Ropework tools

[Seaworthy Lass]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

The D-Splicer microserrated dyneema scissors are absolutely brilliant. You will love them. For me, cutting dyneema with knives is an exercise in frustration, no matter how sharp the knife is. If its sharp enough, you'll get through the material, but making a really clean cut is a different matter.


I have a good friend who is a surgeon, who won't use a knife for anything. I figure she knows a thing or two about cutting stuff up. She says that scissors rule for cutting stuff precisely, and that surgeons use scalpels only on TV or when cutting skin. She says you can use scissors for just about anything up to chain saw size (she loves horror movies, too , and I sleep with one eye open when she's on board ).

My new D-Splicer scissors have just arrived. I concur that they are "absolutely brilliant". Thanks for the tip. They slice through dyneema like butter. It dramatically shortens time taken to taper a slice.

Another lot of "tools" I have reached for lately is a couple of sets of old metal knitting needles. They serve very well as awls. I use them to pull strands of dyneema out when tapering splices or for securing two strands when eye splicing. They are very lightweight and long so they don't drop out. Several are useful.

SWL

[sailorchic34]

I don't have a lot of rope work tools. I have a dinky marlin spike which I find inadequacy for me. I was making a 8 plait rope to chain splice a few weeks ago and needed a better tool. I adapted a slightly different tool that I had aboard.

Below is a photo where I was using a Sia (originally an Okinawan farming instrument for planting rice) as a bigger better marlin spike. It allows for a somewhat larger hole and more leverage for my weak arms to make the required 4 full and 2 half tucks. I've carried them around for over 40 years, since my old Shorinji Kempo days. One of the very few things from my youth..

[Bigjim]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

My new D-Splicer scissors have just arrived. I concur that they are "absolutely brilliant"...

Another lot of "tools" I have reached for lately is a couple of sets of old metal knitting needles.

SWL

Great tip. I've been using my kitchen shears to cut all sorts of double-braid. Even my sharpest knife often leaves uncut strands. It's very frustrating.

I like the idea of using knitting needles to lock the splice while you're working. I often pull out the cover when I'm trying to feed the core back through. One thing I've done recently is use a pair of vice grips to pinch the crossover.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Seaworthy Lass

My new D-Splicer scissors have just arrived. I concur that they are "absolutely brilliant". Thanks for the tip. They slice through dyneema like butter. It dramatically shortens time taken to taper a slice.

Another lot of "tools" I have reached for lately is a couple of sets of old metal knitting needles. They serve very well as awls. I use them to pull strands of dyneema out when tapering splices or for securing two strands when eye splicing. They are very lightweight and long so they don't drop out. Several are useful.

SWL

Glad you're enjoying them. I adore mine.

Knitting needles look like a hot tip for the ditty bag as well; thanks. Should be an improvement on my ballpoint pens

[UNCIVILIZED]

What are you guys using for knives, & to sharpen them? I ask as I don't own a single one, even ones made of crap alloys, that I literally can't shave with. Yes, the good ones hold an edge for longer, but... Nary a one has any trouble with ANY kind of cordage. And even my cheapie, hardware store utility knife works for the finer cuts when splicing. It's the kind where you snap off a section of the blade when it gets dull.

Though I'll be honest, & say that when I took a 3-day splicing class from Brion Toss, I was surprised at how his crew's eyes lit up at the way I easily, & precisely cut rope with knives. And they asked & lusted after mine. Far, far more than even their ceramic ones. Perhaps because I cut everything in one pass, or less. Unlike needing to saw on the lines as with their ceramic knife.

Really, there's not a lot of difference in the kind of performance I expect from my working knives, & my kitchen knives. And we all know how difficult it can be to cube up a few pounds of 1 1/2" thick, sinuous beef. So why is the consensus that cordage is somehow different? It ain't.
A couple of good quality knives will last you several decades, unless used heavily, daily. It's a cheap investment, with great dividends. Do you really trust a half way sharp rigging knife to cut a line in an emergency?

Scissors do have a place making some of the required, tiny, precise cuts. But splicing, & cordage work requires a "toolbox" (literally), & by not using some of the tools in it, you're kind of doing yourself a disservice.

My Toolbox - More or Less:
A couple of types of knives
- 4" fixed, Carbon steel blade
- 3" folder, Stainless, locking. A Spyderco I've carried for 20-some years
- Home Depot Utility Knife. One where you can set the depth of cut, as well as snap off a section of the blade when it becomes dull.
2 Pairs of scissors; Large, & Tiny
Sharpener(s)
Marlin Spike (s)
Sailmaker's Spikes
Measuring Tape
Pliers
Fid(s)
Micro Torch
Cigarette Lighter
Splicing Wand
Splicing or Knitting Needles
Electrical Tape
Masking Tape
Red & Black Magic Markers. Both fine tip, & broad tip
Sailmaker's Needles
Roping Palm
Seizing/Serving & Whipping Thread/Cordage
Strong, UV Resistant Thread for lock stitching things. Including Spectra. Braided fishing line works to; Spectra, & other types.
Maxi Jacket or RP25
And probably a few other things I'm forgetting. Like Splicing Instructions, Bandaids, etc.


