standing rigging replacement concerns

[Sprinter99]

Hi,

We are doing a refit on a watkins 36c and it has not been in the water since around 2005. I want to change all the standing rigging and we replaced our chainplates already. Is it as simple as removing the old standing rigging and bringing it to a shop to have it duplicated ? We live in a small town in new brunswick canada and I cant seem to find a rigger so I would probably bring my old rigging to a shop in the states (rigging only ?)

Someone told me to not just duplicate them in case they are stretched or not correct size.....is that a real concern ?

Any information helps a lot as we are in a bit of a dead end regarding this.

Thanks!

Mario

[ThereAndBack]

If your rigging is wire, then I wouldn't worry about stretch. The turnbuckles are there to make fine adjustments. I'd just take the rigging and ship it to a rigger and they'll ship you back the new stuff. I did this with my first monohull and it was an easy project (surprisingly).

I -would- suggest you get a competent rigger or sailmaker somewhere along the line to help you dial in the rig if you don't have experience tuning it.

[Marathon1150]

Originally Posted by ThereAndBack

If your rigging is wire, then I wouldn't worry about stretch. The turnbuckles are there to make fine adjustments. I'd just take the rigging and ship it to a rigger and they'll ship you back the new stuff. I did this with my first monohull and it was an easy project (surprisingly).

I -would- suggest you get a competent rigger or sailmaker somewhere along the line to help you dial in the rig if you don't have experience tuning it.

I agree with all of the above.

A boat neighbour encountered a significant problem when he measured the rigging himself and had an offshore company fabricate new rigging based on his measurements. It did not work out well. So the advice provided in the comment above should work out ok as long as everything is well labelled.

We had our boat re-rigged after 10 years because our insurance provider insisted on it. We sailed the boat hard for 7 days after the new wire was installed and the riggers retuned the rig. After crossing from Mexico to Tahiti, the wire had stretched significantly. So if you can get someone to check your new rig after it is installed, watch what they do carefully, read about it, watch some YouTube videos etc, so that you can do it yourself in the future.

[Cheechako]

Yes, take it off, have it duplicated. You may find a very wide range in estimates. I would get a few. You can even order on line to save money. I would not concern myself with stretch but think about how the turnbuckles are currently adjusted (mid thread?)
To get estimates you could just use approx lengths. But be sure to specify that when you actually send the order in.
You can remove a couple at a time and get them done if you dont want to de mast for the project.
Nice time to demast and check everything out and rebuild as necessary though.
Type 316 wire is best, but most boats for decades have not had that so...

Before ordering; take them off and measure accurately, also think about how the turnbuckles are currently adjusted (mid thread?) ... you want some adjustment both ways.
If using a local source, give them the old one so there's no question of length.

[rbk]

With the cost of shipping heavy cable to and from your location there may be a local supplier that can get the cable then purchase mechanical fittings such as sea lock and do the swagging yourself. You can then make the new ones directly next to the old ones to ensure they are the correct length. It will cost about the same but now you have the ability to replace any standing rigging in the future easily and cheaply.

[Orion Jim]

Rigging Only is a great source and Danny does an outstanding job. Send him the old stuff and he will duplicate it. He can swage all terminals or use the mechanical Sta-Lok (which I have and can therefore highly recommend) or Hi-Mod which are also fine. The benefit of mechanical terminals is that you can easily renew the wire anywhere in the world and use the same terminals again but it is best to use new wedges and formers for a perfect job.

[Sand crab]

Some West Marine stores have a rigging shop.
Or you can make it yourself with Sta-lok fittings. They cost more but are better because they don’t pinch like crimp fitting.

[roverhi]

You can do the rigging yourself using StaLok or other mechanical terminals. Follow the directions and use the existing wire as a pattern. Rigged my first boat that we took SoPac in a little over a day without any prior experience using Norseman terminals. The terminals aren't cheap but throwing in your labor comes out the same as swage terminals done by a rigger.

[sinnerman]

My sailing mentor stated that you can remove the shrouds/stays and take them to West Marine where they will mfg a new one in their rigging shop. (Note not all West Marines have rigging shops BTW).

