Problems with Jabsco Anti-Syphon Valve

[DeepFrz]

Straight from the head mistresses keypad:

*Toilets designed to use fresh water use* less of it...use less power...and are MUCH quieter than toilets designed to use sea water.* And, fresh water eliminates sea water odor problems.*

However, you cannot just decide to connect a sea water toilet to the onboard fresh water supply. That cannot be done without risk of e-coli contamination of the fresh water, damage to the toilet, or both and EVERY toilet mfr specifically warns against it in their installation instructions.* ONLY toilets that are designed by the mfr to use pressurized flush water should ever be connected to the fresh water supply.* If you have a sea water toilet and don't want to replace it, your only option is a water tank that's totally separate from the fresh water system,* including the tank vent and fill.

Fwiw, I highly recommend the Raritan Elegance* Raritan Elegance toilet ...as does everyone who owns one!

[banjoship]

Originally Posted by cat man do

Yes I do, I was searching for info on a solenoid valve for a Jabsco toilet and this post came up.

It made me call the supplier and ask whether mine could take salt water and the supplier seemed to think that was a pretty bloody stupid question, which is why I asked how does the toilet know.

The reason I asked about the solenoid is because the Jabsco ones are $100+
Irrigation ones are considerable cheaper
Electric solenoid for water

The fresh water ones you example are normally closed, open on application of current. Exactly the reverse of what you want on an electrically operated siphon break.

Lee

[cat man do]

Thanks for the replies.
My next question would be why do I even need a syphon break solenoid or vented loop?
I never had one on my last boat so why now?
Water level in toilet bottom will be approx DWL outside

This from Charles E Kanter on marine toilets

[banjoship]

oops, just realised you may have a fresh water toilet, in which case the solenoid is to isolate the fresh water supply, not act as a siphon break, and normally closed is what is needed for that purpose. I am guessing the lever is backup shutoff in case the solenoid fails to close??

Lee

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by banjoship

oops, just realised you may have a fresh water toilet, in which case the solenoid is to isolate the fresh water supply, not act as a siphon break, and normally closed is what is needed for that purpose.

I have BOTH fresh and salt apparently
From the advertisment

Jabsco Electric Macerator Toilet comes complete with electric pump and solenoid valve for plumbing.
This Toilet has a full size vitreous china bowl and a two pack toilet seat to suit 12volt system.
Ex showroom display stock

DELUXE FLUSH ELECTRIC TOILET Sea or river water flush models, 12 volt dc
Vertical back for snug fitting against a vertical bulkhead.

Connections: - for 19mm ( ¾”) bore inlet hose, 38mm (1½“) bore discharge hose
Dimensions: – 445mm high, 375mm wide, 450mm long
Fuse Size: - 25 amp
Elegant bowl styling conceals all plumbing and wiring
Quiet-flush cycle – like a household toilet. Water usage as low as 1 litre per flush
White vitreous china bowl
Use any remote-mounted automatic pressurised water pump for flushing. Pump must deliver at least 11 litres/minute.
Supplied with PAR-MAX 2.9 flush pump for remote mounting.
Owner selectable choice of leaving bowl wet or dry after use.
Regular household size seat.
Can use salt or fresh water to flush
Uses less than 1 amp/hr per day
Packaged Dimensions: L:58.00 x H:63.00 x W:50.00cm
Actual Weight: 26.00 Kg (Approx. 28.00 Kg packed)

I am guessing the lever is backup shutoff in case the solenoid fails to close??

Lee

I dont think so, but I am also guessing.

[DeepFrz]

I think the key to that add. is "Sea or River" water. They aren't talking about pressure water from your fresh water supply.

[banjoship]

I am not at all familiar with this Jabsco toilet and will withdraw from further comment...lol. However:

The instructions for the system you appear to be looking at, I think are here, as clear as mud:
http://www.xylemflowcontrol.com/files/itemdoc1441.pdf

The system is designed to run off pressurized water at all times. That water to be drawn from sea/river/lake/ships potable water supply, whatever. (The pump supplied with the package is to pressurise sea/river water, if that is the source

The valve you showed first up, is apparently a combination shutoff valve and syphon break. The shutoff valve is to protect backflow to the water supply. I cannot work out what "circuit" the siphon break is breaking. The black lever looking thing appears to be actually the vent. The destructions indicate the possibility of leakage from the vent.

Over to you...let us know what you find out.

Lee

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by DeepFrz

I think the key to that add. is "Sea or River" water. They aren't talking about pressure water from your fresh water supply.

From what I can gather this has a "touch control panel" that allows me to select fresh or salt flush ( I saw the unit a month or two back but paid little attention due to its price then but it did have lots of buttons)

After speaking with the seller today I was thinking salt for say 20 flushes and flush 21 and 22 could be fresh so as to clean the pipes so to speak (apparently stink can come from salt water gremlins but never had a real issue on last boat?)
I was thinking fresh water could come from a 20 litre water container gravity fed sitting in a adjacent locker.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by banjoship

I am not at all familiar with this Jabsco toilet and will withdraw from further comment...lol. However:

The instructions for the system you appear to be looking at, I think are here, as clear as mud:
http://www.xylemflowcontrol.com/files/itemdoc1441.pdf

This is the unit and description of here
Jabsco Electric DELUXE FLUSH Macerator Toilet

Over to you...let us know what you find out.

Lee

Hopefully I will get more info on pickup

[bstreep]

Interesting, because we have the same toilets, but a different problem:

The solenoid doesn't always close, letting the toilets overflow! I've replaced the solenoid (at over $100), and still, every once in a while, it still overflows. Ugh.

[cat man do]

Originally Posted by bstreep

Interesting, because we have the same toilets, but a different problem:

The solenoid doesn't always close, letting the toilets overflow! I've replaced the solenoid (at over $100), and still, every once in a while, it still overflows. Ugh.

Picked mine up a few hours ago and the dealer said they have had vessels have the same issue.
Crud in the water making the solenoid sticky and stopping it
from closing he said.

Seems I dont need to have one in anyway , so I wont, one less thing to go wrong

From the manual (Available here)

Either Solenoid Valve
Jabsco solenoid valve and syphon breaker
assembly for connection to any existing
pressurised water system capable of delivering
2.9gpm (11 lpm) or more. The syphon breaker
ensures that there is no backflow from the toilet
into the water system.
Or Rinse pump
Jabsco, self-priming up to 3m (10ft), dry
running, diaphragm water pump driven by 12 or
24 Vdc, permanent magnet, ball bearing motor.

Mine came with a Par Max 4 pump

[US1Fountain]

To clear up some info here on that solenoid valve.

That 'lever' on the left is not a lever at all. Thats just the air vent. Nothing more than a plug with a hole that is retained in the body with a clip, same as the elbow barb on the right side which is the water inlet port. The large barb at the bottom is the connection for the toilet for the flush/fill hose.

Valve is normally closed, blocking water flow, while venting the outlet port to allow that hose to drain into the toilet when flush button is released. Thus the reason this valve is to mounted above toilet bowl.

The sea water model uses a dedicated pump to fill the toilet, pulling water from sea.
The fresh water model uses your boats water tank pump for it's supply source. The valve in it's closed state (unused toilet) keeps water from entering the toilet whenever another draw, (sink) has asked the pump to power up.