Anchors, Guns and Strippers!!!!

[SV__Grace]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

Prefer non roll bar for various reasons. Even though I have a Rocna Original my old boat. Don't know anything about a Vulcan but might look into it. Looks very....powerboatish? Not much to lash down in a seaway?

HA! We learned this the hard way offshore when our Vulcan jumped the bow roller and gashed our bow as we bashed North going the wrong way from CA to PNW. The additional pounding after the initial damage wore away the surrounding gelcoat and fiberglass and we ended up with a 14 inch gash that went all the way through to our anchor locker. Cost us $1,200.00 to professionally repair the damage and repaint the gelcoat and sheer stripe.

Lesson learned- secure the anchor when offshore or inshore in hairy conditions.

The Vulcan has two holes useful for lashing- one at the top middle of the fluke that looks like it's for a trip line, and one on the forward part of the shank, that is used for tandem anchoring (we use this hole for our trip line and have a shackle permanently attached there for that purpose).

The Vulcan works well for anchor rollers in bowsprits that can't accommodate a roll bar. Power boats often have a small bowsprit for their anchor rollers but so do sailboats like us!

I loved the Rocna with the roll bar and have had several of them on previous boats. The Vulcan is a well designed anchor without the roll bar that doesn't behave the same as the roll bar version.

Setting the roll bar version of the Rocna I've found to be easy and 100% reliable. Drop it and it bites immediately.

Setting the Vulcan I found to require a bit of technique as it doesn't like to be dragged when setting (moving backwards faster than the rode is let out), which is mentioned in the owners manual but I learned the hard way (because, as is typical, I didn't read the manual!). Also, according to the manual, which I confirmed the hard way, the Vulcan requires a minimum 5:1 scope to set. Once it's set well you can shorten up if needed.

As mentioned in my previous post, we love our Vulcan and have never dragged once it's well set, tested in many gales up to 60 knots.

[Wulf]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

OK now that I have your attention maybe just anchors...

Now that was just plain cruel.....

On a serious note, you can’t go wrong with moving up a notch or two in size. It’s your boat and you have to sleep well with your choice. And it’s a heavy boat. Adding the equivalent of about 3 gallons of fuel (couple of 24 packs of beer?) for the additional peace of mind won’t even be perceptible on the boat’s performance.
Ignore the dock walkers. While many “know it all”, they’re not the ones hanging on your hook.

[tarian]

Originally Posted by michaeld

We have the sister ship of Kretchmer's Quetzal with a 33Kg Rocna. I don't care if anyone thinks it's too big. Afterall, ground tackle is like brakes on a car.Attachment 206706

And one would not over brake a car, as this could lead to accidents, and fatalities, that is why those in the know the manufactures, have a good guideline and we as paranoid sailors go one size up.
A heavy bow will impair performance to the boat , a overlarge anchor will cause problems to the windlass if not calibrated to the size of anchor , and will cause major problems with a power outage.
This sense of bigger the better is the usual tripe from men who seems to be thinking between their legs , as the old proverb goes it aint the size but what you do with it .!!!
Learn to anchor properly , understand your chain or rode , watch the weather and react accordingly and you will find no problems with anchoring

[trimarannaga]

As a retired (gun-carrying) stripper, i too want to have my say about anchors. Go as big as you like who cares what the neighbors think. But when your windlass breaks down, can you still get it up?
Personally i havent had a windlass on my boats and been sailing and anchoring continuously for more than 40 years. That means NOT an oversized anchor, because I have to manually pull up all that weight.
So if you go BIG just make sure you can still get it up. After all, its not size that matters, its how you set it.

[Scubaseas]

and you will find no problems with anchoring

Unless you pick up a garbage bag, or a tire or a stick on the tip of your anchor. Or have the luck to anchor in thin mud over rock.



Windlass I have is rated 800bs continuous pull. I can go up two sizes without frying the motor on it. 28 more lbs isn't going to kill my electrical power. I doubt the same extra 28 lbs will overly effect the performance of a 40000+ lb boat.

[SVTwilight]

My wife’s sister has a Tayana 42 we sail on. We gave them an extra Rocna 55 that we had and they use 3/8” chain. If it were my boat and I was living aboard I would not hesitate to use a 66. I would definitely not use 5/16 chain on that boat. Use Acco G4 3/8. What you read is imho correct, two sizes up for the anchor is good advice. Do it and enjoy peaceful sleep!

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

Thanks to all for the replies.

Primary bower will be on 200' of 3/8" G4 plus 150' 3/4" plait. The large Fortress would be a kedge/mud/secondary anchor. I also have a third anchor and rode at the stern.

New to me boat came with one 44# Lewmar Claw on 200' of 5/16" chain (no markings) and one knock off 45#ish Bruce on 90' of 5/16" Chinesium chain and 150' of 1/2" 3 strand. Not fond of the Bruce especially that small. Choice for me was either Spade or Sarca Excel. Bigger Sacra Excel will fit roller better and would be easier to re-galvanize if needed. I used a Delta for many years on my old boat without but one complaint. I also consider the 5/16" chain to be a bit undersized for 42' and 40000#. So new gypsy and rodes.

Appreciate the validation that bigger is better when it comes to a primary anchor.

