Blue Wave Dyneema Terninals vs. Splice

[JC Reefer]

Would be ideal for an emergency backup.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by fxykty

All the construction set is in the splice and bury, .

Just FYI - this is not actually correct.

There is ofc a lot of constructional stretch in a long bury splice.

But there is also measurable constructional stretch in the body of the line. This is true even with 'heat set' line, but ofc less than with non-heat set.

Just for example, in a recent sample of NER HSR, (with no splices) I had 20mm of stretch on the first pull, and 9mm of stretch the third pull (all over a 10' length of line). That would be a 'best case', with heat set line, which was very carefully handled. You can introduce significant extra 'constructional stretch' to heat set line when coiling and handling them.

Non-heat set line would have roughly 50% more constructional stretch than the above.

As to how to stretch line . . . 10 ton auto body shop hydraulic pullers are quite inexpensive

as to the Blue Wave terminals - I notice that their breaking strength is below that of the recommended heat set size line (and below that of a carefully done splice). Heat set line would typically be used for stay replacement rigging applications That would seem to be sub-optimal. I'm curious what breaks.

[guyrj33]

looks like a fancy thimble.
but also a very convenient way of reducing the number of parts needed to attach the rig, for example the T ball fitting.

[RGN]

I like them, a lot!



I suspect the lower than line strength is not actually the fitting but the hard, short radius bury required to fit into the fitting. I can see the line actually failing at that point long before the fitting or rest of line fails. Even the then the failure figure exceeds SS rigging wire it replaces.

[flyingnut40]

Following

[Breaking Waves]

as an FYI - I got this e-mail back when I asked them for information about buying a couple of samples:

"Thank you for your E-mail and kind interest in our RopeLine products/the Dyneema Rope Eye!

We do not have a dealer set up in the US, so I would suggest you contact our Canadian dealer either in Vancouver or Barrie (Toronto). Alternatively I can try to help from over here..

If you are willing to contact Canada, please try either at Western Marine Company in Vancouver: sales@westernmarine.com

Or at Transat Marine Company - maybe contact Emma Osborn eosborn@transatmarine.com

I know the colleagues in Canada will be able to help, but please let me know if you have any further questions!

Best regards from Denmark"

[witzgall]

Are these available in the US? The MFGs site is light on information abou these products - I cannot find an install sheet.

Chris

Originally Posted by thinwater

Better or worse, and why? They reduce construction stretch, but other than that, I'm not seeing it. It seems like there are areas I cannot inspect, for little up-side.

[Benz]

Since you have to do a splice anyway, it's just an expensive and complicated alternative to a thimble, which gives you a far worse bend radius.
I'm not a bend-radius nazi, but I like to keep it above 1:1. Even so, with the growing popularity of toggles (or "dogbones" as some wrongfully call them), we're seeing some tight bend radiuses around them as well as around halyard bullets and similar kit. Maybe the bend-radius debate should be revisited now that sk90 has been retired.
Still after that mini-ramble: I don't think these are better enough than a thimble to warrant what they must cost.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Benz

Since you have to do a splice anyway, it's just an expensive and complicated alternative to a thimble, which gives you a far worse bend radius.
I'm not a bend-radius nazi, but I like to keep it above 1:1. Even so, with the growing popularity of toggles (or "dogbones" as some wrongfully call them), we're seeing some tight bend radiuses around them as well as around halyard bullets and similar kit. Maybe the bend-radius debate should be revisited now that sk90 has been retired.
Still after that mini-ramble: I don't think these are better enough than a thimble to warrant what they must cost.

But isn't the point of these, as someone else commented above, to easily integrate rope rigging with already existing rigging screws, forks, eyes, etc. which were provided for wire rigging? Seems elegant to me; a thimble would't actually work without other hardware, for this purpose.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by JC Reefer

Would be ideal for an emergency backup.

Also this


Instead of carrying whole pieces of wire rigging, as many ocean sailors do, just carry a much lighter and more easily stored piece of Acera or Dyneema, and a set of these.


Like.

[MartinR]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

But isn't the point of these, as someone else commented above, to easily integrate rope rigging with already existing rigging screws, forks, eyes, etc. which were provided for wire rigging? Seems elegant to me; a thimble would't actually work without other hardware, for this purpose.

Yes, not easy to splice a line to my t-fittings or rigging screws. I have looked at these before, and they seem a much more elegant solution than Colligo. I still haven't figured out the sizing, though.

[MartinR]

Originally Posted by fxykty

Very cool terminators. You splice your UHMWPE around a bone, which has a diameter for example of 18mm for 10mm line. Any thoughts of throat tearing with that size of an eye and a throat that’s tight against the bone?

Unfortunately for our boat we will need 16 or 18mm fibre shrouds, and the threaded fitting is only up to 10mm. Sigh.

They write larger sizes on request.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by Benz

I'm not a bend-radius nazi, but I like to keep it above 1:1.

The bend radius seems to be about 1.8:1 (1.5:1 in the smallest size), which is sufficient inside a loop to keep 100% of line strength.

[KP44]

I find dyneema very easy to splice. No reason I can think of to add components that may fail.
No longer any need to carry spare shroud wire. I carry a length of dyneema that can easily replace a backstay or shroud. My backstays are strong enough to lift the boat.

[Breaking Waves]

Originally Posted by KP44

No longer any need to carry spare shroud wire.

The question in play here is not the value of dyneema, but how you plan to/how best to attach it to the chain plates and mast.

You certainly don’t want to splice it directly to most chainplates and tangs, which have holes with sharp edges and very small D/d. And even most U bolts and pad eyes would have quite small D/d.

Most typical thimbles would crush under shroud/stay tension - if going thimble you really need a closed or solid one.

These terminals provide an alternative. They are not ideal. But they are both versatile and simple.