Anchoring Protocol revised

[rabbi]

Originally Posted by refuge

When you join an anchorage you must assume that everyone has a 7 to 1 scope per the depth of the Anchorage. Double that to account for your own 7 to 1 and add a little bit for safe measure. If there is not enough room for you according to these guidelines then you should turn around and leave the anchorage. Sail all night if you have to.

ROFL

Based on these assumptions (1:7, swing circles not touching each other) you'll never drop anchor in the western Med between May and September at least.
If you do find such a spot it will last less than ten minutes before someone will park their charter boat 10m away with a 1:2 scope.

[Steve Bedford]

“Perhaps seasoned cruisers could offer help and advice to new cruisers while everyone should encourage charterers to practice their docking techniques in the marina.”

Really? So that statement assumes that folks who charter are less seasoned and therefore should not anchor so more seasoned cruiser and everyone (that includes new cruisers) should encourage charterers to dock? There are many very seasoned cruisers all over the world who do not take their own personal vessel to another part of the world and choose to charter in the new location. There are many times these folks are new to cruising and this could be a challenge for all. However, the individuals we charter with are all in the category of very skilled experienced cruisers who like to leave their own personal vessel at home and go somewhere else in the world to cruise.

We have to be careful as to generalizations.

Steve

[rabbi]

Originally Posted by Steve Bedford

“Perhaps seasoned cruisers could offer help and advice to new cruisers while everyone should encourage charterers to practice their docking techniques in the marina.”

Really? So that statement assumes that folks who charter are less seasoned and therefore should not anchor so more seasoned cruiser and everyone (that includes new cruisers) should encourage charterers to dock? There are many very seasoned cruisers all over the world who do not take their own personal vessel to another part of the world and choose to charter in the new location. There are many times these folks are new to cruising and this could be a challenge for all. However, the individuals we charter with are all in the category of very skilled experienced cruisers who like to leave their own personal vessel at home and go somewhere else in the world to cruise.

We have to be careful as to generalizations.

Steve

?? The vast majority of charter people I met sail one or two weeks per year at the most.

Many just sail a week every few years. Often its 8 of them onboard, so do the math how often each of them has docked or anchored.


Your chart groups is from my experience a very rare exception.

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by refuge

If there are no parking spaces then you leave the parking lot.



When you join an anchorage you must assume that everyone has a 7 to 1 scope per the depth of the Anchorage. Double that to account for your own 7 to 1 and add a little bit for safe measure. If there is not enough room for you according to these guidelines then you should turn around and leave the anchorage. Sail all night if you have to. If it’s an emergency then run a 2nd anchor off the stern with the dinghy and make sure you are firmly planted away from everyone else’s swing area and post a watch all night to be prudent.



Commercial ships do not anchor closer than a half mile. Even that is extremely close. If a ship is already anchored it is the duty of the most recently anchoring ship to assure they remain clear of vessels already at anchor. The same applies for all boats and ignorance is not an excuse in a court of law.

I can’t agree with you on this. It’s circumstantial based on the shelter, the holding, the weather, and what everyone else is doing. Following your guidelines there are areas you’d never be able to anchor and you’d have to travel hundreds of miles to find a place you could.

And as for commercial ships, you must have not seen the anchorage for Norfolk outside the harbor. Can be cheek to jowl with big ships, way more dense than every half mile.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Suijin

I can’t agree with you on this. It’s circumstantial based on the shelter, the holding, the weather, and what everyone else is doing. Following your guidelines there are areas you’d never be able to anchor and you’d have to travel hundreds of miles to find a place you could.

And as for commercial ships, you must have not seen the anchorage for Norfolk outside the harbor. Can be cheek to jowl with big ships, way more dense than every half mile.

Space is nice, but you don't always get it.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by thinwater

Space is nice, but you don't always get it.

And sometimes the circles diameters overlap each circle’s foci. IOW, sometimes you swing over your neighbour’s anchor. This is fine as long as everyone anchors appropriately and similarly. Of course, it can cause problems with those on rope rode if wind/current goes to very light. This is why I say if you’re the lone boat swinging oddly, then it doesn’t matter if you the first one in, you need to change.

