Can I weld this in situ?

[Olddan1943]

JPA Cates, "By the way, I do not like the look of that split pin (cotter pin) on the stbd spreader, it has deformed way too much. While you're at it, replace that one. Monel would be best, if available (maybe you have some in your spares)."

While you have the opportunity, replace and properly install and tape the cotter pins.

I too have two cotter pins to replace and tape.

[rmlarson1098]

Originally Posted by Fence Man

Not that this would be the situation for it, but sure you can. Some practical (affordable) TIG options out there, as well. At about 2:30 in the video, you'll see the steel to aluminum welding.

I understand that it can be done, but CMT (Cold Metal Transfer) and other exotic processes are unlikely to be found in most boatyards. Arc welding aluminum to steel is far from practical, and I don't see anything about welding aluminum to stainless steel, the issue here. S.S. is a different animal, not so much exotic but let's say trying as you probably know.
On the flip side, we used to use stainless steel flat-stock as a back-up bar when filling large gaps in aluminum. Also bizarre and probably metallurgically unsound.
I reckon copper would work as least as well if you had a stout piece lying around.
But this is offtrack. Would I risk welding a stainless steel bracket that's so close to the mast? No. The consequences of being 'metallurgically unsound' in this case could be disastrous. When the rig comes down, people can get hurt. Or worse.

[ahun]

After a quick brainstorming session with the guy from the trimaran anchoring next to me (a flat earth believer sailing around the world - I am not joking, and sadly he neither) I came up with this solution.

The bolt through the mast has no thread inside or even touching the mast. Copious amount of Tefgel was applied plus a plastic washer both side inside of ss washers. Just popped in some rivets to fill the holes from the previous fitting. The Dremel came out of its bag to cut the slot at the front of the mast. Should last a couple of months before a big overhaul of the boat is due.

Cost: $0.0

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by ahun

After a quick brainstorming session with the guy from the trimaran anchoring next to me (a flat earth believer sailing around the world - I am not joking, and sadly he neither) I came up with this solution.

...........

Clearly a scientific approach

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by Jd1

The original question was one of welding. You can not weld steel to aluminum so the answer is 'NO' to welding.

I think you missed the crack illustrated in the picture. The SS band is broken.

Yes, a person equipped with a proper weld rig TIG can do this. It will not be a great fix. Please consider removing it and replacing the MONEL rivets. Tack the parts together in place, drill out the rivets and remove. Continue welding from both sides and grind smooth on the inside before reinstalling.

A new replacement part would be best.

[lordgeoff]

Originally Posted by billknny

If it was me, I’d drill out the rivets, fix (or replace) then reinstall with SS screws tapped into the mast. Liberally slathered in tefgel.

At least as strong as the original. The only reason manufacturers use rivets here is they are fast to install.

I had some corrosion around the mast inside the rubber boot just above deck height. (Mast is keel stepped)
I had taken the mast out for overall checking/servicing and new shrouds. The rigger suggested a piece of the original profile of the mast be cut and slid up the inside of the mast to where the corrosion was. Drilled and riveted. It looks neat. Just a spaced and aligned pattern of rivets. Pretty much like when a mast is joined.
I suspect it that section is stronger now than original.

[Bbolino]

Don't weld - you cant weld stainless to aluminum and the heat will distort the mast.

Stainless and aluminum don't "play" well together. A stainless screw or bolt will soon be corroded to the aluminum. if you screw or bolt it use anti-seize compound on the threads. it is probably too thin to tap and bolt or hold a self tapping screw anyway


Given the thickness of the mast metal a pop rivet is probably the best solution unless there is access to install a nut and washer on the bolt

[HoustonIV]

As a CWI, I would never approve a weld in this configuration. There are good comments concerning "heat sinks" "weld heat affecting the structural integrity of the mast" both very good points, the best way to repair this is to remove the tang call rig-rite and obtain a new piece. Install using over sized monel or ss rivets, running a tig up the mast or even once the mast is unstepped on horses is tricky as gas purified weld are difficult unless all windage is blocked. The cost of welding is higher than pop riveting

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by ahun

Some good point, thanks all.
- Yes, it is an interesting crack, but it held on half way around the world and didn't change much. (I am in Fiji now and when I left from Dublin it was already cracked.) I know I should...
- I am convinced not to weld it in place unless there is no other solution.
- The next step is to figure something smart, within the available options. The new fitting doesn't have to be the same, it just have to function (to hold the baby-stay in place).
- I poured a glass of rum, and now am thinking...

