Bridle to Anchor Rope - HOW?

[svrevelations]

On our catamaran, we have 300' of stainless steel anchor chain spliced to 600' of polyester anchor rope. Say we anchor in deep water of 70 feet - wanting a scope of 1:7, we will let all the anchor chain out and about another 190 feet of anchor rope.

We now want to tie the bridle to the anchor rope. The hookup must not slip and we must be able to untie/unknot the bridle later.

But how and what knot is best to use in this situation?

[Dsanduril]

When we get to line rode we use a rolling hitch to attach the bridle to the anchor rode. Been through a lot of blows in a lot of anchorages without a slip or a problem. When you look at the rolling hitch make sure you tie it the correct direction - it will slide one direction but not the other. So, you tie it to slide toward the anchor.

[bvisailing32]

We are monohull sailors, but I have watched the catamarans slowly approaching their mooring.

They do not tie in anything, I believe they have snap shackles, on both the port and starboard bow mooring lines, and attach them to the eye of the mooring line that is attached to the mooring can. Im am a ways off, but that is what the procedure appeared to be from our vessel.

Some of the pretty darned quick.

When you get your vessel check out, the charter co. staff, will go over all of that , you will be quite familiar.

The problems that I saw, was if the Cat skipper was too fast, and there was no practicing of hand signals from the crew who were picking up the mooring. Not good.

They would run up and over the mooring can and mooring line that were now deep beneath the deck of the cat back to about midships.

But, the crews who had good skippers and had trained the crew, easy peasy, smooth, and quiet, no shouting, no screaming engines, no goat rope.


On the mono hull, I have two bridles set up at the bow, port and starboard, and Erica is at the helm. We use hand signals and it all works out very professionally. And we have two separate bridles, just in case.

The only knots that I tie, are proper cleat hitches to the port and starboard bow cleats, and then Flemish out the tails of the bow lines.


You will actually have it easier, and be much quicker in your mooring pick up than we were.

Then it is jimmy buffet time, and a nice cold mooring pick up brew.

[bvisailing32]

Oh, a tip on rolling hitches.....( as mentioned above....a great nautical knot to use in many situations )


making the turns, 2 below and 1 above. ( same direction ) The two below will be toward what you are tying to. Same for fenders tied to a life line. Two below and one above.

[transmitterdan]

Rolling hitch is the "standard" knot for this. A rolling hitch can be used to attach the working end of the snubber which should already have the bitter end made fast to the apex of the bridle. The snubber should be long enough (25-40 feet) and made from nylon so it will act as a shock absorber. I use 3 strand nylon of 3/8" for "normal" anchoring and 1/2" for serious weather. The snubber should not be oversized much.

For safety you can hitch another safety line to the rode closer to the anchor locker as a backup to the bridle snubber in case it breaks. A rolling hitch works just as good on polyester rope as it does on chain. It will not work well on "slippery" material like dyneema.

Rolling Hitch | How to tie the Rolling Hitch | Scouting Knots

[SailFastTri]

Rolling hitch is well proven. I don't use it. As my preferred alternative I use two loops of 1/4" Dyneema, each wrapped on the rode in Prussic knot fashion, and heavy duty snap hooks to attach my bridle legs. One loop for each leg.

When I take a transient mooring I also use the same setup to attach to the mooring.

[model 10]

[QUOTE=transmitterdan;2171539] The snubber should be long enough (25-40 feet) and made from nylon so it will act as a shock absorber. I use 3 strand nylon of 3/8" for "normal" anchoring and 1/2" for serious weather. The snubber should not be oversized much.

Did you happen to catch the question, How to tie on to 490' of rode? 190' of that was rope. I don't think you need to worry about a snubber.

[svrevelations]

Thank you for your comments - although some answers are not quite inline with the question. But I get the drift and thank you for your efforts.

Originally Posted by SailFastTri

Rolling hitch is well proven. I don't use it. As my preferred alternative I use two loops of 1/4" Dyneema, each wrapped on the rode in Prussic knot fashion, and heavy duty snap hooks to attach my bridle legs. One loop for each leg.

When I take a transient mooring I also use the same setup to attach to the mooring.

This sounds like a good setup for us.
However, your dyneema loops which you tie to the anchor rope - does the dyneema not slip up the anchor line (especially when under load)?

[SailFastTri]

Originally Posted by Revelations

Snip

This sounds like a good setup for us.
However, your dyneema loops which you tie to the anchor rope - does the dyneema not slip up the anchor line (especially when under load)?

No a Prussic under tension does not slip. I think it's got even better grip than a rolling hitch, but I've never done a scientific test. 1/4" Dyneema has a rated breaking strength of about 5,000 pounds, which is plenty for each bridle leg of my 12 meter tri, considering the main rode serves as "backup". It's actually thicker when you factor in the bury of the splices. You don't want to go too thick, or it might not grab as well. I think it helps to have it press into the line a bit.

[model 10]

If you don't drop it in the ocean the prussic loop works great. Some of the turns fit into the 3 strand so it grabs well. The tighter it gets the better it works so no problem there. The only thing is, you need another connection, whereas with a knot you just have the one. Not on rope but on chain I have had a rolling hitch jamb. The icicle hitch never jambs.

[transmitterdan]

The Prussic will probably not slip but one cannot easily remove it in a hurry. When the rolling hitch comes aboard it can be thrown off in a few seconds without access to the bitter end. The Prussic is not easily tossed aside when you are in a rush to get the anchor up.

To another observant soul, yes, I noted that they have some rope rode. But it is polyester and thus not "stretchy".

[Schooner Chandlery]

A rolling hitch is the obvious choice, yes.

I'm not a big fan of Prussics because they can slip. Years ago when my husband and I used to do a lot of climbing and spelunking we used a knot (in place of the Prussic) that was 3 wraps and then a bowline. It slips up the line just fine (similar to a noose) but can't slide down the line. No idea what it's called but I liked it as a Prussic isn't always under tension and oops--it CAN slip.

[svrevelations]

Originally Posted by transmitterdan

The Prussic will probably not slip but one cannot easily remove it in a hurry. When the rolling hitch comes aboard it can be thrown off in a few seconds without access to the bitter end. The Prussic is not easily tossed aside when you are in a rush to get the anchor up.

To another observant soul, yes, I noted that they have some rope rode. But it is polyester and thus not "stretchy".

The bridle is nylon and each leg is around 15'. Besides this, there is also the weight of the chain lying on the ocean floor which gets lifted when under load - plenty of cushioning effect.

[thinwater]

Although there are many anecdotal success stories wit ht he rolling hitch, if you talk to enough cruisers you will also get stories of slipping.

Gripping Hitches for Loaded Lines - Practical Sailor Print Edition Article

Hitches to Grip Anchor Chain - Practical Sailor Print Edition Article

I did some of this testing and watched them slip. I like the camel hitch and the prusik hitch. Both are fast, each having different advantages.

There are improved versions.

[transmitterdan]

Originally Posted by Revelations

The bridle is nylon and each leg is around 15'. Besides this, there is also the weight of the chain lying on the ocean floor which gets lifted when under load - plenty of cushioning effect.

Depending on the size of the bridle line it may not be very stretchy and fifteen feet is not enough to have a good cushion. The chain is not a good cushion either when it really matters. The snubber is there for those times when the chain is tight. Once the wind pulls the chain tight there isn't any more give and the ground tackle snatches up hard exactly when you don't want things to break. The long rubbery nylon snubber provides a good shock absorber under even the worst conditions.

This is a rather old writeup but it is still useful:

Tuning an Anchor Rode