Anchor chain to rode splice

[Souzag818]

Hello all- Was reading a new thread posted by "teccs" concerning anchor chain, swivels etc and thought I'd ask the masses this. I've seen two different rope to chain splices. One is the mostly used three strands thru the last link on the chain then spliced back and tapered. This is what I have. The other one I've come across is taking the three strands and weaving them in and out of the chain links for a foot or so then whipping the ends to the chain. I've never seen it done on any anchor, but like the logic of spreading out the load and chafe, rather than having it concentrated on one link. Anybody have any experience with it?

[sailor_ed]

I use the woven splice and have for many years. I never liked the tight bend around the chain link in the tucked (back) splice. Also easier to do in older line.

[model 10]

The shovel splice (weaving it back through the links) is a little clunky. In a chain to rope splice you only need to use 2 strands, according to Mr. Toss.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Ecos

The shovel splice (weaving it back through the links) is clunky. Actually in a chain to rope splice you only use 2 strands, according to Mr. Toss.

What he said.


There is NO benefit in terms of chafe or strength.



The shovel splice is popular in the UK, for reasons I cannot fathom. I have used both, just to see.


There is a two-strand splice (AKA Irony Splice) that is very good if you have a windlass, but otherwise use the 3-strand splice. It is easier.

[HankOnthewater]

Like the above posters, I see no benefit in weaving the 3 strand rope through many links, except for when using old and stiff rope that is difficult to splice.

I use always the 3 strand splice, as displayed in this link: https://www.google.com.au/search?q=r...TF-8#kpvalbx=1
When one tapers all 3 strands over the last 3 tucks, it will go through a windlass easily. Note: the splice needs to be lot tighter than is shown in the video!

If one is concerned about the integrity of such splice, redo do it once a year. Then you can see how well it works: that there is little or no visible chafe! It will also keep your splicing skills up to date.

[StuM]

Like others say, there is no definitive answer to which is better. It's a matter of personal preference and how your gypsy handles the different type of join.


And BTW, the complete chain and rope is the "rode". The rope part is generally called the "warp", so your heading should be "Chain To Rope Splice" or "Chain To Warp Splice"

[Chuck Hawley]

Sometime in the 1990s, I made up approximately 20 sample splices for an article that I wrote for Practical Sailor. I sent the samples to New England Ropes, and they were kind enough to break them for me. I then wrote up my conclusions and that became the article.

https://www.ussailing.org/wp-content...plice_Test.pdf

As I recall, I made up 10 samples with 1/4" chain and 1/2" three-strand, and 10 samples with 5/16" chain and 5/8" three-strand. Each sample had an eye splice in the bitter end so that it could be attached to the test fixture. That was, obviously, a lot of splices.

I used three strand splices with four complete tucks and various methods of tapering the strands (3-2-1 splice or partially tapering the strands for two additional tucks.)

Virtually all of the samples broke at the tight bend in the splice, but they did so at strengths that were very close or in excess of the claimed strength of the line. The chain also showed strain: most samples were stretched from 1% to 10% or so (measuring the inside of the links of chain).

What I could not do, but may in the future, it to measure the effect of chafe. What I'd like to do is to create docklines with short lengths of chain at the dock cleats, and allow the boat to pull and ease the splices thousands of times.

My problem with the interweaving splice is that the nylon stretches so much that it doesn't transfer the tension over the length of the splice. It appears to spread the load, but I don't think that happens in practice.

Cheers,

Chuck

[toddster8]

My "test" was sitting on the foredeck all day, trying different splices and trying to get them to feed through the windlass. The only one that would work was weaving the rope through the chain, but I don't really like the way the whole thing seems to depend on (possibly questionable) whipping at the end to hold together. Seems highly chafe-able.
Of course, it's possible that it was the splicer and not the other splices that "failed." May try it again, one of these days with no wind.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by toddster8

My "test" was sitting on the foredeck all day, trying different splices and trying to get them to feed through the windlass. The only one that would work was weaving the rope through the chain, but I don't really like the way the whole thing seems to depend on (possibly questionable) whipping at the end to hold together. Seems highly chafe-able.
Of course, it's possible that it was the splicer and not the other splices that "failed." May try it again, one of these days with no wind.

