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anjou · 04-10-2009, 03:18

My opinion is . forget it. Its not a seriously viable proposition and is sure to be very energy thirsty. Not sure how it will work in a very salty environment and who wants to be a guinnee pig anyway?

hmmm · 04-10-2009, 05:13

Yes it's true the units available right now use to much energy.
The 'windmill' on the other hand is running on wind energy alone. In his design, moisture-laden air enters the system and is cooled by a drop in pressure behind the wind turbine blades. The air then flows into a chamber containing refrigerated metal plates covered by a non-wettable surface that causes water droplets to run off immediately into a collection point. He also uses a scroll refrigerant compressor. Apparently the prototype use solar panels also to run the compressor and keep the plates cool. the guinnee pig situation is not a problem. i volunteer any day if i get the unit for free to review.

Time will tell

Yachts66 · 04-10-2009, 08:33

Dehumidifier on a pole!

No problem with the concept, I run a dehumidifier in my boat and produce about 7 liters of water a day. It runs on 110V, works well....7,500l?? Kinda hard to believe. There's no rocket science here, no magic. It's all about watts. A dehumidifier that can generate 7,500l has got to use a lot of watts, ya' know? I've been looking at this wind generator:

HTML Code:

http://www.tlgwindpower.com/videos/tlg500_main.htm

and it looked interesting until the company advised me they don't like to sell the 24v version because it requires so much more wind speed to work well. It's also not marineized. Back to the drawing board on that one. So I think a unit capable of producing that much water would only be suitable for ships or mega mega yachts, which for sure leaves me out.

I liked the discussion of bronze/brass/stainless pumps. Good information there. I was disappointed no one included ceramic pumps. I kinda figured they would be the solution for salt water. What about that George? You know more about it than I probably ever will.

As for power source I like the idea of using an electric motor over belt driven. Belts and I never seem to get along very well. The problem I'm having is finding a decent sized 24V motor for my unit as I'd like to be able to keep up with Rich Boren (of SV Third Day fame) in the water making department. Sadly it seems to do that I will be forced to use an AC motor. If anyone has a different view, I'd certainly appreciate hearing it.

Regards,

Thomas

hmmm · 04-10-2009, 12:48

Finally, I think I found the solution to make my freshwater. It is a German product its low tech cheap and available right now. With some small basic plumbing mortification to fill and empty them automatic all connected with pipes I can see it work fine for multi hulls and anchor. Some wind proofing would also be required. Of course the purists will be horrified by the look of the boot being covered by 12 plastic cones 60cm in diameter. Personally with the unconventional look I can manage, carrying 20 litres of water per day or run a generator is not an option for me.
Also nothing to break so excellent for an emergency situation.

Watercone® The Product

thatboatguy · 04-10-2009, 13:06

Take an ordinary black plastic oil drain pan, cut a slightly larger round piece of clear vinyl, cut the from edge of vinyl to center so you can form a slight cone shape. Place an empty (washed out) tuna tin in the center of the drain pan, weighted so it won't float, and fill the drain pan with about an inch of sea water. Place the vinyl cone point down. Place in sunshine. Tada! Solar watermaker.

I have an even simpler design for a solar cloths dryer if anyone is interested.

So anyway my point is that it's more complicated to use wind to operate refrigeration than it is to concentrate sunshine to make heat. Either can be used for a condensation style watermaker.

George

Yachts66 · 04-10-2009, 13:09

Cute, but at only 1 liter of water per day per cone it seems more a survival tool than anything else. Ironically I know the guy who invented the solar still in the desert of Arizona (Dr. Ray Jackson of the US Soil Conservation Service), that too a survival device. This discussion has been centered more on making quantities of water needed for everyday living, which far exceed survival quantities. My view anyway.

Regards,

Thomas

thatboatguy · 04-10-2009, 13:21

Strictly conceptual. But if you build a trough reflector you could produce more. Perhaps enough for the 7 liter per day faction. I am very happy with my 50 gallon per hour output and I don't see an evaporator unit that would fit on our boat producing that kind of quantity. So point taken.

