Hypalon and Acetone

[djousset]

My Mercury Hypalon RIB was previously painted with Petit inflatable boat paint. The tubes became sticky mid/end of last season and attracted a fair amount of dirt. Stickiness is mostly gone while stored inside over the winter but the surface looks awful.

Was the stickiness likely due to improper painting technique?
Can I use acetone to clean it, and best practices to repaint?

Thx,D

[JPA Cate]

Hi, Diane,

Methylethylketone (MEK) is probably the best, but acetone will take it all off, with a very great lot of work.

Are you sure, though, that it is in fact hypalon? I've heard "hyperlon" used to describe PVC. And surface stickiness is often associated with PVC, as it loses plasticizer. I would not use either acetone or MEK if there is a chance that it is a PVC dinghy. You'd be better off to just accept that it doesn't look good than to lose the dinghy by dissolving its tubes.

Sorry.

Ann

[yeloya]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

Hi, Diane,

Methylethylketone (MEK) is probably the best, but acetone will take it all off, with a very great lot of work.

Acetone is dimethylketone and I don't think that MER is any different than acetone as chemical properties. I wouldn't use them anywhere on boat excluding to clean GRP residues. Hypalon is not PVC, it is modifed Polyethylene (Chlorosulfonated polyethylene) and its much more resistant to UV (also more expensive..) compared PVC dinghies. You can try isopropil alchool.

Cheers

Yeloya

[Avionics_Joe]

I had a friend use Acetone to clean his Hypalon RIB. He left it in the sun and all the the seams separated.

Please don't do it!

[JPA Cate]

I must apologize for not writing clearly.

I did not mean that hypalon and PVC are the same, but that I have heard people make the mistake of calling PVC hyperlon when in fact it is PVC.

@ yeloya: Do you think isopropyl alcohol would smooth the surface of the paint? Would you think methyl alcohol would be as good or better than isopropyl? Some places methyl alcohol is less expensive than isopropyl.

Ann

Jim and I have used acetone extensively to clean hypalon prior to putting on patches over leaks, but never to try and wash the whole dinghy. For us, part of the attractiveness of hypalon is that it stands up well to UV, whereas PVC does not, so much, although it varies according to quality of PVC used, and is also hard to find out about.

Iirc, the dinghy in question was a rescue dinghy, and I am sorely afraid that it may have been erroneously identified as hypalon and might be PVC. If it is the latter, don't go near it with MEK or acetone.

Gord May posted a post a while back with a test to determine which is which. Here's the link: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...on-102753.html

A.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by yeloya

Acetone is dimethylketone and I don't think that MEK is any different than acetone as chemical properties.

MEK and acetone are not the same thing and while in the same family have considerably different properties. MEK generally has higher solvent power depending on the substance being dissolved. MEK evaporates more slowly making it more practical to use in situations like this where it is being applied to a relatively large surface area.

[Iron E]

Originally Posted by Avionics_Joe

I had a friend use Acetone to clean his Hypalon RIB. He left it in the sun and all the the seams separated.

Please don't do it!

Yikes... But this makes sense. Acetone can be pretty strong/aggressive on petroleum based products.

Yes, I would guess that the paint used was unsuitable for the dinghy. With cleaning, I always start with the least aggressive methods and move my way up.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by Avionics_Joe

I had a friend use Acetone to clean his Hypalon RIB. He left it in the sun and all the the seams separated.

Please don't do it!

Hi, Avionics_Joe,

After the age of 20 yrs., according to something Wotname posted a few days ago, glued seam failure may occur for no good reason at all, something I had not heard before. I suppose it would depend on the glue used. MEK was the recommended cleaner for hypalon, prior to patching, and was used also to thin some of the glues for hypalon, but has since become almost totally unavailable in some places. Acetone is more readily obtained, does a good job of cleaning prior to pathing, AND I would not bathe a whole dinghy in it, way too expensive.

Actually, I think Iron E has a very good point: i. e. to start with the least likely to hurt the dinghy material for cleaning it. I'm not sure where <djousset> is, right now, and do not know what is available at her location. Please note that the link to Gord May's post contains a number of safe ways to learn the fabric of a dinghy.

Ann

[djousset]

@JPA Cate
Ann, thanks, your question prompted me to do some research. I was told it was hypalon but after looking into it I think it is likely PVC. I will read thru Gord's test to determine which it is. Either way I would like to try to clean it up at the least, and maybe repaint. Anyone know how aggressive you can get with abrasives like scotchbrite pads or very light sandpaper?

[Wotname]

To reiterate some of the above points.

Always start with the least aggressive chemical. Typically the toxicity of the chemical is proportional to its aggressiveness (sadly).

Common cleaners are water, saliva, detergents, various alcohols, various incarnations of 'white spirit' (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_...0in%20painting.), acetone, MEK, toluene.

Interestingly, human saliva (which is 99.5% water) is indeed very effective for cleaning away dirt and grime and is a principle solvent used by art conservators and by mother's of grubby children. See https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/....1990.35.3.153

[JPA Cate]

Hi, Diane,

The chemical used to thin the paint would work to soften it, then maybe a regular washrag?

Ann

PS. @ Wotname, thanks for the first principle, Wottie. I never had it described that way, and it makes perfect sense. We met a guy, once with the filthiest biofouled dinghy I ever saw. He was a chemist, and knew what he needed to clean it, and voila, the next time we saw the dinghy, it was shiny! Without the scritching and scraping Jim and I have always done. Better living through chemistry, as the DuPont Bros. used to say.

Ann

[GordMay]

FWIW: Mercury offers inflatables, with either PVC or Hypalon [CSM] fabrics.
Mercury Inflatable PVC boats are produced with Mehler Haku PVC fabric.
Mercury Inflatable HP boats are produced with Achilles Chlorosulfonated Polyethylene [CSM] fabric.
DuPont ‘Hypalon’ was a chlorosulfonated polyethylene synthetic [CSM].
➥ https://defender.com/assets/legacy-d...16_Catalog.pdf

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Wotname

Typically the toxicity of the chemical is proportional to its aggressiveness (sadly).

Nonflammable, nontoxic, effective, environmentally responsible. In the 1980s you could pick any two. Chemistry has improved so now you can pick any three.


2-Butoxyethanol is perhaps the closest thing to the perfect solvent. It has low vapor pressure, degrades quickly in the environment, and less toxic than most other solvents. It's a primary ingredient in "safer" cleaning products and thinners. Flammable though.

[Pete7]

When you have run out of ideas acetone will do nicely if its real hypalon. Just make sure you are wearing marigold gloves when doing it. Oh and preferably outside but not on the deck.

Just cleaned up an old Avon using it and a 2" flap well in a drill. The important bit is not to be afraid to abraid hypalon.

https://www.ribstore.co.uk/pages/how-to-repair-ribs

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by djousset

@JPA Cate
Ann, thanks, your question prompted me to do some research. I was told it was hypalon but after looking into it I think it is likely PVC. I will read thru Gord's test to determine which it is. Either way I would like to try to clean it up at the least, and maybe repaint. Anyone know how aggressive you can get with abrasives like scotchbrite pads or very light sandpaper?

It's PVC. That is why it got sticky (plasticizer migration). The Hypalon part of the discussion can be dropped.


I think you will find that there is no way to stop the migration. It's just getting old. Trying to clean it with solvent is a risk. It will also draw more plastisizer to the surface, which is not good for the vinyl and will mean cleaning again. The only smart move is a good scrub and accepting that boats don't need to be pretty. Would you use bleach to clean up a climbing rope? Certainly not. It is a tool for getting from point a to point b. Just enjoy the ride.