Twin Groove Luff Foils - Why?

[redcobra]

My Schaeffer 2100 furling system has twin luff grooves. What is the purpose of the second groove. The only way you would use two sails is on a dead run, and to change to another sail you have to take the first one down.
I had my 120% and my 100% sails converted to #6 luff tape so I could change down, but I can't see myself on a dark and stormy night changing from the 150 to the 120 as it is a slow job to pull one down and feed the other into the luff groove. Lots of friction and requires coordination with a second person. In a way, I miss hanking on a sail and leaving it on deck than hoisting it from the cockpit.

Other than planning way ahead and changing the sail before leaving, or before it starts blowing, or buying a "gale sail" that fits over the rolled genny, how do you who have furling systems change down in weather?

Alan

Alan

[witzgall]

Two thoughts come to mind. Double headsails downwind, and a second groove to use if the other is damaged to the point a sail cannot be raised.

Chris

[speedoo]

Hard to figure out a cruising application other than the possible two headsails when running, but in racing when you want to change headsails, you hoist the new headsail on the empty track and then drop the old headsail. The idea is to always have a headsail up to keep speed up.

Of course you need two headsail halyards, two sets of sheets and plenty of crew.

For cruising downwind, just hoist the second headsail on the empty track and set it flying opposite the old headsail with its own sheets and you would probably need at least one whisker pole for the windward headsail.

[hugosalt]

Not familiar with Schaeffer 2100, but the 2nd groove in my unit is used to
hoist and lower the one sail that lives on the furler.(by way of a ss wire).
Have sail with cable in luff that is hoist on separate halyard for light air...
Don't think that set up would work in heavy air, to much stretch in halyard
or maybe spectra halyard??
Furl until it does'nt make sense...then maybe a baby stay ...then you could have your storm sail hanked on ready to hoist.

[Ex-Calif]

Speedo has it right. Many furlers offer the option to remove the drum bits with the idea that you can get a longer luffed sail on closing the gap between foot and foredeck. In racing you are not using the furler. Furling the sail would really mess up performance.

With the drum bits removed we could attach the tack to the foredeck fitting aft of where the forestay attaches.

When you need to short sail you run the smaller jib up the second groove before lowering the genny.

Ours is set up so the primary sail - the genny is always in the port groove.

[maxingout]

I have a twin groove foil on my Proful system. I have never used both grooves at the same time because when you put the second sail on the foil, you can't use the roller furler. The second sail halyard would create a headstay wrap if you tried to use the roller furler.

I have two identical genoas that I have thought about hoisting on the same halyard, and that would work. It would allow use of the roller furler, but you would end up with a huge ball of sail on the roller furler if you rolled it up. And when you sailed on a beat or a reach, you would have the two sails on the same side of the yacht chafing against each other. After thinking about doing it, I decided it was a bad idea on Exit Only. It would be complicated tending sheets because you would have two sets of sheets for the genoas port and starboard. It's possible, but a little complicated for me when I sail offshore.

On the other hand, it would make a good double headsail downwind rig that you could easily furl as long as everything was hoisted on a single halyard.

My cardinal rule when sailing is to keep it as simple as possible.

[Joli]

Racing we used the twin foil all the time. The easiest was setting the new sail on the inner track and tacking over so the old sail again came down inside. Never seemed to work that way at 3 in the morning though.

If you want to set a second sail on the track for DDW ssailing it should be fine, just remember to use the track and halyard that match.

[s/v Jedi]

Racers only use furlers when single handed. They use special aerodynamic foils otherwise, like this one: Harken Carbo Racing Foils

About the halyard & 2 jib's thing: Just shackle both jibs to the swivel and hoist the combo. The difference between the 2 jibs is dealt with at the tack like this: hoist all the way up until the top swivel hits the top or anti-twist thingy; mark halyard and lower it 6 inches; use lashings with thin 1/8" spectra on the tacks of both jibs; tighten halyard and check that it just doesn't get all the way to the marked position. Furl both. I do this with a single jib too as it makes sure the swivel is high enough (halyard wrap can happen when it isn't).

However, I was told that there is a problem with this setup: you roll. If you create a slot between the two jibs where the air can escape, you eliminate most of that rolling. So, two old-fashioned parallel headstays with hank-on sails are the way to go ;-)

cheers,
Nick.

[Tantrum]

thanks for this thread...i was trying for the life of me why my schaeffer 2100 had 2 grooves!
not necessary for a cruiser like me!
Jim