When to tip your skipper

[jalmberg]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

BTW, if I received that kind of "advice" from a school, I'd cancel my course and find a different one.

This would be my advice. ASA courses - or any course that doesn’t include solo sailing — are wastes of time and money anyway.

Tips are just a symptom of a bigger problem.

Just my opinion…

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by Kd9truck

I tip in cash and am very generous…when I deem so.

This a firmly embedded part of the tipping culture. Do it in cash, so it's under the table and not taxed.


Excepting some garage sale profits, or a $100 side engineering job I did a few decades ago, I have had 100% of my lifetime earnings reported to the IRS, and paid taxes on them.


Why should tips, a bona fide income stream, be exempt from taxes? And why would any hard working tax paying citizen enable others to avoid their share of the tax burden?

[trswem]

Originally Posted by lestersails

*It would be helpful to know if the company's written material state that tipping is common only for the liveaboard course or if that is a general statement made for all the courses - liveaboard and non-liveaboard courses.

It was listed in a FAQ section. They did not provide a suggestion of tipping in any of their class materials, I had to go seek it out. They very clearly stated that a tip was not expected, but that it's a common question they receive. I know a classmate did not tip, zero problem. At no point did the instructor "provide" an opportunity to give the tip either, I had to go catch him in the parking lot and he was very appreciative. There are no single day classes, these are all the "liveaboard" type where your instructor is basically also your charter captain.

[merrydolphin]

As a US Sailing Cruising Instructor, I have certified many hundreds of sailors. I/we feel than in instructional environment, tipping is not professional nor necessary. My biggest reward is when I see one of my students sail their own boat into a foreign port far away from home. That’s a thanks that is priceless. I remember once while on my boat in La Paz, Mexico seeing a familiar looking boat coming into port. They were a legally blind couple on their way to the South Pacific. Several instructors and I trained them to do so. Yes, they made it to the South Pacific! That’s an award / tip that I’ll take.

Just chartering, absolutely tip. I also worked in the charter trade a number of years. Tipping there is very common and 15% not unusual for a really successful charter. Professional Instructing, especially involving certification or credit, No. Not appropriate.

[merrydolphin]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

You seriously tip your instructor, or as instructors, accept tips?!? Isn’t that a rather direct and obvious conflict of interest? I mean, doesn’t the instructor also oversee the final exam in these courses, and determines who passes and who fails? I get why you would tip a charter captain, but an instructor? … worss, your instructor … just sounds wrong.

When I took my various cruising courses through Canadian schools there was neither the expectation, nor the slightest hint, that one should slip the instructor a $50. In fact, I suspect if I’d tried to do so, it would have been rejected, and perhaps been grounds for failure. And yes, all these courses were week-long liveaboards.

As a US Sailing instructor, I totally agree. It’s not professional, necessary nor appropriate to tip in a certificated course at any phase. A purely pleasure charter? Of course. But not instruction. Now I have taught many persons informally, privately and not in any certifying manor nor part of any Formal program or organization….. sure! And remember, if you are being compensated in any way, you should have professional credentials, eg Captains Licence / Masters certificate. Of course this is a prerequisite for any sailing school or certifying organization.

[Akafred]

Originally Posted by trswem

Hey all. I’m taking an ASA 101 course this weekend, where we stay out overnight in an anchorage. Food and drink are also provided. The materials I received from the school advise that a tip is common though not mandatory. When’s the best time to give the tip? Slipping a $50 into his hand while we exit the boat seems a little tacky, is there a procedure for this?

I’m not sure about tipping a sailing instructor but as a charter captain I definitely appreciate a tip from clients. It’s not required but it’s definitely appreciated.

Chartering a boat can be pretty competitive so many companies use booking companies to reach customers. This means the price you pay is not what the boat captain is paid. We all know how expensive it can be to properly maintain a boat and every bit helps. So tipping is not required but greatly appreciated along with a good review if appropriate.

Fair Winds!

