Do We Have Anchoring All Wrong?

[GrowleyMonster]

Originally Posted by Dark Horse

This qualifies as a total fail... Not sure what you tell the captain.

Oh, he knew. Probably he was on the bridge and he or the mate on watch, whoever had the con, failed to maneuver appropriately and placed too much strain on the chain while it was "on the brake". Once the brakeband overheated, that's all she wrote.

Early in my career on US flagged cargo ships, I witnessed a witless excuse for a bosun break the brakeband trying to stop a running anchor chain, and this was only the day after HE greased both windlasses and presumably inspected them as well. The comical thing was, even when it was obvious that it was having no effect, he kept cranking and cranking and cranking away on the brake handle, with a puzzled look on his face. I wasn't quite sure what to do, but it was obvious that he didn't know, so I walked over and dropped the pawl on the runaway chain. Probably not a super bright idea, either, but it held without shattering. Anchor was on the bottom and after running free for about 4 extra shots, it was of course slack, just dead weight. We changed the brakeband once we were fetched up good, and alles klaar. The first links of the next to last shot of chain were just visible down in the spillpipe. The last shot is painted red, the next to the last shot is painted yellow, normally. So kind of a close call. So, we had about 10 shots of chain at the cat, and the Capt wanted three at the hawse.

Sorry, I called that idiot a Bosun and that was an inaccurate statement. He was no Bosun. He just had the job because nobody else wanted it and he did, and the Capt and CM were both fresh out of the Navy, ink still wet on their licenses, and the witless one happened to have been in the Navy as well, so they sort of spoke the same language.

Anyway, thanks for posting the video. Mrs Monster loves to see interesting ship videos because I was still sailing when we met.

[GrowleyMonster]

Originally Posted by motion30

Exactly what I was thinking. Same with the large charter motor yachts

Most ship engines are direct drive. To reverse, the engine is stopped and then started in the opposite direction. To stop the screw, the engine is stopped. Any time the engine is running, then the screw is turning. So for most ships, no, the engine is not running. However there is either a duty engineer to call, or an engineer on watch, and there is a Mate and at least one AB on watch. The lay and strain on the chain are checked regularly, surroundings are checked by eye and by radar, and ship's position and head are monitored. Smaller commercial vessels will have a similar arrangement, but usually just one man on watch. Engines will seldom be left running on anchor. Air or electric start small diesels generally require little or no notice for start and as often or not can be started from the bridge.

A watch is kept for the safety of the vessel, which is still a concern whether the engine is running or not. Fishing vessels excepted, of course.

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by Sailing Ohm

How isn’t that racist? Seriously dude. By continuously using an antiquated racial derived term you are doing nothing but continuing the negativity. Surely the company who makes this product does not Label and sell them as ‘niggerheads’. The common name is a capstan not a ‘niggerhead’ as you’ve stated. It might be the common name among racists but outside of them it surely wasn’t.
Get your head out of your ass and quit hiding behind the notion of historical correctness. You could have easily omitted that and simply called it a capstan. Why feel the need to perpetuate a racially charged label?

Yes, the use of the n-word is particularly fraught these days, unless you’re a black rapper or reality-TV star. Oh well.

‘Boat nigger’ was a common term in racing yacht circles to denote the (generally) young person whose full time job is to take care of the boat between races, help deliver it places, and basically do all the dull and messy chores that need doing. Sometimes they’re part of the race crew.

But a few years ago one of the women on the show ‘Real Housewives of Auckland’ called another contestant a boat ******. The context was fine (they were on a boat and the recipient was doing something menial) but unfortunately the recipient is black. Sigh, cue the outrage. https://thespinoff.co.nz/tv/25-07-20...racist-infamy/

From my place of ultimate privilege (male, white, educated, relatively wealthy, etc, etc) I don’t see the racism of that term, but then as a child I used to watch and laugh at Sanford and Son https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanford_and_Son. I’m an unrepentant racist I guess.

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by fxykty

Yes, the use of the n-word is particularly fraught these days, unless you’re a black rapper or reality-TV star. Oh well.

‘Boat ******’ was a common term in racing yacht circles to denote the (generally) young person whose full time job is to take care of the boat between races, help deliver it places, and basically do all the dull and messy chores that need doing. Sometimes they’re part of the race crew.

But a few years ago one of the women on the show ‘Real Housewives of Auckland’ called another contestant a boat ******. The context was fine (they were on a boat and the recipient was doing something menial) but unfortunately the recipient is black. Sigh, cue the outrage. https://thespinoff.co.nz/tv/25-07-20...racist-infamy/

From my place of ultimate privilege (male, white, educated, relatively wealthy, etc, etc) I don’t see the racism of that term, but then as a child I used to watch and laugh at Sanford and Son https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanford_and_Son. I’m an unrepentant racist I guess.

Yes, you are. And you took the time to type it out. How is this funny?

We all grew up with baggage. As adults we decide what to act on.

[Dsanduril]

I've seen (and contributed to) some wild turns in thread subjects in my time, but from anchoring to the 'N' word, wow, that has to be some kind of record.

