How large of a yacht can I afford?

[Stewie12]

Marina fees are going to be your biggest expense.

[barnakiel]

4 skilled people can easily manage a 100ft boat.


Extra crew cost 1-2k each - depending on where you are and how tax is paid.


Please note however, that a pro captain will ask about 100k a year in a 100ft boat.


My friend is a yacht captain in the Med, his boat is 120ft and he has 2 permanent crew and 2 extras (a chef and a host - when the owners are onboard). Total 5 crew by 4 family of owners and occasional guests.



The boat is like new but not new. Last time they were in a boatyard (they have 1 small haulout every 2 yeras and a big one every 6 years) they burned over 100k in maintenance fees. and it was the 'small' haulout. Med prices.


Relationship between size and cost is liquid, but it exists. It is very very important where the boat is located and cruised as some places are very posh while others are way less expensive.


b.

[garychurch]

My wife and I live aboard a Class A 2002 64' Grand Banks Aleutian which we easily manage as crew. You can buy a used one of these or similar boats in good condition for about $1.5 million. It is literally a floating home with all of the amenities expected for long range cruising (2200 gals of diesel and a nominal range of 1500 nm, 1400 gallons per day water maker). The boat also has three en suite cabins and crew quarters with a wet head, but it is used as a workshop and storage area for parts. Operating expenses are about $50,000 to $75,000 per year.

Downsides are length and weight when considering mooring and dockage. Most moorings have size and weight limits, generally 50' in overall length. Most marinas can accommodate boats up to 50' in length maybe 55'. Boats of 64 feet and greater must take end or T-heads because of length. Dailey marina dockage runs from $1 to $4 per foot per night. Long term can run from $1000 per month the US to $3500 per month outside the US (Caribbean Grenada Port Louis - $2200 for dockage, $1000 for electricity and $300 for water per month).

Boat is too large to do the Loop but can easily do the other areas you want to visit. Nordhavn, Grand Banks, Outer Reef, Fleming, Marlow, Alaskan, Endurance, are all comfortable long range cruisers and have boats in the 60' - 70' range which I believe could meet you"r needs. As mentioned smaller is generally better if it can meet your needs a boat in the 50 - 60' range would be less expensive and less demanding for a family crew.

[dannc]

As part of your boat education, I would highly recommend Morgan's Cloud, https://www.morganscloud.com/, while it is very sail boat focused, there is much on the website that covers trawlers. You do have to pay for the website but it is well worth the money.

One of the often ask questions is how much is going to cost to maintain a boat. The usual, often repeated number, is 10%. But is that 10% of the cost of a used boat or a new boat? If the price of a used boat, what is the condition of the boat? But one also has to define the meaning of maintain...

Morgan's Cloud has a spread sheet for boat expenses, https://www.morganscloud.com/2014/07...ging-sailboat/. Basically, it gets down to displacement, complexity of the boat systems, miles sailed and how much work you will do yourself, etc.

It is based on North American costs and only for maintaining the boat. It the cost does not include fuel, dockage, food, etc.

From the spreadsheet for a 53 foot sailboat of 44,000 pounds, a complexity of 3 out of 4, four being most complex, where most of the work is done by the owner, that is sailed 4,000 miles a years the expense to maintain the boat would be $15,000.

The Trawler Forum(TF), https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/ is more focused on trawlers that Cruising Forum. if you start digging into trawler specific information TF will be more helpful.

Later,
Dan

[jim King]

It would be a great idea for you and your family to do a crewed charter somewhere like in the BVI on a 52' catamaran. It will give you a feel for the size and lifestyle you might like in the future. A typical crewed 52' cat will come with captain and cook. The captain may also give you a chance to take the helm while out to get some experience and feel for this size cat. If you drop down to a 45' cat the cost is about half or less than the 52' but the amenities and space are also less. I also suggest you first take some classes up to and including bare boat and then purchase a smaller (30 -35') to get some experience sailing. With the income stream you mentioned you can buy and crew a much larger boat, but you may find a smaller cat to have all the space and comforts you need.

[joelhemington]

Originally Posted by Mountain sailor

First let me say that this is mostly a hypothetical question. My wife and I have recently become borderline obsessed with yachts and the live-aboard cruising lifestyle. We have a plan to, in 5-6 years, sell our house, our cars, and most of our possessions and take the kids to go cruising full time. We would homeschool (boatschool?) the boys and our first destination would be The Great Loop for a year or so. Then, we'd head off to the Bahamas, Caribbean, over to the West Coast and up to the PNW.