Okay, now I'll go caffeinate, so I'm not this cranky all day

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

What are you guys using for knives, & to sharpen them? I ask as I don't own a single one, even ones made of crap alloys, that I literally can't shave with. Yes, the good ones hold an edge for longer, but... Nary a one has any trouble with ANY kind of cordage. And even my cheapie, hardware store utility knife works for the finer cuts when splicing. It's the kind where you snap off a section of the blade when it gets dull.


Really, there's not a lot of difference in the kind of performance I expect from my working knives, & my kitchen knives. And we all know how difficult it can be to cube up a few pounds of 1 1/2" thick, sineous beef. So why is the consensus that cordage is somehow different? It ain't. A couple of good quality knives will last you several decades, unless used heavily, daily. It's a cheap investment, with great dividends.


Scissors do have a place making some of the required, tiny, precise cuts. But splicing, & cordage work requires a "toolbox" (literally), & by not using some of the tools in it, you're kind of doing yourself a disservice.


My Toolbox - More or Less:
A couple of types of knives
Ditto scissors
Sharpener(s)
Marlin Spike (s)
Sailmaker's Spikes
Measuring Tape
Pliers
Fid(s)
Micro Torch
Cigarette Lighter
Splicing Wand
Splicing or Knitting Needles
Electrical Tape
Masking Tape
Red & Black Magic Markers. Both fine tip, & broad tip
Sailmaker's Needles
Roping Palm
Seizing/Serving Thread/Cordage
Strong, UV Resistant Thread for lock stitching things
And probably a few other things I'm forgetting. Like Splicing Instructions, Bandaids, etc.

That's a good list I would have expected nothing less


Mine is the same, except I use the D-Splicer instead of the Toss Wand. I'm very pleased with it.

I also keep a small high density polyethylene cutting board, which for my is essential for doing anything with a knife on cordage.

I have ball point pens instead of knitting needles, but I'm going to change that.

I'm not really a "knife guy" -- unlike Uncivilized -- and no doubt far less skilled in maintaining and using knives, but I do have a whetstone and oil, and a couple of Myerchin rigging knives handed down to me by my Father. I would probably use knives on cordage more, if I had Uncivilized's skills with knives, but lacking them, I use scissors on everything up to about 16mm. The biggest advantage, besides being much less prone to botched cuts, is that the cuts are absolutely clean and even.

If I really wanted to go to another level with knives, I would probably use a straight razor, in a fixed mount (not folding). It's vastly easier to get a razor sharp edge on a deeply hollow ground straight razor, than a knife, in my experience. Plus, straight razors are made of the right kind of black steel which is far easier to sharpen than stainless.


One question to Uncivilized: what is "UV resistant thread"? Something different from normal polyester thread? One should never use ordinary cotton sewing thread for anything on board since it falls apart in short order when exposed to UV, but is there something better than polyester? I would be interested to know.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

If I really wanted to go to another level with knives, I would probably use a straight razor, in a fixed mount (not folding). It's vastly easier to get a razor sharp edge on a deeply hollow ground straight razor, than a knife, in my experience. Plus, straight razors are made of the right kind of black steel which is far easier to sharpen than stainless.

As often as not, a good flat ground knife will do the job quite well. And whatever you use, make sure that you use it such that it can't accidentally sever your fingers, should it close at the wrong moment.
Also a good handle is essential, as without one it's a lot tougher to control the knife for more precise things. Like when you're removing the fat & gristle from a large piece of meat on the cutting board at home. Such as when rendering a cheap cut of beef usable for say, stir fry. Where you want small pieces, free of chunks of fat, or tough to chew material, for use in the wok.

One question to Uncivilized: what is "UV resistant thread"? Something different from normal polyester thread? One should never use ordinary cotton sewing thread for anything on board since it falls apart in short order when exposed to UV, but is there something better than polyester? I would be interested to know.

On thread, I have a few spools of the stuff, which I've had for ages. Some given to me or purchased from a sailmaker. And others were gifts from a friend who commercially sews custom outdoor gear. But as you say, the key thing is to avoid using what's in the home sewing chest, as it rapidly self destructs in the marine environment.

Much of the time you can even use some of the strands of "thread" which come from the cordage being spliced. Just pull some out of the sections of the off cuts of rope.

Checking the splices on things like halyards, etc. is one of those areas where I pay more attention to things, especially the lock stitiching, than in some other areas. Since the consequences of them failing can be quite a pain in the backside to say the least. So they get frequent attention, even if but during sail changes, when you're clipping a halyard onto a new sail.