[Peeew]

I have worked as a charter captain and instructor for a few years, mainly in the Bahamas. And whether we all like it or not tipping is a usual consideration for a charter captain there. Although we might be giving instruction to one or two of those on the trip there are mostly vacation guests on board for the week or so of the trip. A search of common charter captain tip will show that 10-20% of the charter fee is the usual range. This usually does vary quite a bit by nationality of the guests and what is common where they are from. The Company I worked with had the suggested amounts in the offering website. I know of some companies that explain that the tip is “expected” and remind guests to bring cash a week or so before the trip starts. I wish that this weren’t so, but in some parts of the world it is the way it is done. I do feel that if the tip is substantially below the norm it is good practice to explain to the captain where he/she fell short.

[Giro]

I consider a commercial boat or ship’s captain to be a professional.
Do you tip your medical doctor, dentist, lawyer, college professor or elementary or high school teacher?

[FoxIslander]

Im a UK expat living in Mexico...tipping here has generally been 10%....but US tipping culture is making inroads. Last Dec. I was visiting my son in Seattle...craft brew places give you 3 options with your credit card...20...30...or 40% tip. This is completely out of control. FFS.

[5BTM]

Originally Posted by FoxIslander

Im a UK expat living in Mexico...tipping here has generally been 10%....but US tipping culture is making inroads. Last Dec. I was visiting my son in Seattle...craft brew places give you 3 options with your credit card...20...30...or 40% tip. This is completely out of control. FFS.

My wife told me about the 20, 30 40 option, in Portland, Maine.
Left 10%, told them to go pound salt.

Thank god Europe is only a seven hour flight away; real food, real service and real culture.

[trswem]

Originally Posted by Giro

I consider a commercial boat or ship’s captain to be a professional.
Do you tip your medical doctor, dentist, lawyer, college professor or elementary or high school teacher?

This is a poor analogy. Say you hired a tutor for your child from 9-5. Then that tutor cleaned your house and made you dinner and answered your questions till 10pm, would you really be so hesitant to give them a little something on top of the agreed upon rate?

[Mike OReilly]

I really hope people can appreciate the fundamental conflict-of-interest around a student “tipping” their instructor. Lester raises the interesting point that there are “charter” duties included in this course. This complicates the situation. Maybe the OP’s course is some odd (to my view) hybrid of sailing training and vacationing. If so, then a tip is slightly more reasonable — although it still doesn’t change the fundamental conflict-of-interest. And if this was a cruising courses, then the non-sailing time is still part of the education package. It’s all part of leaning to cruise.

We’ve heard people discuss the wonderful service of both the instruction, and the non-instruction liveaboard aspects. But good instruction is what any student should expect. As for the liveaboard aspects, these should be part of any cruising course. As we all know, sailing is only part of the skills needed to be a cruiser. So all the other stuff is still part of a cruising course. And yes, if food is supplied, this cost should be incorporated into the price of the course.

The broader issue around the expansion of the “tipping culture” is the backdrop to this whole discussion. It’s not happening by accident. It’s happening because it benefits businesses and corporations. It’s all part of the push to diminish the responsibility of employers towards their employees. Lets be clear, it’s generally a terrible way to compensate workers (and here I can cue the “it was great for me” anecdotes). It’s been studied. It’s not good.

So yes, any expansion of “tipping” should be resisted.

* I keep putting “tip” or “tipping” in quotes because we’re generally not talking about an actual tip. Tipping culture is about shifting the financial burden of workers direcly onto cusomers. In most cases, these are not tips. These are part of the necessary wages of most of these workers. It is a direct result of workers being underpaid.

[trswem]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Maybe the OP’s course is some odd (to my view) hybrid of sailing training and vacationing. If so, then a tip is slightly more reasonable

That's exactly what this is, and it's not odd at all. It's extremely common, I'm aware of facilities like this in most major cruising destinations.

