How Close Is Too Close?

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

It now seems obvious to me and most others, that you've never actually anchored your boat in a busy anchorage.

Yet you feel compelled to continue arguing with those of us who do it on a regular basis. I'm glad I'm in the Med.

"One doesn't need to know geometry to anchor a boat...". Really? Yikes!

It pules me that you assume to speak for "most others". It also pules me that you feel the need to continue to insult me.

I too are glad you are in the Med. Perhaps things are different there than where I cruise and anchor. Different conditions may suggest different techniques.

As for geometry, you decide what scope you need and anchor the boat. No need to make things harder than they need to be.

[Simonsays]

it appears to me thou art easily offended.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

If you want to get technical and scientific about it, “common sense” is really a byproduct of culture, and that is largely shaped by our shared reality of us all being humans. It’s sociology & biology-101 that norms evolve within any community of people. They are are almost never created by people with guns and badges — that is simple enforcement of significant norms, codified as laws.

This discussion is the perfect example of how the culture of a community shapes behaviour of the individuals within a group, usually for the common utility of the group (although not always). We call this behaviour “common sense”, b/c it is common to most people in the group.

Those who break with this behaviour usually find them on the outside of the social group. Or in more serious cases, talking with someone "wearing a badge and a gun."

Mike!! What is wrong with you? This post is entirely too rational for the internet.

[Fuss]

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

Originally Posted by Fuss Oh come on.... let him use an anchor buoy... I mean how bad can it be... He's not going to attach it with 16mm line!!...
when you get tangled in it simply start your engine, slip into gear and let the shaft do the rest. The next fine calm day dive under and remove any remnants.

Mr. Fuss,

I certainly hope that was intended as a joke. If it was advice it is very poor, running over even light line while you're motoring is likely to wind it up like a ball around your prop shaft, and the engine stalls, and won't run till you get it off. It gets so tight, it can dislocate the shaft, which is why some people use line cutters. Polypro, by floating is worse than something that sinks, too.

Some friends caught a polypro line, which, of course stalled the engine, and drifted into a bridge on the incoming tide, and she, his wife, tried to fend off and damaged her hand, requiring several surgeries.

We caught our dinghy painter once, in the Santa Barbara Channel, iirc, and it took a number of dives to finally free it, something that would have been more difficult and dangerous in colder water.

Ann

It was very good advice...Kenmac and Docklands run over these anchor buoys all the time.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Simonsays

it appears to me thou art easily offended.

Indeed. Ron, I don't know why you've got your panties in such a twist over this conversation.

By all means, use an anchor marker, if you are so inclined. I doubt anyone will complain -- I certainly would never complain to anyone (nor have I ever, in more than 30 years of cruising, ever once complained to anyone about anchoring "too close").

OR, you might just listen a little to what many people here are saying, and consider what's been said, just in case there's something true or useful in it. There's no shame in listening! It does not detract from your manliness to do so!

Anchor buoys take up space in an anchorage, and create a hazard. They also create a risk of your anchor getting tripped if someone runs over the buoy. And you might easily run over and foul your own anchor buoy, in light winds and/or when there is a changing tide. Those are plain and simple and obvious facts. You may draw your own conclusions, of course, different from others, but the facts are what they are.

Someone above compared anchor buoys to crab pots -- indeed. Is this supposed to be a good thing? Strewing crab pots in the middle of a crowded anchorage, like using an anchor buoy, is also something many will judge to be very inconsiderate.

If the anchorage is not crowded, and/or you really really need a trip line because of stumps or whatever, an anchor buoy might be worthwhile in some cases.

But much more often anchor buoys are, in my experience, an idea that sounds great to inexperienced people, who then stop using them when experience shows them all the drawbacks. Also when they realize the potential trouble they are creating for others in the anchorage, many sailors will think twice before using an anchor buoy, unless they really need it for some very specific reason.

Others, of course, just don't care whether they create problems for others, and insist that they have a right to do whatever they want, as long as they were there first. That's OK, too, if that's your approach. That's between you and your own sense of consideration of others -- I'm certainly not going to argue with you -- I cruise for fun, not to get into arguments in anchorages.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

...If the anchorage is not crowded, and/or you really really need a trip line because of stumps or whatever, an anchor buoy might be worthwhile in some cases.