To my question: How much boat can we safely handle as a family of 4? Beyond that, what does it cost to have a permanent crew of 2? Do larger yachts get exponentially more expensive after going over a certain length, say 100' LOA or larger? We currently have a healthy income and my wife can work anywhere there is internet access. Just looking for some thoughts and experiences from other owners who cruise the larger yachts whether crewed or not.

A mid sized catamaran (40' to 45') would easily accommodate a family of four. You don't say how old your kids will be but a boat this size wouldn't need to hire a crew. You and your wife could do it with maybe some help from the kids if they're old enough (something to keep them busy). You'd be looking at $200,000 to $500,000 for something under twenty years in almost cruise ready condition. You don't want anything that is so big you'll need a crew as they're a hassle to park and maintenance would be astronomic. Figure about 10% of boat value a year for ongoing maintenance on a medium sized cat, plus your monthly living expenses which often can be in the $2,000 a month range depending on how frugal you are - some people blow much more.

[Cadence]

How deep are your pockets. You said hypothetical. I would think 50' +/- would suit you well. 100' I hope you have billions.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Cadence

. . .100' I hope you have billions.

You don't need billions, but you would want to be at least some significant part of a centimillionaire. You might spend half a million a year on the boat, which is one percent of $50 million. This would be a questionably wise expenditure if you are worth much less than that.

[seabear2]

check out this forum of a couple who did what you described but they didn't do the loop they did the southern Caribbean. Interestingly the boat they used was "Loop" capable. It was a Sea Ray 480 Motoryacht. You need something that draws less than 5ft and is less than 17ft tall to do the loop. The SR 480MY fits the bill. Of course the loop is going to cost but cruising at 8knots is cheap with a fuel burn of about 1.2 NM/Gal. After you do the loop you could then continue on to the Caribbean and when you want to shift over then go to a Leopard 50 or something that will give you the ability to go around the world. Lots of Sailing families out there. Doing power first and then shifting to sail might lower your insurance as well. Here is the website for Pilots Discretion. got to https://pilotsdiscretion.com


It is a good website since they cruised for a few years in the South and you can watch their boys grow up in the pics.

[Mountain sailor]

My boys will be 7 and 9 when we plan to do this in 5 years.

[mvweebles]

Originally Posted by Mountain sailor

My boys will be 7 and 9 when we plan to do this in 5 years.

What a great age to take kids on an extended adventure. It would reap benefits for their generation and their children's generation.

The dream will morph of course, but I hope it manages to survive, even if only a whisper.

Peter

[Fore and Aft]

Barnakiel you are not wrong about big bills on big boats. The owner of a 100 footer I was surveying casually passed me his yard bill while we were having a coffee. Talk about make me speechless and that was only a small maintenance schedule. Still he was not worried, heck when you are playing in those leagues money is not really an issue.
Cheers

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Mountain sailor

As for the crew, 2 would be ideal with one being the captain and the other handling cooking/cleaning/deckhand duties. See, I hate cooking and cleaning. Well, cleaning up after cooking to be more precise. Here on land, once every 2 weeks, we have a private chef come to our home and prepare a nice meal for our family and leave the kitchen spotless afterward. It's one of my favorite nights of the week because I can finally relax and enjoy quality time with my young family.

I feel, without a crew or some sort of "help" will have me running and maintaining the yacht like a full time job. I don't want that! I want to be swimming, snorkeling, SCUBA, exploring things on land and museums, hiking/biking, etc. Also, I will need to be homeschooling the kids as well during this time.

Sounds like you don't want to be a boater; instead you want to be chauffeured around on a boat that somebody else maintains. Nothing wrong with that, go for it... but I'd guess most in the the audience here aren't usually in that same ballpark.

You might also get well informed info from yachtforums.com. Lots of 100'+-owners with crews there...

-Chris

[Woodland Hills]

Once you get to 100’, the rule of thumb is $1000 a foot per year for a captain. My wife and live full time on a 70’ loa motoryacht which we run ourselves. Expenses vary from year to year, but our biggest hassle is that we sometimes find ourselves too big for the anchorage. Marina spaces are always to be found, just not at every marina and not at a reasonable price. However if you shop around you can find bargains: $600 a month in Jacksonville for example. We were going to spend the winter in Key West, but the monthly rate went up to $64 a foot so we will be in Marathon at $29/ft per month. We keep an old car in Florida so we will just drive to Key West if we want.

[Hesti]

If you are planning to do the big thing in 5 years, you can get something small now to gain some experience in the meantime. That is besides taking courses. 26 ft might be about right for a family with two small children.