Halyard hitch vs eye splice

[Malagueta]

Hi, reading @bad orca's very entertaining thread on splicing I saw @captain JGW's post where he mentions a halyard hitch


I love splicing three strand but braided looks like trouble for a ham-fisted cack-handed lefty like me


What are the relative advantages of an eye splice vs the halyard hitch?


On my little ETAP 22 the halyards are, I would think, completely oversized in terms of strength to give ropes thick enough to be comfortable to handle, so p'raps strength isn't an issue?


I like the simplicity of a knot


I would probably whip the tail end or whatever its called to the bite of the halyard to keep it tidy & secure



EDIT: or is it like this?



TIA


Leigh

[StuM]

Last time it was discussed:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3284174

and my comment then:
https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3285929
There are at least two very different knots which are called the Halyard Hitch.

One is similar to ABOK#1847 Buntline hitch, ABOK#1912 and ABOK#400 in that the end comes out sideways. Also known as the Jeaneau Halyard knot.:
https://www.animatedknots.com/halyard-hitch-knot

In another, (Post #26) the end comes back along the line and doesn't allow as tight a hoist up to the sheave.
https://www.netknots.com/rope_knots/halyard-hitch

IMNSHO, the first version is superior.

[tkeithlu]

The disadvantage of a knot is that it weakens the rope, often by 50%. The advantage is that all good knots can be untied. In fact, that's part of how you define "good" in a knot.

Eye splicing braided line is basically inserting all or part of the working end into the middle of the rope and is not as difficult as it appears to us five-tuck short splicers.

[Breaking Waves]

For darcon halyards . . . there is pretty much no downside to using a knot. The line will (or should be) already be overstrength in order to minimize stretch.

For halyards with high modulus cores . . . . on most cruising boats they are already way oversized in order to be comfortable in the hand . . so same thing, knots are good.

Knots allow easy end for end of the halyard, don't jam in the sheaves and are easier to make than double braid splices (especially out on the foredeck at sea). They typically cut the strength by around/very roughly 50% but that is usually (in the above two cases) not an issue.

However on finely tuned race boats, sometimes the high modulus halyards are NOT so oversized (to minimize weight and windage). And a splice is arguably the better option, and there are splice options to minimize the bulk and length of the bury in this case if it is necessary.

But even on the edge case of 'very fine tuned race boats' knots are still (usually) an option (just with a lower safety margin than is preferred). The origins of the estar hitch was a request from Stan Honey for a knot that could be tied (quickly and easily) in dyneema on the foredeck of a volvo boat at sea. These boats would start off with spliced high mod ropes (halyards and guys and all such), but some would inevitably break and the foredeck needed to get them quickly reattached to their shackles. Almost all conventional such knots would slip in bare dyneema under high loads, so the estar was developed to fill this very narrow niche application. They would throw a splice in whenever things settled down enough.

[Malagueta]

Brilliant, I learnt some new knots and am now sure I dont have to splice (Malagueta is no cutting edge racer )


Thanks!

[DEAN2140]

I actually use a buntline hitch rather than a eye splice because it is slightly smaller. When the halyard starts to wear at the sheave, I can just cut off a few feet and relocate he chafe point instead of buying a new halyard.