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

although it still doesn’t change the fundamental conflict-of-interest. And if this was a cruising courses, then the non-sailing time is still part of the education package. It’s all part of leaning to cruise.

ASA 101 is not a cruising course. And if anyone needs to tip their instructor to pass 101 then there is a much larger issue. Does anyone actually consider this ASA courses high stakes enough to need to bribe their instructor? Come on...

[SailingHarmonie]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I really hope people can appreciate the fundamental conflict-of-interest around a student “tipping” their instructor. Lester raises the interesting point that there are “charter” duties included in this course. This complicates the situation. Maybe the OP’s course is some odd (to my view) hybrid of sailing training and vacationing. If so, then a tip is slightly more reasonable — although it still doesn’t change the fundamental conflict-of-interest. And if this was a cruising courses, then the non-sailing time is still part of the education package. It’s all part of leaning to cruise.

We’ve heard people discuss the wonderful service of both the instruction, and the non-instruction liveaboard aspects. But good instruction is what any student should expect. As for the liveaboard aspects, these should be part of any cruising course. As we all know, sailing is only part of the skills needed to be a cruiser. So all the other stuff is still part of a cruising course. And yes, if food is supplied, this cost should be incorporated into the price of the course.

The broader issue around the expansion of the “tipping culture” the backdrop to this whole discussion. It’s not happening by accident. It’s happening because it benefits businesses and corporations. It’s all part of the push to diminish the responsibility of employers towards their employees. Lets be clear, it’s generally a terrible way to compensate workers (and here I can cue the “it was great for me” anecdotes). It’s been studied. It’s not good.

So yes, any expansion of “tipping” should be resisted.

* I keep putting “tip” or “tipping” in quotes because we’re generally not talking about an actual tip. Tipping culture is about shifting the financial burden of workers direcly onto cusomers. In most cases, these are not tips. These are part of the necessary wages of most of these workers. It is a direct result of workers being underpaid.

So resist. Don’t tip. Take a stand. Don’t let yourself be shamed into it! But really, you just sound curmudgeonly about it.

But…. When I travel to most countries without what you call “a tipping culture” I get my dinner bill, and there is 15 or 18% added for a “service fee”. What is the practical difference except in the USA the tip is optional and discretionary…

When I get exceptional service from ANYBODY, I try to take notice of it. Maybe cash, maybe a bottle of wine, maybe a box of pastries for a group effort. The kind of gift will very much depend on the local culture.

And a story… about 10 years ago I lived in crazy Berkeley California. A place very much fond of claiming themselves all in favor of a living wage.

A local, very popular, pizza place decided to implement a total no tipping policy, and guaranteed to pay all employees a real living wage. A very nobel stance to be sure. Of course prices on the menu had to go up about 20% to do this. They made a very big deal about how well they were treating their employees. Which they really were trying to do. Two weeks after this policy started, we went there for dinner on a Saturday night. Instead of a line for a table the place was empty.

All those people who would talk a talk about living wages and the terrible wage slavery of the “tipping culture” stayed away because it was now “too expensive”. Just a bunch of hypocrites more interested in their own wallets than actually helping change anything.

[lestersails]

Originally Posted by Giro

I consider a commercial boat or ship’s captain to be a professional.
Do you tip your medical doctor, dentist, lawyer, college professor or elementary or high school teacher?

Topic drift, but reminds me of a story. I met a professional colleague at a scientific meeting. She mentioned that her son was off to a year long course in the DC area. We have long had the honor and pleasure of offering a free room (and some board) to young people studying or interning in the area. It is very expensive to live in our area. So, he came to live with us for a year. Not the greatest boarder but overall a pretty nice kid. At the end of his year, mom came to visit for a weekend and we offered for her to stay in another empty room. She brought a little gift for us, which was fine.
But when she left (flew out very early Monday morning) we got up to find a $50 bill on the kitchen table.
I thought that was deeply, deeply insulting. Long way 'round of saying that I agree with you - when one is not in a hospitality/service role, tipping can be insulting.