Also, a couple of the things I forgot to mention in my "toolbox" list are:
- A couple of micro sized tubes of superglue. Both for cordage applications, & 1st aid.
- Hair gel for "stiffening" up the lay of a rope to make it easier to handle, & retain more homogenous properties while you're working with it.
- Vice grips, for use when doing work with rigging wire, & wire to rope splices.
- Heat Shrink Tubing
- Epoxy Putty, like MarineTex for covering wire's sharp ends after Nicopressing fittings onto it. Such as when making eyes in it for shackles.
- Friction tape. Especially if any wire work is to be involved.
- Beeswax. A cake or three, for "bonding" groups of seperated bundles of strands of a rope's lay together when splicing. Such as for wire to rope splices, & sometimes tapering a line's cover into a high modulus core.

BTW, anyone got some tips on how to get & keep the throat of a splice tight when splicing rope onto thimbles, or low friction rings? That's one area where I could use some extra instruction from the "professor".

[estarzinger]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

One question to Uncivilized: what is "UV resistant thread"?

Dock . . .this stuff Tenara lifetime thread

There are other brands but that is the most common one. It is goretex (PTFE fiber). You can also actually get dental floss in the same material - which comes in very convenient size and dispensers. The 'waxed' dental floss is nice to work with. I carried both - tended to use the Tenara when using sewing machine and the dental floss in hand work.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Originally Posted by estarzinger

Dock . . .this stuff Tenara lifetime thread

There are other brands but that is the most common one. It is goretex (PTFE fiber). You can also actually get dental floss in the same material - which comes in very convenient size and dispensers. The 'waxed' dental floss is nice to work with. I carried both - tended to use the Tenara when using sewing machine and the dental floss in hand work.

Yep, that's the stuff. Ann Cate (JPA Cate) talks about it whenever discussing sail repairs, canvas repairs, or making canvas projects that'll see any sun. Which, most of those threads are worth perusing too. I've learned a fair bit from them, even with a sewing background.

[estarzinger]

^^ only difficulty with it in a sewing machine, is that it is slippery, you have to do a very careful adjustment of the machine tension to get good stitches. Sail makers hate it because of that - I tried to get North to use it in a sail I ordered and they really really did not want to because it was so hard to machine sew well - they instead preferred to use twice the diameter dacron thread. But I found it was certainly quite possible to machine sew - always used it when I made our sail covers - just need to be careful and take time to get the adjustments right.

For hand work this is not such a problem, but with the slipperiness you do need to be careful with knots (and finishing the ends). The waxed dental floss helps with knot holding.

[double u]

wow! incredible fountain of info! sewing sails with dental floss-never would have had this idea!!!thanks!

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by estarzinger

Dock . . .this stuff Tenara lifetime thread

There are other brands but that is the most common one. It is goretex (PTFE fiber). You can also actually get dental floss in the same material - which comes in very convenient size and dispensers. The 'waxed' dental floss is nice to work with. I carried both - tended to use the Tenara when using sewing machine and the dental floss in hand work.

Ah, yes. I actually have some of this.

But it is as slippery as Dyneema and doesn't really take knots -- do you use it for whipping, seizing, lockstitching and frapping? I went back to polyester for those purposes.

[estarzinger]

^^ I use the waxed dental floss for all that. It helps to learn the various old school tricks for trapping the ends/knots under/thru the turns. Just a square knot hanging out will likely come loose if unwaxed and untrapped.

I would have to look up the coefficient of friction, but I think it may be even slipperier than dyneema - it is Teflon based.

Dacron thread is also certainly fine. This stuff is just 'best' (if you have the technique right)

PS: note - size for size it is weaker when new than dacron, but after 2 years of UV it is stronger.

[estarzinger]

"Modern" whipping (and such) technique, for use with Dyneema and teflon, is a interesting topic. There has been some advanced work done (to improve on the old school techniques), but not a ton and there is a lot of development opportunity still. I have continued to experiment/test in the area. It was what I was trying to explore in a prior thread, taking apart and assessing the current Antal method for loaded Dyneema thread whipping, until that thread got sort of hijacked/sidetracked by another poster.

[Benz]

A quick way to keep square knots in dyneema whipping twine from untying themselves, if the ends can't simply be buried (which is more elegant), is to put a tiny dab of super glue on the knot.
A thing I prefer doing is to take a tiny fid or a fat needle (yarn needles are a must in the rigging box), and bury the tails of the whipping twine deep into the big line. I do this with almost all my whippings, and it hides the ends better than a blob of super glue or melted twine.
UNCIV: To hold 3-strand tight to a thimble, just start your first tuck as close as you can to the thimble. Tuck strand #2, then tuck #1 again before turning the splice over and tucking strand #3 for the first time. You can also tape the legs of any line to the thimble to hold it.
For Dyneema, snug the first pass of the brummel tight to thimble and make the second one as close as possible. If not brummelling, then just bunch the body of the line where the bury goes through against the thimble, then smooth it back out from there.
For 8-plait, make your first two-strand pair pass through the center of the line as close as possible to the thimble, then loosen it a bit, make your other first tucks, then snug it all up before making the second round of tucks.