I tried the same thing and got the reverse result. Many people have reported the same dichotomy. It seems to be windlass-specific.

[thinwater]

I've done some pull testing of splices as well, with similar results to those CH reported.


Has anyone heard of a rode splice failure? I've heard of...

• Rope chafe on bottom, roller side plates, and keel.
• Shackles failing or coming off.
• Thimbles shifting and cutting rope (though not quite through).
• Rusty chains breaking.
• Swivels breaking.
• Splices slipping out that were not whipped or lock stitched (though not in mooring applications). I've had this happen just from laundering lines during testing.

Just curious.

[sailor_ed]

Originally Posted by Chuck Hawley

Sometime in the 1990s, I made up approximately 20 sample splices for an article that I wrote for Practical Sailor. I sent the samples to New England Ropes, and they were kind enough to break them for me. I then wrote up my conclusions and that became the article.

https://www.ussailing.org/wp-content...plice_Test.pdf

As I recall, I made up 10 samples with 1/4" chain and 1/2" three-strand, and 10 samples with 5/16" chain and 5/8" three-strand. Each sample had an eye splice in the bitter end so that it could be attached to the test fixture. That was, obviously, a lot of splices.

I used three strand splices with four complete tucks and various methods of tapering the strands (3-2-1 splice or partially tapering the strands for two additional tucks.)

Virtually all of the samples broke at the tight bend in the splice, but they did so at strengths that were very close or in excess of the claimed strength of the line. The chain also showed strain: most samples were stretched from 1% to 10% or so (measuring the inside of the links of chain).

What I could not do, but may in the future, it to measure the effect of chafe. What I'd like to do is to create docklines with short lengths of chain at the dock cleats, and allow the boat to pull and ease the splices thousands of times.

My problem with the interweaving splice is that the nylon stretches so much that it doesn't transfer the tension over the length of the splice. It appears to spread the load, but I don't think that happens in practice.

Cheers,

Chuck

Thanks for all the work you put into that splicing!

You say that the line stretches too much in the woven splice to transfer the load to the chain do you mean that the splice would unravel from the chain before breaking? I may have to go back to the old back splice!

As an aside, can someone explain a "shovel splice"?

[parkstone bay]

I have tried the "weaving in and out of the links" system, and didn't especially like it with 3 strand rope. The geometry was difficult: chain is "paired", that is, when one link is vertical, the 2 adjacent links are horizontal. Therefore there is an even number of holes into which to weave an odd number of strands. It might be different with 8-plait, of course. The back-splice method is very easy to do.

[lancelot9898]

I use a modification of the 3 strand splice. In the typical 3 strand splice the strands are separated out with 2 strands going through the last chain link in one direction and the one strand being fed through the link in the opposite direction.

I never did like separating the strands out thinking that strength is being lost so I put a regular eye splice(without the metal insert) through that last chain link. It's difficult getting the intact line through the last link, but doable. I'm using 5/8 3 strand and 3/8 inch BBB chain. It is a tight bend around the chain, but so is the regular 3 strand approach and I reason that an intact line will be stronger that separating the lines apart. It is more bulky, but with a mechanical windless it present little problems and it did hold up during a Cat 1 hurricane. I've noticed no chafe, but should redo everything since the line is old. FWIW

[Souzag818]

Originally Posted by sailor_ed

Thanks for all the work you put into that splicing!

You say that the line stretches too much in the woven splice to transfer the load to the chain do you mean that the splice would unravel from the chain before breaking? I may have to go back to the old back splice!

As an aside, can someone explain a "shovel splice"?

Apparently the shovel splice is the name of the splice where the alternating strands of line go thru alternating links of chain for a foot or so, then the ends are whipped to the chain. That's the one I was initially inquiring about.

[thinwater]

The shovel splice nickname comes from bringing up a lot of mud.