhere for at least 6 months. That's the requirement the lawmakers impose and it's your choice which is more important to you. There's nothing wrong with either choice. It's not cheating if you learn and abide by the rules.

[chrisjs]

I think you are wrong about the 6 months being a "hard" limit for entry into MA. When we explored this issue before moving our vessel from RI into MA after having owned it for 3 years, we were informed by our attorney that it was a matter of "intent". Since we had never originally intended to keep our boat in MA and had documentation that it had been docked and registered in RI for 3 years, it was free of MA sales tax risk. We got further confirmation from the MA tax authorities before the move to MA. As previous, I think GG will have a hard time proving that it was not always her intent to bring the boat to MA. As for taxes, who would not want to pay more taxes????

[GalaxyGirl]

These tax lawyers really should be more cut and dry. Clearly, too much confusion.

[tartansail]

Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

These tax lawyers really should be more cut and dry. Clearly, too much confusion.

But then we wouldn't need them.

[GalaxyGirl]

Originally Posted by GalaxyGirl

These tax lawyers really should be more cut and dry. Clearly, too much confusion.

Sorry, I meant to say tax laws. These tax laws should be more clear.

[chrisjs]

Not to be overly simplistic, but the best way to solve this dilemma is to ask the right people. There is not much downside to calling the MA tax people and asking the question. Just make sure that you get the answer in writing from a named individual. Even if you do not like the answer, you can at least plan accordingly. My guess is that Boston is prime hunting ground for tax evaders, so best to not be on the wrong side of that one!!