Composting head?

[Kettlewell]

As for cleanup, it's no different from any bowl. If need be, spritz a little water, and wipe.

We use a spray bottle with white vinegar in it. I keep it right next to the head.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

We use a spray bottle with white vinegar in it. I keep it right next to the head.

Yup, whatever works. We spritz with water after urinating, so it's there if further cleaning is needed. This keeps things clean and fresh.

[dlj]

Originally Posted by Kettlewell

We use a spray bottle with white vinegar in it. I keep it right next to the head.

I've been using a product called Bio-enzymatic Urine Digester. Works very well and has a very pleasant odor as well as keeping the head smelling fresh.

dj

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by dlj

I've been using a product called Bio-enzymatic Urine Digester. Works very well and has a very pleasant odor as well as keeping the head smelling fresh.

dj

I’ve never tried this product, but I have used various other methods. In the end, I just found that a simple water spritz does just as good a job.

There is no odour at all when the head is operating. The only time there is a smell is when the bottle is being dumped, but that only lasts a few seconds, so doesn’t seem to be a big deal.

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

We use coco coir bricks and need to keep quite a bit aboard as we head south from Baja which takes up much of the space the holding tank used to occupy.

We have an electric jabsco. It just works, no worries. But every time I hear one of these threads raving about how good composting toilets are, I have a little FOMO (fear of missing out). I think if I were making a choice from scratch, I would likely go with one, but inertia keeps the one I have here.

But this quote is a thought I hadn't considered. We've had a few lengthy journeys through relatively uninhabited land. Each day is a new place, and even buying bread can sometimes be hard. With a wet system, it's easy - send to the holding tank continuously, and every day or so when on transit pump overboard. And when offshore, direct discharge, although I have yet to do that on this boat.

But how does one deal with consumables for the composting heads? Last summer for instance we went 4 months. How big a pile of supplies is that? And if you run out, can you find that in a small town? And are there less than ideal but readily available alternatives -- kitty litter for instance?

[Seabeau]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

We have an electric jabsco. It just works, no worries. But every time I hear one of these threads raving about how good composting toilets are, I have a little FOMO (fear of missing out). I think if I were making a choice from scratch, I would likely go with one, but inertia keeps the one I have here.

But this quote is a thought I hadn't considered. We've had a few lengthy journeys through relatively uninhabited land. Each day is a new place, and even buying bread can sometimes be hard. With a wet system, it's easy - send to the holding tank continuously, and every day or so when on transit pump overboard. And when offshore, direct discharge, although I have yet to do that on this boat.

But how does one deal with consumables for the composting heads? Last summer for instance we went 4 months. How big a pile of supplies is that? And if you run out, can you find that in a small town? And are there less than ideal but readily available alternatives -- kitty litter for instance?

I use "Small Animal Bedding", (tiny cedar wood chips)from a variety of sources. A single compressed brick, approx 16"x8"x4" will last me almost an entire year.

[Mike OReilly]

I use approximately one coir brick per cycle, and each cycle runs about a month. Each brick measures about 2.3”x4.3”x8.1”. If I do the math right, that amounts to about 1/3 gallon. So… if it takes 12 bricks per year, that’s a volume of 4 gallons. To be safe, you could double that. As a comparison, my last holding tank was 35 gallons, so in this same space I could carry around four years of coir.

I’ve heard about people using other materials; everything from sawdust to dried leaves. But it’s hard to see how any cruising-level boat will struggle with carrying compressed coir bricks.

[Chotu]

I used peat moss. A bag of that lasted about a year if I am recalling correctly.

I think it’s anything nice and dry and absorbent that will work. Good info on the small animal shavings and I don’t see why kitty litter wouldn’t work either.

Just think really dry and absorbent material

[dlj]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I’ve never tried this product, but I have used various other methods. In the end, I just found that a simple water spritz does just as good a job.

There is no odour at all when the head is operating. The only time there is a smell is when the bottle is being dumped, but that only lasts a few seconds, so doesn’t seem to be a big deal.