[wrwakefield]

Al,

Our 43ft ketch is similar in size to yours, and our cruising weight is 44,000+ lbs [measured.]

We play in mid and higher latitudes, and therefore our anchorages average ~50-90 ft depth...

I am also very conservative about selecting ground tackle.

While we carry a selection of anchors [6], I chose a 45Kg Spade [S180] as primary bower. [+2 sizes up from manufacurer charts- in consultation with Spade... The bow platform could accommodate a S200, 55Kg model... ]

The S180 has been exceptional in all circumstances we have experienced it with [including force 12.] After ~ 1000 anchorings, it shows no sign of poor galvanizing. [The yellow paint on the 'tractor seat' is still mostly intact too...]

I have read credible accounts of Spade providing field coating kits, and even replacing anchors with extreme rust under their lifetime warranty.

I wouldn't hesitate to replace it with same if I ever lost it.

If you want more details, photos, and many external references, see our ground tackle inventory page.

I am only sharing what I decided. You have several to choose from that may provide similar results.

Cheers! Bill

[michaeld]

Yes, we have a pivoting anchor roller.

[Mike Banks]

Have bigger anchors but only a few of them, main heavyweight bower, two auxiliary of about 50% size of main bower, and chain-rigged so they can be series-tandem mounted, two kellets of about 15 KG and two reef claws, which you can get fabricated yourself. I make them in two main pieces from a detachable shaft held with transverse bolt through shaft and sleeve--to which the tines are attached by welding. The first part with tye tines is held to the second loosely by a length of chain. If the anchor fouls, if one can not dive on it, one can exert enough pressure to shear the bolt, when the anchor should come free as a shaft chained to a wheel with curved but bendable tines.

My kellets are made from a heavy duty galvanised eye-bolt, two large galvanised nuts and two large galvanised washers to fit the eye bolt, which should be as long as possible, say two feet. The weights I choose these days are wheel weights bought in pairs as a rule at flea markets or second-hand charity stores from those who have quit weight training. The finished article is an anchor by itself for some soft bottoms, if you can get a long enough bolt--but as a kellet these are excellent indeed..

Carry a spare propeller with nut and key,
Guns of the flare variety only.
Always have as much beer as possible aboard. AND rum--cold and wet needs rum and essence of cloves--mixed and good for what ails yer--
Strippers always welcomed aboard. No marine electrician should be without one, maybe even two of 'em.

[sailorboy1]

I scanned through the thread quick haven't seen any thing about strippers

[Mike Banks]

I agree 3/8 chain is WAY too light for a vessel of that size and displacement. Half inch is a minimum--and not crappy cheap chain either--you need one with x-ray tested links and made of high quality hot dipped galvanised steel, NOT STAINLESS.

The extras money spent in having excellent heavy-duty ground tackle is a CHEAP insurance policy both for life and vessel.

I had a 60 pounds Manson on my vessel with half-inch chain--and it would have weighed HALF of the Tayana's laden weight.

I hope they never have to use their minimal tackle in even a moderate storm.

[Tayana42]

ScubaSeas, on my Tayana42 aft cockpit I have a Ronca 25 (55 lbs) roll bar anchor on 330 ft of 3/8” chain. I would have gone up to 33kg (73 lbs) but the shank was too long to fit between the roller and the lids for the anchor/windlass well. So do be careful to measure that clearance for your anchor choice. I’ve yet to encounter conditions in which the 55 lb Rocna was not up to the job. Still I agree bigger is better. If the Excel was available here when I was refitting ground tackle I’d probably have gone for one up a size. Best of luck and enjoy your Tayana.

[michaeld]

Tarian,

Thank you for the troll. You MUST be an expert. What size anchor do you recommend that we use? I'm confident that all subscribers of this thread will be waiting with bated breath to read your words of wisdom.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Tayana42

ScubaSeas, on my Tayana42 aft cockpit I have a Ronca 25 (55 lbs) roll bar anchor on 330 ft of 3/8” chain. I would have gone up to 33kg (73 lbs) but the shank was too long to fit between the roller and the lids for the anchor/windlass well. So do be careful to measure that clearance for your anchor choice. I’ve yet to encounter conditions in which the 55 lb Rocna was not up to the job. Still I agree bigger is better. If the Excel was available here when I was refitting ground tackle I’d probably have gone for one up a size. Best of luck and enjoy your Tayana.

My Rafiki is a bit smaller than your boats guys, but she weighs in at 30,000#. I've used a Rocna 25 for going on a decade now, anchoring in a wide range of sometimes challenging conditions (ex. Newfoundland). Rode is also 3/8" chain. I have never dragged once set.

This said, if/when I replace my bower I will definitely go up one or more sizes. The reason is simple; me (and my spouse), my windlass, and roller can manage more without any significant additional effort.

Originally Posted by michaeld

Tarian, Thank you for the troll. You MUST be an expert. What size anchor do you recommend that we use? I'm confident that all subscribers of this thread will be waiting with bated breath to read your words of wisdom.

Yeah... no one takes that kind of post seriously.

[Scubaseas]

Thanks to all and especially to SVTwilight and Tayana42. Nice to hear from people that have knowledge of the boat.