George

hmmm · 04-10-2009, 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bradley

Does anyone know of good plans for building a 12 volt watermaker?

the very first post. as every one knows a 12 volt watermaker wont make large quantities of water. 12 cones each 1.7 liters max is more than 20 liters a day which is fine for my needs.

**Tellie** · 04-10-2009, 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by hmmm

the very first post. as every one knows a 12 volt watermaker wont make large quantities of water. 12 cones each 1.7 liters max is more than 20 liters a day which is fine for my needs.

I'll stack a smaller 12V watermaker up against your 12 solar stills any day. Hmmm, solar stills like the cone have been around for years. As stated previously they are really meant for survival situations not for a reliable source of water on a boat. In the short and long term you are not going to be happy with 12 cones and your neighbors are going to think you've had a Martian invasion on your deck. Sooner or later you'll buy or build a RO system if you really want your boat to be off the grid. The cone money is better spent towards that goal.

hellosailor · 04-10-2009, 17:52

Anjou-
" Im thinking of a truck starter motor " Starter motors are generally what are called "high impulse power" motors. That is, they are designed to provide great power for very limited periods of time. For a starter motor, typically 5-10 seconds of operation followed by at least a half hour cooling down, more often longer periods between uses. And in fact, if you use a starter motor for as little as one full minute without a cool-down, it will swell up and expand enough from internal heating that it grinds itself apart in short order. Typically they are rated for 15-30 seconds of use followed by 15-20 minutes of cool-down, depending on the ambient temperature. Better to find a motor designed for continuous use, not a starter motor.
You might think this "problem" with starter motors is a sign of bad design, but rather, it is a design tailored to the purpose of impulse power. They use tight tolerances and allow for heating because it makes a much more powerful and less expensive motor in a smaller package, and that's right for the job.

Yachts66 · 04-10-2009, 17:55

To each his own of course, but I seriously doubt those cones would work at sea. They were designed to sit on flat ground not rolling oceans. They might work ok in a calm anchorage, but at sea? I don't think so.

Fully concur about the starter motor comments. Bad idea bound to fail. That said, sure do wish someone made more powerful 24V motors. They would be useful.

Regards,

Thomas

thatboatguy · 05-10-2009, 05:55

You know, for light usage the windshield wiper motor and the military surplus katydyn might be do-able. So much so that I might have to experiment. Or for that matter if you are only after 7 liters per day just spend the time cranking it by hand. It could have a good secondary workout effect for bust improvement as well....

George

**Tellie** · 05-10-2009, 06:41

Starter and windshield wiper motors, used Katadyn military surplus, bags of water hoisted up a mast and connecting membranes to a tread mill. I have to start a Rube Goldberg collection of all the ways folks try to re-invent a watermaker. With all due respect and not trying to poke fun at anybody because some day some one will figure out a new way. Making your own watermaker is a doable project. It's been done many times. But, in my experience those who go it alone end up with a project that has taken more money than originally expected and far more time than they ever envisioned. Many have ended up with a watermaker they're not as happy with as they first hoped they would be. When all is added up they wonder to themselves why they just didn't buy one in the first place. For every successful home built watermaker project there are many more that never got completed, many more that were ripped out, many more that were parted out and sold on E-Bay. Mistakes on the path to making your own can be very costly. I have an old crate in the shop marked "This didn't work so well either" full of project parts from home built watermakers. RO is not rocket surgery, but as I tell many people, there is a learning curve. Trying the above ideas is a sure way to start throwing dollars away. My advice would first be to search the few successful home built projects on the net. Buy the few plans available, they're very very inexpensive, there's always one on E-Bay. Study them and ask questions, not just from home builders but from the different watermaker dealers as well. You'd be surprised how much we'll open up and help you if you decided to go forward

thatboatguy · 05-10-2009, 07:36

Admission time... I did everything Tellie recomended before striking out on my own. I also serviced and installed multiple commercial units and had at my beck and call a guy who designed large commercial units (such as the one at Atlantis Resort in the Bahamas) on speed dial. But the pay off is pretty nice. I love kicking ideas around and experimenting but the truism still holds that you can't take chicken poop and mayonais and make chicken salad.

Never heard of the hoisting the bag up the mast one Tellie! My personal favorite is the tow behind the boat shark bait one.

George