Powered Furler - Upwind

[nfbr]

To furl the headsails much more easily, I turn downwind. (61ft Cat)
But it would be good to stay pointed to pull in a reef.
I can do it, but the forces are "significant", and I'm told not good for the furler (to the point of twisting foils)

Does having a powered furler allow upwind furling?

[Gudgeon]

We use our electric winches to furl our head sail. Most of the time we furl the head sail going up wind, the key is to be easing the sheet to keep the pressure to a mininum. There are times where we are luffing the sail. We try to keep a tight wrap on the furler.

[psk125]

The problem with using power to furl sails-- upwind or down-- is that the motor ignores any jam in the system and keeps on going. This can damage both sails and equipment. Be careful adding power to the mix.

[rotrax]

And a human does not do the same?


Our boat has one Lewmar powered 40 winch for ALL furling, outhaul and sail trim.


The optional 165% reacher is powered, no adverse comments on the IPHomeport in regard to powered winches from users.


Adverse comment from blowhards who, without ever using the system, cricitise it.


This might happen, that might happen. But it never seems to.


Our Lewmar 40 Powered winch has a torque cut out. It just senses when too much is too much and stops winding.


Many, many contemporary new builds are having Solent rigs with powered furlers installed as OE.


I ALWAYS check by hand regularly the effort required to rotate the jib and main furlers. If any increase in friction the issue is sorted, and sorted fast!

[psk125]

Originally Posted by rotrax

And a human does not do the same? ...


I ALWAYS check by hand regularly the effort required to rotate the jib and main furlers. If any increase in friction the issue is sorted, and sorted fast!

A human does not simply continue turning until the fitting breaks or the sail is damaged. If the friction increases too much a human stops and (as you mention) sorts it out. Friends (more than one) have damaged their gear, including battens poking holes in sails and biminis getting ripped, because they used power winches to furl sails or tighten lines without taking proper care. Having a clutch set to prevent damage is great -- but then why should you have to bother to "ALWAYS check by hand" ? We furl our genoa by hand. If we need the power of a winch something is wrong and needs to be sorted out. Bigger sails than ours might call for more mechanical power. The additional power of winches - especially powered winches - calls for taking more care using them.

[Tudorsailor]

I much prefer furling the yankee on our 49ft while point upwind. In that way the furl is nice and tight. I worry that a loose furl can be blown undone in strong winds.
In light winds I pull in by hand. In moderate and above I use the manual winch. I have electric winch that I could use, but I fear that it would break something as others have said.
I always finish with several wraps of the sheet around the sail. I have often wondered why some leave a triangle unfurled. Seems a risky thing to do

TS

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by nfbr

To furl the headsails much more easily, I turn downwind. (61ft Cat)
But it would be good to stay pointed to pull in a reef.
I can do it, but the forces are "significant", and I'm told not good for the furler (to the point of twisting foils)

Does having a powered furler allow upwind furling?

No, it isn't really that helpful to stay pointed. You should be able to pull that head sail reef in in moments, if you have everything set.


It is myth that off the wind furls must be loose. Tightness is completely dependent on how much back tension you keep on the sheet. You never just let the sheet fly. Easy.


A powered furler only solves one of the upwind furling problems. Flogging and equipment strain only get worse.

[rotrax]

Originally Posted by psk125

A human does not simply continue turning until the fitting breaks or the sail is damaged. If the friction increases too much a human stops and (as you mention) sorts it out. Friends (more than one) have damaged their gear, including battens poking holes in sails and biminis getting ripped, because they used power winches to furl sails or tighten lines without taking proper care. Having a clutch set to prevent damage is great -- but then why should you have to bother to "ALWAYS check by hand" ? We furl our genoa by hand. If we need the power of a winch something is wrong and needs to be sorted out. Bigger sails than ours might call for more mechanical power. The additional power of winches - especially powered winches - calls for taking more care using them.

I dont check before every furl. Only a stupid person would do that, or one who was not on top of boat maintenance.



Before setting off on a passage I check, by rotating the jib furling drum by hand a turn or two. I then pull the main outhaul by hand a turn or two, if it is free, we are set to go.


It is a bugger if I forget to lift the furling line clutch and FM is out of earshot!


Most high end sailboats are offering powered furling.


As I say, six years, over 10,000NM's, no issues or damage caused by the power winch.


We have had two minor issues with a jam in the in mast furling system caused by vertical battens being too thick. Just after we got the vessel.



Once this was attended to, perfect.


This conversation is like the " Dont rely on electronics " posts of twenty years ago.


Many contemporary yachts have no chart tables these days.


It is called progress.

[Seman]

We use a Milwaukee 28V angle drill for all our furling, rising the Main and even trimming the Genoa.
Its easy to tell if there is additional resistance by feel and sound of the drill motor.
Has been working for us for years.

[rotrax]

Exactly - I have no option but to use the powered winch, until I fitted a single Lewmar 45 Evo to the port side for the new Reacher there was no other way of outhauling, trimming and furling. The new winch will only do the port side sheet of the reacher.



The winch action and noise soon lets you know if you are asking too much of the power winch, plus ours has a torque cut out.


The power winch CAN be operated manually, but it is a slow and tricky process due to its position in the rear cockpit.

[Tetepare]

Our former boat (which has a larger headsail than our current boat) the 150% genoa was 425 sq.ft. / 40 sq.m. With a Harken Mk III it would furl by hand if still lightly loaded (i.e., not flogging.)

Your boat is substantially larger, so of course the headsail will be larger, but since it's a cat, I doubt it's double the size. What is the size of the sail? What brand of furler? How old is the furler?

Reason I'm asking is that your furler should be up to the job of furling that sail headed upwind, lightly loaded.

The original furler was a POS and wouldn't furl well, thus the move to the Harken. Both though operated much better when cleaned and lubricated- in fact the Harken insists on being well lubricated.

I believe someone already mentioned backstay and halyard tension.

There are many factors involved with how easy/hard a sail is to furl, it may be best to determine which factors may be causing the difficulty.