I'll keep that in mind if I run out...

dj

[mvweebles]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

I use approximately one coir brick per cycle, and each cycle runs about a month. Each brick measures about 2.3”x4.3”x8.1”. If I do the math right, that amounts to about 1/3 gallon. So… if it takes 12 bricks per year, that’s a volume of 4 gallons. To be safe, you could double that. As a comparison, my last holding tank was 35 gallons, so in this same space I could carry around four years of coir.

I’ve heard about people using other materials; everything from sawdust to dried leaves. But it’s hard to see how any cruising-level boat will struggle with carrying compressed coir bricks.

For most, I agree that carrying sufficient coir isn't a huge barrier. For us, we're in Ensenada Baja MX headed south on an open ended cruise to Florida. Alternatives or coir itself is unlikely to be found in Mexico, El Salvador, Costa Rica, etc. Even in the San Diego area, best source of coir is Amazon (or Chewy), not a local store. And whatever medium is used, it must be kept dry - similar to how many food stores must be kept vs deep in a bilge where a holding tank resides. Even a small bale of peat moss isn't exactly easy to store, and is prone to harboring flies. Not impossible, but hardly a simple math calculation of volume.

In my opinion, the glowing accolades from compost head owners are a bit myopic. I get about 4-5-weeks between solids change if I'm alone, but add my wife and if gets to around 3-weeks. Sure if you use landside facilities, time between changes extends. But a case of diarrhea - not uncommon when traveling in Latin America - and the change could be a few days. Hot humid climates will change the dessication process and provide a more fertile environment for flies. I use around 1-1/2 bricks per change, so I'm carrying over $100 USD in coir bricks. Not the trivial exercise many extoll.

I'm a user of compost head and won't change. But I don't think the cheerleaders give a fully accurate portrayal of full time usage. There are some significant disadvantages to a compost head - the cheerleaders dismiss these with barely a mention. In my opinion, a bit rose-colored-glasses.

[Fore and Aft]

Another issue I faced when sailing with family on a friend's yacht was the young kids using the toilet. It seemed everytime they went to the toilet I had to check the bowl was clean after them. I am a bit squeamish so the whole "spritzing/wiping" while on an angle sailing wore thin pretty quick.
No dramas with the electric jabby, just push the button until the bowl is clean. Never a blockage either, wipe and flush are easy instructions for kids.
Cheers

[dlj]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

For most, I agree that carrying sufficient coir isn't a huge barrier. For us, we're in Ensenada Baja MX headed south on an open ended cruise to Florida. Alternatives or coir itself is unlikely to be found in Mexico, El Salvador, Costa Rica, etc. Even in the San Diego area, best source of coir is Amazon (or Chewy), not a local store. And whatever medium is used, it must be kept dry - similar to how many food stores must be kept vs deep in a bilge where a holding tank resides. Even a small bale of peat moss isn't exactly easy to store, and is prone to harboring flies. Not impossible, but hardly a simple math calculation of volume.

In my opinion, the glowing accolades from compost head owners are a bit myopic. I get about 4-5-weeks between solids change if I'm alone, but add my wife and if gets to around 3-weeks. Sure if you use landside facilities, time between changes extends. But a case of diarrhea - not uncommon when traveling in Latin America - and the change could be a few days. Hot humid climates will change the dessication process and provide a more fertile environment for flies. I use around 1-1/2 bricks per change, so I'm carrying over $100 USD in coir bricks. Not the trivial exercise many extoll.

I'm a user of compost head and won't change. But I don't think the cheerleaders give a fully accurate portrayal of full time usage. There are some significant disadvantages to a compost head - the cheerleaders dismiss these with barely a mention. In my opinion, a bit rose-colored-glasses.

I try not to report through rose colored glasses as you suggest. I am a convert to composting heads, that is no question. I'll never go back to a standard marine head. But one of the main reasons for that is space. The amount of space gained by not having all the infrastructure required by standard heads is significant - of course, I'm not on a large boat. I also don't sail with a lot of crew.

I am very pleasantly surprised at the ease of use and maintenance, the lack of smell. In fact, I'd say my composting heads are far better in the lack of smell department than any standard marine head I've ever had.