Ohh, and the correct term (for at least the last 30 years) for the person doing all the menial tasks on the boat after the race is 'BMW' (boat maintenance worker). Only insults a car company, and can be spun in so many favorable ways...

[Mickeyrouse]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

But, as I cast my mind back over our travels I see some commonality. The near shore (a few miles to a few tens of miles) fishing fleets around the world seem to be boats of sizes similar to ours. The shrimpers of Mexico and the US Gulf Coast (40-60'), the crayfish boats of NZ (35-50'), the longliners of Indonesia (30-60').

I can you by observation that Gulf shrimpers almost invariably use a Northhill, or something very similar, usually welded up where the boat was built. Due to the lack of inlets along the Gulf rim, I can also tell you they anchor very rarely- don’t think I’ve ever seen more than two or three at anchor in 46 years. If the weather starts getting bad, they either ride it out or go home.

[Seymore]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

And yet the setup used by commercial fishermen here in Alaska, who collectively spend a lot of nights at anchor in some pretty inhospitable settings, doesn't remotely match anything we discuss here. Most of these boats are 30-60', similar in size to a lot of the cruising fleet, with a few seiners that go to about 80'.

What is the bottom like, generally, in Alaska? Is it always rock and hard sand? Is there much soft mud?

[GrowleyMonster]

Originally Posted by Mickeyrouse

I can you by observation that Gulf shrimpers almost invariably use a Northhill, or something very similar, usually welded up where the boat was built. Due to the lack of inlets along the Gulf rim, I can also tell you they anchor very rarely- don’t think I’ve ever seen more than two or three at anchor in 46 years. If the weather starts getting bad, they either ride it out or go home.

Most gulf shrimpers anchor every day. Drag at night, when brown shrimp are most active. Anchor after dumping the last drag on deck, unless you are running to a different spot. Inshore is different. They are working white shrimp and juvenile brownies, and so they will be more likely to drag during the daytime, or around the clock. Bay boats often go out for day trips only, and so do not anchor.

Offshore boats anchor where they fish, often in over 200' of water. Particularly in fall and winter. Summer time will see the offshore boats in much shallower water but still usually at least 60'. The inshore guys will usually be smaller boats, under 65' or so. Most offshore boats will be at least 70' LOA with a few at around 100'. The modern trend is for bigger steel freezer boats, for offshore work. The longest you can keep shrimp on ice is about 20 days. A freezer setup lets you make longer trips. Inshore, especially during the season, a freezer can't handle the huge volume of smaller shrimp, and crew fatique and injury is a bigger factor so shorter trips are more common, and so more inshore boats will be ice boats.

Don't confuse offshore and inshore or inland fisheries. Offshore boats anchor almost every day, and not in coves or inlets.

[Icarus]

Originally Posted by Dsanduril

There's a lot of arguing back-and-forth here on CF about anchoring (that and guns may even be what keeps the lights on). What is the best/right anchor? Rode? How much/how heavy? How do you drop it? Set it? Attach a bridle?

And yet the setup used by commercial fishermen here in Alaska, who collectively spend a lot of nights at anchor in some pretty inhospitable settings, doesn't remotely match anything we discuss here. Most of these boats are 30-60', similar in size to a lot of the cruising fleet, with a few seiners that go to about 80'.

• Anchor - For boats over ~35' (10m) this is universally a Forfjord. Under that length and you start to see some Bruce/Bruce knock-offs although many/most of the smaller boats still use a Forfjord.
• Windlass - Universally a drum winch. Larger boats always hydraulic, a few smaller boats use electric.
• Rode - A length of heavy chain attached to the anchor and long enough to just reach the drum. This chain is about 1/2" to 1" and may be stud-link. This is connected to coil chain in similar sizes to our use (1/4" to 1/2" depending on boat size). In about half the cases the rode is all chain, in the rest some chain (usually around a boat-length) is backed up by Dyneema (or other, less expensive UHMWPE - drum winches list their Dyneema capacity). Specifically, there is little to no dynamic stretch and with the rope/chain combination little catenary.
• Swivel - For the most part none, although a few boats have giant industrial swivels.
• Snubber - Pretty much none.

There are no Mantus/Rocna/Manson/Spade anchors to be seen. No roll bars. There is no stretch to found in the rode, even when it is chain-to-rope. Never a windlass/gypsy that has to be matched to the chain. No chain stops. Few belaying points for the rode other than the drum (which are advertised as having positive dog stops). A completely different approach to the consensus (is there one?) opinion(s) here on CF.


Typical setup on a small gillnetter.


And on a larger boat.


Close up of large chain leading to smaller on drum.

Do we have it all wrong? Is our use case so different that a different configuration is required? How did two so wildly different techniques come out of what seems to be a common need?

and

Very true, I guess commercial vessel operators don't have the inclination of slugging it out on a forum and the anchor gear they use has it's foundation in lots of experience in diverse conditions.
Obviously boating has gone a bit boutique over the last 40 odd years leaning towards floating caravans and associated advertising of must have ' new generation ' equipment et.
Be it as it may each to their own.
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