But much more often anchor buoys are, in my experience, an idea that sounds great to inexperienced people, who then stop using them when experience shows them all the drawbacks. Also when they realize the potential trouble they are creating for others in the anchorage, many sailors will think twice before using an anchor buoy, unless they really need it for some very specific reason.

Others, of course, just don't care whether they create problems for others, and insist that they have a right to do whatever they want, as long as they were there first. That's OK, too, if that's your approach. That's between you and your own sense of consideration of others -- I'm certainly not going to argue with you -- I cruise for fun, not to get into arguments in anchorages.

Well said Dockhead. It’s what most people have said on this topic. The facts are clear and not worth restating once again. There are good and valid reasons to use an anchor buoy. It is certainly possible for this to be the norm in an area. But as a general practice, it is neither necessary nor desirable for the individual boater or the common good.

[Kenomac]

Mike,

Are you getting hit by this blizzard? It's just getting revved up here in Eastern Massachusetts.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Mike,

Are you getting hit by this blizzard? It's just getting revved up here in Eastern Massachusetts.

Not me , but my boat is .

I’ve been in British Columbia over the winter house sitting (livin’ the free life!). Sadly, our boat is getting hammered. I hope it stays upright, and the cover survives.

Stay warm and dry Ken … bet you’re missing the Med .

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Not me , but my boat is .

I’ve been in British Columbia over the winter house sitting (livin’ the free life!). Sadly, our boat is getting hammered. I hope it stays upright, and the cover survives.

Stay warm and dry Ken … bet you’re missing the Med .

It's warm and sunny in Cannes today! Wish my boat were down here right now.

[Sandero]

Wasn't much of a blizzard in southern Westchester Co just north of NYC and on the western end of LIS... a winter storm yes... no white out and no exceptionally strong winds... a mess? YES. If and when it freezes it will be treacherous.

[senormechanico]

We're getting hit by the Pineapple Express. We saw 60 f. today on Whidbey Island in the PNW.

OOPS! Now NOAA is demanding to call it, "An Atmospheric River" because it sounds less, "Folksy" and more, "Sciencey" according to the local meteorologists.

What are atmospheric rivers? | National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration

Gimme a break ! It will always be known as a "Pineapple Express" to me.

Damn bureaucrats...

[buzzstar]

Originally Posted by senormechanico

We're getting hit by the Pineapple Express. We saw 60 f. today on Whidbey Island in the PNW.

OOPS! Now NOAA is demanding to call it, "An Atmospheric River" because it sounds less, "Folksy" and more, "Sciencey" according to the local meteorologists.

What are atmospheric rivers? | National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration

Gimme a break ! It will always be known as a "Pineapple Express" to me.

Damn bureaucrats...

Southern California's Santa Ana (aka Santana) winds are being replaced with more and more frequency by the newer generation of imported (from the
east coast) meteorologists, who use evasive terms like high pressure system over Nevada or clockwise rotation over the high pressure system. Sorry, to me they will always be Santa Ana wind, and I usually appreciate our receipt of the Pineapple Express because it may include the delivery of warm rain. When was the last time you even heard the expression Blue Northerner? How about "upwelling?" Do occluded fronts still exist -and that is a technical term!?

[buzzstar]

Originally Posted by buzzstar

Southern California's Santa Ana (aka Santana) winds are being replaced with more and more frequency by the newer generation of imported (from the
east coast) meteorologists, who use evasive terms like high pressure system over Nevada or clockwise rotation over the high pressure system. Sorry, to me they will always be Santa Ana wind, and I usually appreciate our receipt of the Pineapple Express because it may include the delivery of warm rain. When was the last time you even heard the expression Blue Northerner? How about "upwelling?" Do occluded fronts still exist -and that is a technical term!?

Just to show what I did not know, and the previous poster may not have known either, I did a Google search for Pineapple Express. The first reference was to a potent variety of marijuana. There were also references to a movie (or a film for the higher brows).

[senormechanico]

The jet stream coming straight at the PNW from Hawaii has been called the Pineapple Express ever since (and likely well before) I was aware of it at about ten years old when we moved to Western Washington. That was in 1955.

How long has that term been applied to marijuana? Is it a recent occurrence?
I have no idea.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Not me , but my boat is .

I’ve been in British Columbia over the winter house sitting (livin’ the free life!). Sadly, our boat is getting hammered. I hope it stays upright, and the cover survives.

Stay warm and dry Ken … bet you’re missing the Med .

Six more weeks of 7-8 shifts per week, then it's smoooooth sailing for six months.