Loong Sails...Anyone ordered from them before?

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by bullsails

The other question you took offence to, was not directed at Loong Sails, but rather a comment on sailcloth. Yes all the suppliers mentioned make good cloth, we use them too! But all of them also do a budget range at “an economical price”. So even within the individual supplier there is a huge difference in quality.
Have a nice day.

Before you post suggestions that someone uses inferior material, you might want to check with the manufacturers. I did. Loong Sails uses only what it quotes, not lesser materials. They don't use "budget range" materials. Period.

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by Kestrahl

Replies in Red
We make sails for some very big names that you would know, and we make our sails to the same standards or better. They just charge a whole lot more for the same sails.

Sounds like marketing talk to me. Personally I would never buy a OEM sail from a company that also sells sails cheaply though retail portals

You guys had a couple of my responses deleted by the forum, so I'll need to be as careful as you are about not coming across as a sail maker rep.

You'd be missing out. Because Wilfer makes lots of sails for a lot of really great and really big sail companies, and because inevitably there are sometimes cancellations for whatever reason, Wilfer over the years had accumulated a pretty big inventory of these sails. I repeat: these are top quality sails made with top quality materials. A quick and effective way to move them out is to sell them on eBay. A lot of reputable companies do this, by the way. Wilfer could not sell directly this way so sold the inventory to Loong. In addition to helping Wilfer clear inventory, it also is getting Loong some brand name exposure. People love the sails, so it's good exposure.

[cdarwincole]

Hey, I'm going to be too busy processing orders to respond much, so you guys go ahead and have your fun. Glad you have something to do to pass the time.

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by littledevil

here is a quick video i have put together. I have no commercial ties. He helped me out(chris, US rep, with my order...i am returning favor)

Love the video. Thanks so much.

By the way, we don't usually print big Loong Sails logos on our sails, but this client said he'd be happy to have it there to promote us, and we were happy to put it there!

Thanks again!

[bullsails]

Originally Posted by cdarwincole

Before you post suggestions that someone uses inferior material, you might want to check with the manufacturers. I did. Loong Sails uses only what it quotes, not lesser materials. They don't use "budget range" materials. Period.

I did not suggest any such thing.
I did point out Loong used a misleading photo of another sailmakers product in advertising- fact.
I did not take any action to remove any post, I assume it was forum moderator taking offence at your aggressive rhetoric.
In summary nothing I have posted has in anyway been false or misleading!
Have a nice day.

[bullsails]

Actually the whole made local or outsource manufacturing is an interesting point for sailmakers. We have in the past done both. For us it basically depends on the strength of the AUD vs USD. With it currently below 70c it is more beneficial for us to manufacture in-house, with a Mom and Pop type setup ( no corporate overheads) we are very competitive with the imported sails, in fact we are moving to larger premises.
When the $s were near parity we used to import a bit, I was told we were actually one of CSF biggest Australian customers, surprised us.
But these days we have a lot of customers ask “ is it locally made”.
I think you just have to be able to be flexible. Here in Oz with the Covid 19 and anti China political sentiments, people are leaning toward locally made it appears.
But $$$$ talk, we need to be relatively competitive.

[fivecapes]

Those are North Sails on Spirit of the C's (pic#5 of new layout) ... unless you did the sails for Felicità West?

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by bullsails

Actually the whole made local or outsource manufacturing is an interesting point for sailmakers. We have in the past done both. For us it basically depends on the strength of the AUD vs USD.

And I do sincerely wish you all the best. I know the situation well. I got my teaching certification after state tax and union policies drove my corporate clients out of Connecticut. I don't mean to get political here: it's just what my clients were telling me as they were leaving. It simply became easier and more cost effective for them to do business elsewhere, in other states or other countries. The corporate and manufacturing furniture and equipment became a dwindling and cut-throat marketplace flush with cheap used stuff. So, yes, I know first hand what it's like to get squeezed out by outsourcing of one sort or another. I had no choice but to go to the international market if I wanted to have a practical business.

Politicians now always talk about bringing the state back to its former glory, but they or their constituencies don't realize is that once businesses have established themselves elsewhere, they develop new dependencies and grow roots, and all new sets of factors come into play. In the case of our lofts, they now buy so much cloth and have so have so much buying power that they really can sell new state-of-the-art sails for less than many lofts would pay just for the material. I know because I've sold sails on that very basis. That's hard to beat. But it is a reality of the market.

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by Kestrahl

The photo on the front page on the website is not even their loft. It is a old photo of the China Sail Factory working floor. This is confirmed by several of the former China Sail Factory staff. How can you trust a company which uses a photo of someone else's sail loft on the front page of their website.

Wilfer bought the China Sail Factory loft. So it's not "someone else's" loft. It's one of the sites where Loong Sails and the sails of lots of other "sailmakers" are made.

What's your obsession with attacking Loong or Wilfer? Why don't you spend this time trying to make your own business functional?

You have never been a Loong customer and yet you bash, bash, bash, relentlessly. Meanwhile, I could easily drown you with positive reviews like the one that started this thread. Get help.

[cdarwincole]

I found an older thread from an similar web site that might be of interest:

https://forums.sailboatowners.com/th...imited.180434/

You might want to scroll down and skim until you start seeing some actual reviews or my comments about the Raven Mills that opened the discussion.

Cheers!

Chris

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by cdarwincole

Wilfer bought the China Sail Factory loft. So it's not "someone else's" loft. It's one of the sites where Loong Sails and the sails of lots of other "sailmakers" are made.

What's your obsession with attacking Loong or Wilfer? Why don't you spend this time trying to make your own business functional?

You have never been a Loong customer and yet you bash, bash, bash, relentlessly. Meanwhile, I could easily drown you with positive reviews like the one that started this thread. Get help.

Hi Christopher,

I heard that Wilfer bought most of the China Sail Company equipment. Can you tell me if they obtained the membrane equipment? If not, who does their membrane sails?

Also, you don't have to be defensive towards your detractors. (Don't sink to their level). If your product is good, and I have no doubt that it is, just give professional and honest responses to the people posting on this forum. It will give a much better impression.

[cdarwincole]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Hi Christopher,

I heard that Wilfer bought most of the China Sail Company equipment. Can you tell me if they obtained the membrane equipment? If not, who does their membrane sails?

Yes, and thank you for the question. We have that equipment and the know how to use it. I have a gorgeous headsail made with it for my Tripp 37, in fact.

Originally Posted by wingssail

Also, you don't have to be defensive towards your detractors. (Don't sink to their level). If your product is good, and I have no doubt that it is, just give professional and honest responses to the people posting on this forum. It will give a much better impression.

That's good advice, and I appreciate it. They are people who have never ordered sails from us and are certainly rival sail makers with their own agendas. I do have trouble letting their misrepresenations just sit out there, though. Hmmm. Have to work on that.

I just checked out your blog spot, by the way. Awesome! You seem to have a wonderful family, boat and life. I hope you all stay well and safe.

Cheers!

Chris

[Jim Cate]

This thread has devolved into acrimony and has been closed.

For the mod team

Jim