Lazy Jack line choices.

[TheOffice]

1/8 inch nylon. Aluminum rings from REI sold as climbing gear.

[antoha]

one consideration may be adjustability. i was planning to splice, but started with knots since i don't know exactly how long i want the pieces to be, still trying to find the ideal lengths to minimize batten snagging as the sail is going up or down.

i meant to use thimbles but ended up with just knots (meant to be splices). there's so little tension in these when you adjust them that i don't see how running the line through a loop (knot or splice) would chafe through.

also, my setup has a cradle integrated with lazy jacks: that's a sail cover with a zipper along the middle, with long round battens running front to back on either side, and lazy jacks attached to these battens (going into the fabric through grommets). the lazy jacks are meant to stow under the boom but i actually never bother to do that.

anton

[PerfectPirate]

Originally Posted by Jahwork

Littlewing,

Thank you for the intelligent and extremely thoughtful insight you offer. To describe the level of appreciation and reverence which wells up inside of me from such a response is simply not possible to relay via the written word with the necessary justification it deserves. I am placing you on my vast and expansive list of those which occupy the earth that are to be studied and mimicked so that I might one day reach the pinnacle of being, which you clearly have already accomplished.
Congratulations!!! You win. I lose. I shall now sulk away in shame.

Safe Journeys to most,
~Jake

Dear Jake,
The loquacity and profundity of your replies instills in me a reverence which verges on being awestruck. It is a clear refutation and rebuke of the linguistic turpitude of the masses. However, I cannot help but perceive that the general tenor of your dissertations lacks a certain verisimilitude.


Hey Littlewing, how are they hanging? Looking forward to getting out on the lake soon? I always enjoy your posts when I encounter them, wide-ranging as they are.


Diane, I recently acquired a 32-footer whose specs are similar to yours. The current lazyjacks look like they were made from clothesline and my inclination in replacing them is to go the dyneema route. I will probably use simple rings instead of blocks and I am debating whether I want to make cute little leather hoods to protect my new mainsail from getting chafed or marked up by the blocks. I know that Harken's pre-packaged Lazy-Jack kits have those sorts of hoods on them, but they are using blocks.

[captmikem]

Wow, hi tech stuff!

Lazy Jacks basically catch a sail, simple stuff. I have always used 3 strand Dacron or even nylon, low price, easy to splice, stretchy so allows a bit of "ease", and dose not chafe the sale.

I run my lazy jacks forward when I hoist and hook them on the tack hooks. Rarely had any problems with them.

M

[Cheechako]

I used black small Nylon 3 strand once. I think yacht braid would be better, the nylon is stretchy if a batten hangs up etc, which seems to make it worse.

[Lazy Jack 32]

Thanks for this discussion. I'm just planning to install lazy jacks myself (True--that's also the name of the schooner's class, but mine doesn't have lazy jacks). I'm thinking 3/16 double braid polyester rope for all the lines, though I read that some use thinner rope for the sections closer to the boom. I'm also thinking of using stainless steel o-rings rather than blocks at all connection points except the mast. Will that work, in your experience, or are blocks worth the extra investment? Is it worth putting a block up the mast, and enough extra line to lower the whole LJ rig and pull it out of the way except when lowering sails? I have full battens, so maybe fouling them on the LJs won't be a problem. One last thing: I'm studying up on splicing eye loops into the lines, and reading that some brands of double-braided polyester lines are not recommended for splicing, as they're wound too tightly. Does anyone have experience with this?

I really appreciate the good folks on this website.

[captmikem]

Originally Posted by Lazy Jack 32

Thanks for this discussion. I'm just planning to install lazy jacks myself (True--that's also the name of the schooner's class, but mine doesn't have lazy jacks). I'm thinking 3/16 double braid polyester rope for all the lines, though I read that some use thinner rope for the sections closer to the boom. I'm also thinking of using stainless steel o-rings rather than blocks at all connection points except the mast. Will that work, in your experience, or are blocks worth the extra investment? Is it worth putting a block up the mast, and enough extra line to lower the whole LJ rig and pull it out of the way except when lowering sails? I have full battens, so maybe fouling them on the LJs won't be a problem. One last thing: I'm studying up on splicing eye loops into the lines, and reading that some brands of double-braided polyester lines are not recommended for splicing, as they're wound too tightly. Does anyone have experience with this?

I really appreciate the good folks on this website.

SS eyes will work fine on your lazy jacks, just make them a bit oversize.
Yes, put a block on each side of the mast and a small cleat on each side down by the gooseneck. You will want to lower and pull them forward before hoisting, should never have a problem with battens hanging on them if you stow them before hoisting. As before, I like three strand for lazyjacks. But that is my preference, they take little load.