- It cannot be welded in place even if you can't think of another option. Anyone that even implied it could (inadvertently I am sure) has no welding experience. The mast would be ruined.


IMO, this is probably really easy. Drill out the rivets and replace it in kind. The alternatives are a slightly larger fitting with different hole locations and having the local rigger/blacksmith make a replacement from stainless strap, which should not be hard.

[Chenco01]

No, do not weld it, renew and check reason why it craced. It looks like mechanical damage. Also the corrosion does not look very good. I suggest the mast and rigging has to be checked completly! You do not want it to come down in a bad weather situation with guests and crew aboard!

Maybe not what you want to read but better safe than sorry with this kind of failures.

Happy sailing from Holland(Dartsailer38)

Wouter Sanders

[chris95040]

Originally Posted by ahun

After a quick brainstorming session with the guy from the trimaran anchoring next to me (a flat earth believer sailing around the world - I am not joking, and sadly he neither) I came up with this solution.

The bolt through the mast has no thread inside or even touching the mast. Copious amount of Tefgel was applied plus a plastic washer both side inside of ss washers. Just popped in some rivets to fill the holes from the previous fitting. The Dremel came out of its bag to cut the slot at the front of the mast. Should last a couple of months before a big overhaul of the boat is due.

Cost: $0.0

Oh man - I don't think i like this. You're hanging the stay off the center of that bolt running through the mast? As that bolt bends under tension it's going to try to pull the sides of the mast together. That's called buckling, and it's precisely how masts fail.

I think you want your loads attached to the exterior of the mast. Maybe someone can give you something U-shaped you can attach to your through-bolt, and attach your stay to that.

[Nicholson58]

Originally Posted by ahun

After a quick brainstorming session with the guy from the trimaran anchoring next to me (a flat earth believer sailing around the world - I am not joking, and sadly he neither) I came up with this solution.

The bolt through the mast has no thread inside or even touching the mast. Copious amount of Tefgel was applied plus a plastic washer both side inside of ss washers. Just popped in some rivets to fill the holes from the previous fitting. The Dremel came out of its bag to cut the slot at the front of the mast. Should last a couple of months before a big overhaul of the boat is due.

Cost: $0.0

I am not comfortable with this fix unless you avoid big winds. This bolt and cut weakens the mast and creates a stress concentration point rather than spreading out the loads. Be careful.

[BeachGuy]

The only way to fix the crack, broken bracket is to 1. Replace it with a serviceable part, 2. Remove the bracket and find person who can make a patch and then rivet the patch and old pieces back together. When installing the repaired bracket use either monel or stainless steel rivet to re-attach. Aluminum Rivets would not have the shear strength for this application. Also while doing this job please have someone re-install the cotter pins in your spreaders. Photo shows a very poor job of it.
If you have trouble finding a sheet metal repairman try calling around a nearby airport and look for a aviation repair man for help. This would be a very easy job for them.

[h2ojunke]

Welder set up - $150 minimum
Welder Hr Rate - $ 85 Hr
Welder Mast Climbing - Cheaper to buy a new boat

I would not weld, but have a decent fab shop make a new strap fitting, then use Rivnuts in the mast and ss bolts through the new strap. Wet install the rivnut with 5200 and use liberal amounts of lanolene on the ss bolt install.

[Underdog]

The technical term for this escapes me, but I recall it rhyming with a movement an horse does. Removal is the only option. It may seem petty, but the drilled out scurf and back end of the rivet as a result of drilling will sit in your mast step and quietly galvanically corrode. Perfection would demand removal or at least lifting to clean that stuff out. I find it odd that the mast is so thin it cannot be tapped.... but, your call.
TefGel- I love it. Use it everywhere dissimilar metals are in contact, but her e I would also make a thin gasket to separate the new (or repaired,

welded and refitted) SS collar from the mast.