Bronze turnbuckle failure.

[daletournier]

Has anyone had or heard of bronze turnbuckles failing?

I've just replaced the standing rigging and as I undid the turnbuckles there was a slight grinding feel and some bronze filings at the end. Most of the threads look ok to me.

Anyone had experience in this area? Can they, do they fail?

Cheers Dale.

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[JPA Cate]

Sounds to me that they needed lubing, and still do, perhaps cleaning up the threads with a die. I haven't heard of them failing, but suppose anything is possible. If it is only a tiny bit of material missing, I wouldn't worry, but if you had a real pile of filings, the thing may need to be replaced. Generally, it wouldn't be the threads failing, if they are cleaned and lubricated. Just my opinion though.

Ann

[daletournier]

Hi Ann, yes ive lubed them up with lanolin, I think there ok but not being experienced in this area I thought I'd ask the mob for thoughts. I fairly certain they haven't been off in 14years.

I'm so done with climbing the mast!!!!!

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[gjordan]

Lanolin is not a lubricant. It is water resistant, but technically not a lubricant. I always used it on turnbuckles to keep the salt out of the threads and it seemed to work well. I dont know if the product "Lanokote" has a mixture of lanolin and a lubricant to get the best of both worlds, but it seems to be popular. Jims advice is good. (correction, Anns advice) ____Grant.

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by gjordan

Lanolin is not a lubricant. It is water resistant, but technically not a lubricant. I always used it on turnbuckles to keep the salt out of the threads and it seemed to work well. I dont know if the product "Lanokote" has a mixture of lanolin and a lubricant to get the best of both worlds, but it seems to be popular. Jims advice is good. (correction, Anns advice) ____Grant.

Thanks, didn't realize that, I may of even used lanokote, can't remember the name on pot.

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[Jim Cate]

Dale, have you inspected the threaded parts of the rigging screws for damage... both male and female sections? I'd think that if enough material has been removed you would be able to see the imperfections.

And I concur that lanolin, while a wonderful material for many things on a boat (and on a sheep as well), it does not have good high pressure lubricating properties. I use a proper grease for rigging screws... have experimented with various types over the years. I have used a Castrol EP grease with Moly disulphide successfully, and am now trying an Inox Extreme Pressure High Temperature grease. It has the advantage of NOT having the moly in it, and thus not making such a gawdawful mess when I slather it about! I suspect that they are both quite adequate for this application.

Jim

[Alan Mighty]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

I use a proper grease for rigging screws... have experimented with various types over the years.

Is "a proper grease" the right solution for turnbuckle threads?


Have you not tried Marelube? Deposits a PTFE film on metal surface. Is waterproof. And tenacious. Not messy.


See: MareLube TEF 45™

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Alan Mighty

Is "a proper grease" the right solution for turnbuckle threads?


Have you not tried Marelube? Deposits a PTFE film on metal surface. Is waterproof. And tenacious. Not messy.


See: MareLube TEF 45™

Sounds a lot like Tef-Gel from the advert. Might well be good, but I'm always a bit suspicious of products that claim to "plate" onto substrates without explaining what exactly causes this action. Also a bit confused about the benefits of use in electrical connections where it "insulates or increases the resistance" of a connection.

Not saying that it is a hoax, or that it does not work well.. just a bit too much hype for my criteria. I'd be happy to find another good product, so might try some out... kinda dear, though! To put this in perspective, years ago I bought a one pound jar of anhydrous lanolin from a pharmacy. It cost two dollars. I still have around 20% of that pound, and I've given a bunch of dollops away to needy yotties). I use it in many (not all) of the suggested applications for this product. 13+ dollars for 6 cc is in a different category!

Alan,have you actually used this on rigging screws and left it for extended periods? Or for other purposes? And do you know what "ISO 9001" specifies?

And getting back to your question, yes, I think that proper (extra high pressure) greases are appropriate for turnbuckle threads. This is from personal experience and from the manufacturers' specifications.

MareLube may well meet the same criteria.

Jim

[capt-couillon]

Anything can/will fail if abused or overloaded... That being said, I have been using bronze fittings on my standing rigs for 40 years, with excellent results.

Also a believer in "Lanocoat" which is basically just lanolin and beeswax. Good heavy coat when the rig is assembled and have never had an issue adjusting screws in the future. Not what I would use for a high speed bearing, but a proven durable answer for turnbuckles.

Course I use it for everything... Anti-seize on stainless in aluminum, sail hank slides, keeping the rust off my Opinel pocket knife blade and even a temporary short term anti-foul on the dink prop. Know there are newer, higher tech, sexier, more expensive products out there but the old 1# tub of Lanocoat lasts for years.

Not so good on toast...

[rognvald]

To answer the OP's original question, yes . . . bronze can fail through corrosion, stress, oxidation. Here's an excellent article specifically detailing these occurrences. Hope this helps. Good luck and safe sailing.

https://www.gsa.gov/portal/content/111994

[Cheechako]

I've not seen bronze turnbuckles fail very commonly. Anything will break in the right situation. But it's hard to say what you experienced, grit? salt crystals? As mentioned, inspect the threads carefully. My use of Lanolin on them was just to keep water out as the screws were SS and it seems like a bit of an oxygen deprived environment to me.

[neilpride]

I never see a Bronze screw failing,, anyway we use Lanocote always, work really well in the Tropics...

[daletournier]

Appreciate al the replies.

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[a64pilot]

If it means anything, many years ago Dupont who manufacturers Teflon or PTFE, put out a letter stating that none of the products on the market at that time claiming to plate or burnish a coating of PTFE resin into the metal did, they stated that any benefit you may get from the PTFE being in the lubricant drained away with the lube.
There were products like Piston coat that you baked a coating of PTFE on that did at least for a short while actually make a coating. Never did determine if Piston Kote actually did anything though, but we tried it on several drag bike motors
Molybdenum Di suphide or Moly be Damned as many call it I think has corrosion issues with it very similar to graphite, I believe.

I would think on something that doesn't move at all that your not looking for lubricating properties, but anti-corrosive properties?
If so almost nothing beats Par -Al -Ketone,or also called Black Bear, it has been the go to for aircraft control cables etc since before I was born, and its great on sea planes. Messy though, its a black wax type of grease that actually dries up, but cleans off easily with mineral spirits, kerosene or the like
PAR-AL-KETONE from Aircraft Spruce

Very, very similar to cosmoline or that black waxy stuff that comes on regular steel cable like Bulldozers etc use. I have seen it applied to crankshaft journals and engine cylinders that were then stored outside and don't rust in years, and a cylinder wall can and will develop rust literally in minutes if not protected.

[barnakiel]

I have not seen a broken bronze screw (body) yet.

However, I have seen a broken bronze fork twice (one time at the fork and another time at the threaded portion).

So ... anything can break. Except it hardly ever does, if you do all due maintenance and check-ups.

Cheers,
b.