Can I weld this in situ?

[ahun]

Some good point, thanks all.
- Yes, it is an interesting crack, but it held on half way around the world and didn't change much. (I am in Fiji now and when I left from Dublin it was already cracked.) I know I should...
- I am convinced not to weld it in place unless there is no other solution.
- The next step is to figure something smart, within the available options. The new fitting doesn't have to be the same, it just have to function (to hold the baby-stay in place).
- I poured a glass of rum, and now am thinking...

[Wotname]

Presumably this is on a Hurley 22, what is the diameter of the baby-stay?
Could you use a soft strop of dyneema or similar?

[ahun]

Well, the baby stay is OK, it is how to attach it to the mast is the problem. Yes, H22.

[RaymondR]

You could make a fitting out of T section aluminium, cut a vertical slot in the front of the mast and place the stem of the T through the slot provided you can get access to the inside of the mast. No welding involved, hand tool job.

[Snowpetrel]

A sneaky trick I've used before for a temporary inner forestay is to lash spectra around the spreader bases. This was on a boat with very strong integrated spreaders and shroud tangs. But it worked pretty well for a few thousand rough miles.

[roland stockham]

Originally Posted by ahun

Just want to weld (fix, fill) that crack on the fitting. The q is, can it be done without taking the fitting of the mast? Not welding the steel to alu. Sorry for ambiguity.

DEFINITE NO, if you try the heat will most likely destroy the temper on the mast and it will fail as a minimum. Aluminum takes up heat much faster than stainless so the is even a possibility you would blow a hole in the mast before you got the S/S hot enough to flow. That is without the issue of maintaining the gas shield and welding up a mast (this should be done with TIG).

[roland stockham]

Just make sure the rivet holes are a couple of inches away from the old ones if you need to move it. You could also drill out and use bigger rivits. Monel rivets only and a decent rivet gun as they take a lot of snapping.

[Davidhoy]

Originally Posted by ahun

Some good point, thanks all.
- Yes, it is an interesting crack, but it held on half way around the world and didn't change much. (I am in Fiji now and when I left from Dublin it was already cracked.) I know I should...
- I am convinced not to weld it in place unless there is no other solution.
- The next step is to figure something smart, within the available options. The new fitting doesn't have to be the same, it just have to function (to hold the baby-stay in place).
- I poured a glass of rum, and now am thinking...

You left Dublin knowing this was cracked?? And sailed with it in that condition all the way to Fiji?!? You're going to need a lot more than just one glass of rum...

[Cheechako]

I would remove it to weld it. Have it TIG welded but I'd prefer a new fitting, looks like a common fitting. Re rivet it with SS or better Monel.

[Olddan1943]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

I would remove it to weld it. Have it TIG welded but I'd prefer a new fitting, looks like a common fitting. Re rivet it with SS or better Monel.

+1

[notiesbob]

For the price, replace it and sleep well at night.

https://www.ronstan.com/marine/product.asp?ProdNo=RF146 they come in different sizes depending on spar section

It's a small spar section, I'd through boltwith nyloc on outboard end the end tangs and use the other holes for a stabilizing fastener - monel, stainless. If taping use 1/4-28 instead of 1/4-20 for more thread grab

[rmlarson1098]

Originally Posted by Jd1

Ahh, didn't expand the picture so didn't see the crack .... my bad!


I am sure that somebody could do it but two questions arise:


1) how are you going to be sure the aluminum won't be overheated, changing the temper and thus possibly compromising the mast?
2) Looks like the fitting is by a set of spreaders - how are you going to convince a competent welder to get up there ?


I would suggest that it would make more sense to remove the fitting, weld it and re-attach. It would provide a better/stronger repair without risking damaging the mast.
If you doubt our ability to reattach the fitting, a rigger could do the job in no time flat.


As a bonus, I suspect the overall cost would be cheaper if you drill the rivets out, pull the fitting, have it repaired and have a rigger re-attach the fitting.


If I were faced with this kind of repair I would also reinforce (not just weld the crack shut) both sides of the fitting to strengthen an obviously weak point.


As a side point, that is a very interesting crack and the failure at that point doesn't seem to make any sense to me. One would think the failure point would be the rivet hole if anything.
I would try to understand the cause of the failure before blindly reinforcing things ... just in case.

Ha! Had to laugh at the 'competent welder' comment. All welders don't work in an air-conditioned shop, you know. You must be thinking of pipefitters. They typically don't like to get off the ground (or deck) unless they're working on a dance-floor sized scaffold. MY trade (boilermakers) often work higher in the air than most people ever get away from home. So.
And as a welder, I agree that 'no' would be the answer for welding in place, for reasons already mentioned. Stainless has very low thermal conductivity, which means the weld zone gets VERY hot and stays that way for a long time.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by ahun

...............
- The next step is to figure something smart, within the available options. The new fitting doesn't have to be the same, it just have to function (to hold the baby-stay in place).
............

Originally Posted by Wotname

Presumably this is on a Hurley 22, what is the diameter of the baby-stay?
Could you use a soft strop of dyneema or similar?

Originally Posted by ahun

Well, the baby stay is OK, it is how to attach it to the mast is the problem. Yes, H22.

Originally Posted by Snowpetrel

A sneaky trick I've used before for a temporary inner forestay is to lash spectra around the spreader bases. This was on a boat with very strong integrated spreaders and shroud tangs. But it worked pretty well for a few thousand rough miles.

I'm thinking the same as Snowpetrel. A dyneema / spectra strop or lashing at or just above the spreaders (maybe held in place with some saddles if above the spreaders) and attach the bay-stay to that. Or even replace the baby-stay with spectra as well.

There isn't a lot of strength required for tang (or baby-stay) on a Hurley 22.

[JPA Cate]

ahun, where in Fiji are you and the boat?

For everyone who missed this, IT IS A 22 FT. BOAT, the mast is a lot lighter build than one might have thought.

ahun, if you don't address the corrosion under the s/s strap, it will just get worse. Such corrosion can cause the mast to fail. The reason to replace the strap is that failure of the baby stay in a seaway allows the mast to pump, and also can cause failure. If he's still there, there's a Canadian guy at Vu(n)da Pt. Marina, and he will have contacts for helping you source things.

Just my opinion, but I think the time has come for you to seriously address the mast, before you head for NZ, which trip is likely to see a frontal passage, and although not as fierce as Ireland, with a fatigued strap still in place, you're courting danger, and the leprechaun who's been sitting on your stbd spreader might get kicked off by Murphy.

Ann

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

.......
Just my opinion, but I think the time has come for you to seriously address the mast, before you head for NZ, which trip is likely to see a frontal passage, and although not as fierce as Ireland, with a fatigued strap still in place, you're courting danger, and the leprechaun who's been sitting on your stbd spreader might get kicked off by Murphy.

Ann

Ann, what about lashing a near full rum bottle onto the port spreader to keep Murphy occupied while on passage - top up every port...