Carrying enough supplies is not trivial as you say, but it is also not a big deal. If you know where you are going and approximately for how long, I think pretty much any boat can carry enough supplies without great compromises.

I've only sailed with kids once, and that was for such a short time I've no opinion on that.

I think the biggest thing that causes the proponents of the composting heads to talk more about their advantages than disadvantages is the fact that these threads seem to bring out the extreme "haters" that frankly seem to be completely off base.

Composting heads are for small crews. They work very well in smaller boats, larger boats may not care about the infrastructure needs that smaller boats care about. I feel the "care and feeding" of all systems have good and bad aspects. It also depends upon the persons using the system. All of the marine head systems work, well for the most part. Composting heads are an excellent option for some, not for others.

dj

[Mike OReilly]

mvweebles, I have always told it as my now over a decade of experience shows. In many cases I've discussed the challenges and negatives. I've iterated the pros AND cons of these heads, and I constantly warn people that these heads are not for everyone.

Based on over a decade of use we get three to five weeks per cycle, and use approximately one brick of coir. Sometimes it is more, sometimes less. Outflows are not constant, but over time the averages show the truth. Of course, your mileage may vary, but my experience is with two adults, full-time, seasonal cruising.

Again, if you read the posts you will see that my storage calculation you reference was in response to a previous poster who was making the comparison to holding tank sizes, suggesting the volumes were prohibitive. As always, I prefer actual data, not speculation, so I did the math, and used the same comparison.

I'd be happy to discuss ideas about storage. I always buy in bulk, and then store the bricks in sealed plastic bags. I've never had a problem with moisture, or stocking enough. On my modest boat I most recently stocked coir for approximately 12 months of continual use. It was easy to find here in Canada. I've never claimed to be anywhere than where I am; not in Mexico, not in South America. Perhaps you could share how you source yours.

F&A: I've almost no experience with children on board (only one, many years ago, with no problem). I know Nature's Head is configured for the typical adult anatomy, so I can see where small people might not -- fit. It's definitely a worthy discussion for those with young families.

The squeamish thing is very real, which is why I always say (as a warning) that you have to be "slightly more intimate with your outflows." If this is a problem, these heads are not for you.

(BTW, I just searched "Mexico coir" and came up with numerous sources, right on the front page).

[mvweebles]

The haters that pop-up regularly on compost head threads definitely distract from a thorough discussion. It's too bad because with a certain use-case, the compost head is an excellent choice. What's mildly ironic is the main challenges of them are not the issues the anti-bodies cite.

Mike O, without a doubt you are the best source of info on CF for compost heads, and you've done a good job being balanced. And I thank you for it. You frequently say a compost head means the owner will be a bit more intimate with the septic process which of course is true. From the bleachers, issue is just being in proximity of the soils but in reality, quickly overcome. To me, there are other considerations including process of converting a brick into a usable medium, then bagging the used medium. While clean-up isn't an odeous process, it does take a bit of time and prep. Sure, it compares to going to a pump-out, but it's different. It's not a slam-dunk decision predicated on getting past the ick-factor.

[Franziska]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

We have an electric jabsco. It just works, no worries. But every time I hear one of these threads raving about how good composting toilets are, I have a little FOMO (fear of missing out). I think if I were making a choice from scratch, I would likely go with one, but inertia keeps the one I have here.

But this quote is a thought I hadn't considered. We've had a few lengthy journeys through relatively uninhabited land. Each day is a new place, and even buying bread can sometimes be hard. With a wet system, it's easy - send to the holding tank continuously, and every day or so when on transit pump overboard. And when offshore, direct discharge, although I have yet to do that on this boat.

But how does one deal with consumables for the composting heads? Last summer for instance we went 4 months. How big a pile of supplies is that? And if you run out, can you find that in a small town? And are there less than ideal but readily available alternatives -- kitty litter for instance?

Sure cat litter works, it's just a bit heavy, more expensive and takes more space.

We use compressed wood shavings which we uncompress by hand before using them.