The more work you can do yourself, the cheaper it will be. My standing rigging replacement estimate is $3K+ USD. I can bring this down by taking the sails/boom down myself / have the mast pulled and have them work only on the rigging.

[Sprinter99]

thanks for all the answers ! I will get a few stores quote me and ship the old rigging to have replaced. is there other reliable store like rigging only ?

[billgewater]

Really good labelling of each wire is important. Also, use a felt tip pen and tape to mark the exposed thread on each screw (before dismantling) so the rigger/supplier can ensure the new stuff will accurately replicate the current state of each screw. They can assess the overall length required including the screws if you are considering replacing the screws as well.
Have you considered using Dyneema? Much easier to ship plus you can easily do your own splices. Less weight above so potentially better sailing. Some downsides but it is becoming more popular. Many web sites.

[CarinaPDX]

Once I worked out the dimensions (custom rig) it took an afternoon to make up the rigging, with no great skill required. I bought rigging wire and Sta-Lok fittings, cut to length and installed fittings. Easy. There are other competitors now to Sta-Lok so if you want to go that way you might check them out. Avoid Norsemen: the design is less than optimal and there have been many counterfeits. When the rigging was getting old I replaced it with new wire and just the internal cones (cheap) - cone fittings are re-usable.

When replacing rigging wire for a currently stepped mast you should be able to do them one at a time without un-stepping the mast. That might be an issue with some of the modern rigs with minimalist rigging (bad idea - no redundancy so one failure at sea is a disaster) but if you have 4 lowers and 4 uppers you should be good. Before removing any stay set up a halyard or other line to help support the mast while working on it. Check the turnbuckle adjustment before removing and note any change in length needed. Then take one stay down, measure, then make up the new stay and install it. I put a Sta-Lok on the end of the coil of wire and lay it alongside the old stay, matching up the terminals and then cut to length. Install the terminal and back up it goes. More time is spent going up and down the mast than making up the stay. Alternatively pay the yard to un-step the mast, carefully measure the stays, pay the rigger to make up the stays and ship them to you, and pay the yard to step the mast. And if you bought swaged fittings you will pay the full price next time as well. You could have the rigger use cone fittings but that will be getting even more expensive. If you are at all handy you can save yourself thousands. You will need a hacksaw to cut the wire (cable cutters don't give as clean a cut, which you want for the fittings). Then either a vise and wrench (preferable) or two wrenches to assemble the fittings, and some sealant and threadlock for final assembly. That's it.

Greg

[Tsuru]

Originally Posted by sinnerman

My sailing mentor stated that you can remove the shrouds/stays and take them to West Marine where they will mfg a new one in their rigging shop. (Note not all West Marines have rigging shops BTW).

The more work you can do yourself, the cheaper it will be. My standing rigging replacement estimate is $3K+ USD. I can bring this down by taking the sails/boom down myself / have the mast pulled and have them work only on the rigging.

I've done this exact job and was pleased with the work. West Marine has a measurment form that's available on line. You can take your old wires to any WM shop and they will ship to/from the shops where rigging is done. I've normally had so/so service from WM but this was a good value and well done. Good luck. Note that we did our 30" masthead rig everything new (turnbuckles, pins, wire, swedge fittings) less than $2500. USD.

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by rbk

With the cost of shipping heavy cable to and from your location there may be a local supplier that can get the cable then purchase mechanical fittings such as sea lock and do the swagging yourself. You can then make the new ones directly next to the old ones to ensure they are the correct length. It will cost about the same but now you have the ability to replace any standing rigging in the future easily and cheaply.

That's what I did back in about 2005 using a mixture of Norseman and StaLoc (couldn't get the right sizes in just one type). I found either type to be easy to work with after a little practice. Fairly easy job.

[moseriw]

I will use a rigger in the next two years to check it an replace the required things. My rigg is 20 years old and even surveyours do not see a need to replace parts that are fairly OK.

The rigger will check it and I will enforce him to get a rigging certificate afterwards that I will NOT present my insurance company but will keep it - just in case!