M

[dannc]

Originally Posted by Jahwork

I am old, ignorant, poorly educated and very uninformed ...

Congratulations!!! You win. I lose. I shall now sulk away in shame.

Safe Journeys to most,
~Jake

What you said at the start, and the end, is true. You got that part right.

Though you left out rudeness as a characteristic.

Don't bother replying. Well, you can if you wish, but I wont see it because of the use of the Ignore list.

Later,
Dan

[Frankly]

Mine stay up for about 60 seconds, all other times they are along the boom, around small nylon cleats, up the mast, through cheek blocks just below the spreaders, back down the mast to the nylon cleats with a short length of bungee cord to keep things from flapping. Using that set up for almost 30 years on two different sailboats. Put the sail ties/ cover over everything except that running up the mast.

I used the Dyneema because ease of finger splice and slippery. Those Ronstan shocks (this is not a misspelling of blocks) are neat and only about $6 each if you shop around.


Frankly

[Clivevon]

I have full battens, so maybe fouling them on the LJs won't be a problem.

I dont think that will be the case - its the ends of the topmost battens that tend to catch under the lazyjacks as the sail is hoisted so the only way full length battens might make any difference to that is by the mainsail not flogging so much maybe.

You definitely need small blocks up the mast & dedicated cleats somewhere near the gooseneck to allow you the option of stowing the lazyjacks, even if only when you remove or replace the mainsail.

Also I think its worth the expense of small blocks on the lazyjacks - you only need 2 or maybe 3 each side. You can re-use the blocks when your line chafes & needs replacing. Main benefit will be less chafe on the sail as the block is flat against it not side on as rings, thimbles or Ronstan shocks would be. I know you will ease the lazyjacks to avoid crippling the sail shape under way, but still.... And if like me you have a stackpack sail cover you dont really have the option of keeping the lazyjacks stowed at the mast when the sail is up - the stackpack would just flop around.

[Clivevon]

Blocks like these maybe: https://www.marinesuperstore.com/dec...le-block-small
Still look a bit bulkier than mine but I bought them over 20 years ago - cant find them now.

[JasonBRose]

I made up retractable lazy jacks for my old Downeaster 32 using Regatta Braid and stainless rings. The Regatta Braid is as easy to splice as Dyneema, but is softer and shouldn't chafe your sail as much. They're 16 years old and still going strong including 8 years full time cruising in the tropics.

[Ramona]

Originally Posted by djousset

Finalizing my lazy jack plan and wrestling with line size and material. I plan to stow them along the boom when under sail.

33 foot boat, 13 foot boom, main with full battens. Seems there are lots of line choices with UV protection, strength, chafe and stretch the things to consider.

I'm thinking 4-5 mm double braid? Dyneema, dacron, yacht braid, double braid polyester?

There is no need to stow the lazy jacks away when sailing. On my old boat I used 3mm Spectra just because I liked the colour choices. All the halyards and control lines came back to the cockpit as did the line for the lazyjacks. Once the main sail was hauled up the lazyjacks were eased off. When lowering the mainsail with full battens it was just a matter of tensioning the lazyjacks, rounding up into the wind and let the halyard go and the sail falls down into the stackpack/sailcover. I would suggest using plastic, aluminium or SS rings. This is a video of my old 30 footer, I'm about to rig the same system on my 34 footer. In the video the lazyjacks were made from 3 strand nylon 5mm with SS thimbles. There is no need to go this heavy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJPpirJndt4

[roverhi]

Lazy Jacks take almost zero load. Exotic line really has no place there unless you are talking 1/16"/1-2mm line. It also doesn't like to take hard bends and is very slippery so cleating it off becomes an issue.

Used 3/16" dacron double braid with brass rings for my 28' boat with a 13' boom. No problems. Went with 1/4" and brass rings on the 15' boom on my 35' other boat. Those Lazy Jacks have been on the boat for a decade without a problem. Stow the Jacks forward against the mast when not in use which is most of the time. Slack the LJ halyard, hook the LJ's under their cleat on the mast and then retention the LJ halyard. Simple and quick to douse and deploy when the need arises. Used brass rings at the line junctures instead of blocks because it was way cheaper and blocks really aren't necessary. Low friction rings would probably work a little better but will cost more.

[MicHughV]

Lazy jacks can be a pain in the butt....the batten pockets catch on them, the leech can catch on them, etc, etc, etc. You have to be pretty much straight into the eye of the wind to have them behave themselves. If something does catch on them, you have the hoist the main back up to clear the tangle. Ask me, I know.

My advice, get invited on a boat that has them, and ask to see the main lowered and raised. Offering to do the lowering and raising will give you brownie points. Especially try to do this, with the wind coming from a few degrees from dead ahead.