BTW, I really prefer anchorages that are remote and uncluttered. But as the song goes, you don’t always get what you want.

[CaptFigmo]

It's called the RULE OF TONNAGE.
A much larger vessel generally comes out on top.
Try passing a freighter approaching from your post side.
.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by foggysail

7:1 may be true in many foreign harbors. Consider a scope of 7:1 in a depth of 20’ and a 40’ boat. The swing radius (approx... don’t feel like doing the trig) 140’ + 40’ for a radius of 180’ or a swing circle of 360’; well over the length of a football field! Now calculate how many boats can fit into that harbor and to make matters worse, some may be using both bow and stern anchors. That has to be fun!

I boat in MA and around New England so relate to the issue of crowded harbors. However, in my opinion, fitting more boats into a harbor is entirely secondary to safely anchoring the boat.

Seems completely wrong to shorten scope to a degree that compromises safety so more boats can fit in the harbor and create even more risk.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by skipmac

I boat in MA and around New England so relate to the issue of crowded harbors. However, in my opinion, fitting more boats into a harbor is entirely secondary to safely anchoring the boat.

Seems completely wrong to shorten scope to a degree that compromises safety so more boats can fit in the harbor and create even more risk.

+1 on this too

I get it that in deep anchorages the old 5 or 7:1 rule can be relaxed, but for most anchorages in the under 30’ range, I would only shorten rode if I was very certain of the forecast. And since forecasts are rarely good out past three days, I would only do this for a short-term stay.

No matter how good your anchor is, and some are better than others, it’s still only a pointy hunk of metal without adequate scope.

[foggysail]

Originally Posted by skipmac

I boat in MA and around New England so relate to the issue of crowded harbors. However, in my opinion, fitting more boats into a harbor is entirely secondary to safely anchoring the boat.

Seems completely wrong to shorten scope to a degree that compromises safety so more boats can fit in the harbor and create even more risk.

I also do my boating in Massachusetts where there are open harbors where you can have a scope of 20 if desired such as Boston away from the crowds. Then there are places such as Cuttyhunk or Lake Tashmo both small, frequently very crowded and you have to compromise to either anchor or get a mooring if available.

Your statement on safety should be a concern to everyone. If your anchor cannot provide you with comfort on shorter scopes than obviously you should avoid those situations.

[kerrydeare]

I'm simply amazed that an anchoring thread can generate such diverse, conflicting, and ultimately confusing responses to this simple everyday situation.

What is this world coming to?

[Don C L]

Well I know we are the odd ones out here, but when the local norm is that everyone puts down bow and stern anchors, as it is around the local islands, we all fit pretty well and issues of swing don't come up... we generally get along pretty well, and sleep pretty well, as a result. But we still may have other disputes
We occasionally see folks traveling through who grumble about having to set a stern anchor and I wonder... why?

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Don C L

:
We occasionally see folks traveling through who grumble about having to set a stern anchor and I wonder... why?

Maybe they are in larger boats without a stern anchor windlass and the thought of manhandling 100+ lb of anchor onboard is worth grumbling about.

What happens when you get the inevitable 2am 50 knot storm blow in from a different direction or does no one ever consider that?

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by skipmac

I boat in MA and around New England so relate to the issue of crowded harbors. However, in my opinion, fitting more boats into a harbor is entirely secondary to safely anchoring the boat.

Seems completely wrong to shorten scope to a degree that compromises safety so more boats can fit in the harbor and create even more risk.

Seems like very poor seamanship to me and there is so much of it in these days of anyone with a pulse being able to get a boat.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

... This is why I say if you’re the lone boat swinging oddly, then it doesn’t matter if you the first one in, you need to change....

However, that is NOT what the law says. You need provide a clear berth for any vessel that was there before you. Period. The only exceptions seem to be if you drag or otherwise re-anchor (increasing scope, for example, is re-anchoring).


There is always the general duty clause that says you should do what you can to avoid collision, but that is secondary.


Complicated. If it were me I would simply add a light kellet, which solves the problem. Easily done. But for the person anchored with chain to blame-shift is rather like claiming the "rule of tonage" when you are 5 feet longer. It's a really weak claim.