Visit our Popular Forums

**Dockhead** · 19-07-2020, 03:17

I jettisoned my anchor chain in Denmark, prior to participating in a long distance race. It was in need of galvanization and I pretty much gave up finding any place to have this done, instead deciding to buy a new chain after the race.

So here I am, and I'm trying to decide what to choose.

I have been using 100 meters (330 feet) of 12mm chain, weighing 330kg or a third of a metric tonne. It's a lot of weight in the bow. Although I have to say that I can't see that it affects trim and I don't really notice much difference in sailing performance.

So do I buy a new batch of chain like that, or something different?

Another issue -- I anchor a fair amount in deep water. In Greenland, I was forced to anchor in 40 meters of water a couple of times. I could have used a bit more than 100 meters of rode.

Choices:

1. Same same -- 100m of 12mm. I found G40 chain from Titan Canada (manufacturer of Rocna anchors) for a reasonable price -- about €1200 including shipping to where I am in the Baltics.

2. Do the Dashew thing and go to 100m of G70 or G80 10mm chain, saving 1/3 of the weight. This would require a new gypsy. So far the only G70 chain I found is in Germany and costs €2000 for 100m or nearly double the cost of G40, without shipping.

3. Do less 12mm chain and add rope. I guess 90% of the time I don't need more than 70m of chain or even less of that. So if I went with 60m or 70m of 12mm chain and add 80m or 100m of 20mm rope -- that's intriguing. Would give me ability to really put out a lot of rode if I anchor again in really deep water like in Greenland. Yet save a lot of weight, 30% or 40%. No gypsy change required -- my gypsy will do 12mm chain and will handle also 20mm three-strand rope.

4. Same thing except G70 10mm chain and 16mm rope.

Thoughts?

SailFastTri · 19-07-2020, 03:47

I would vote for #3,
(edit) and use 8 plait rode.

chrisr · 19-07-2020, 04:04

have you priced lofrans G40 chain. it's very competitive here in australia, so expect more so in denmark. might be less cost than titan

and yes, i'd use more than 100m rode if anchoring in 40m water depth too - a LOT more !

but if you are not doing it too often, i'd add rope. if you do want extra chain, check that your windlass can handle it.

cheers,

**Dockhead** · 19-07-2020, 04:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by SailFastTri

I would vote for #3,
(edit) and use 8 plait rode.

I strongly prefer 8 plait, but my windlass gypsy will only handle "hard-laid" 3 strand, in that size.

**Dockhead** · 19-07-2020, 04:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisr

. . and yes, i'd use more than 100m rode if anchoring in 40m water depth too - a LOT more ! . .

With 330kg of chain out and in deep water, 2.5:1 is actually pretty OK. See the really interesting thread on catenary which is still going on, for the math behind it.

But in Greenland, there were places where I would have liked to be anchoring in 60m, and I think 100m of chain is too little for that. The problem is that the bottom in most coves there is too steep to anchor in, exept in the very middle and deepest part -- the only place to find something flat and silty to get your anchor into. It can be hard to find even 40m in some places.

Bill O · 19-07-2020, 05:16

Would vote for #3 also.

In #2 above you didn't factor in the cost of the new gypsy in addition to the G70 chain cost. Found w/our older Ideal windlass the new gypsy was very expensive and had to do some retrofitting on the stripper to get it to fit right. More pita, than needed and it did reduce the weight a bit. Our performance changed, but we did other mods that most likely enhanced the performance over weight reduction

In the end if your boat doesn't seem off (trim/performance), would not go through the extra cost/effort to change over to 10mm G70.

If you don't already have a good reel system on deck to tie to shore, would add that on the list of upgrades before going to Greenland.

**noelex 77** · 19-07-2020, 05:24

There is no easy answer.

I think you have nicely summarised the pros and cons, but one factor not mentioned is the life of thinner G70 chain.

There are numerous reports of a significantly shorter durability. I still think G70 chain can be an excellent choice in some circumstances, but the combination of shorter life and more difficulty ordering replacement chain needs to be considered especially for boats anchoring frequently.

thinwater · 19-07-2020, 06:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisr

...but if you are not doing it too often, i'd add rope. if you do want extra chain, check that your windlass can handle it.

cheers,

Just to clarify what I think he is trying to say, when you have 60 meters of chain hanging down, that is considerable weight (500 pounds) for the windlass to pull, added to the weight of the anchor and break out force.

I have heard stories of people who lowered chain in very deep water and were not able to recover it, even after the anchor was loose.

rslifkin · 19-07-2020, 07:21

For rope in the windlass gypsy, I'd get a test piece of whatever you'd want to use and try it. You might find it works despite the manufacturer recommendation. Going from a hard 3 strand to a soft 8 plait might require going up a size to get enough grip.

Personally, I'd go for the 60 - 70 meters of chain, plus rope and good chafe gear. That should cover being on all chain in places where bottom chafe is an issue and let you carry plenty of total length for very deep anchorages. At that point it becomes a matter of what fits rather than weight concerns.

I'm carrying 90 feet of chain plus 300 of 8 plait and it works well (figure 375 feet usable). If I were traveling further and more likely to encounter rocky or coral anchorages, I'd up the chain to something like 150 or 200 feet and tolerate the weight penalty. And I'd probably reduce the line to 250 or so, giving a total length of at least 400 feet. Having that much is definitely nice for being able to anchor where I want rather than having to choose by depth.

Andreas W · 19-07-2020, 07:36

I would take option 1). But try to source the chain in the Baltic.

slug · 19-07-2020, 08:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by thinwater

Just to clarify what I think he is trying to say, when you have 60 meters of chain hanging down, that is considerable weight (500 pounds) for the windlass to pull, added to the weight of the anchor and break out force.

I have heard stories of people who lowered chain in very deep water and were not able to recover it, even after the anchor was loose.

It’s a typical scenario

You anchor on a 15 meter shelf

The anchor drags off the shelf into 100 meters of water

Your winch may not handle the lift

Important to have a plan B

**Dockhead** · 19-07-2020, 08:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by noelex 77

There is no easy answer.

I think you have nicely summarised the pros and cons, but one factor not mentioned is the life of thinner G70 chain.

There are numerous reports of a significantly shorter durability. I still think G70 chain can be an excellent choice in some circumstances, but the combination of shorter life and more difficulty ordering replacement chain needs to be considered especially for boats anchoring frequently.

I used to consider the meatier material in 12mm chain to be a big advantage.

And then I discovered I can't regalvanise it. So that advantage goes out the window. If the chain life is determined by the life of the galvanising, then there is no reason for 10mm chain to last less than 12mm.

**Dockhead** · 19-07-2020, 08:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by slug

It’s a typical scenario

You anchor on a 15 meter shelf

The anchor drags off the shelf into 100 meters of water

Your winch may not handle the lift

Important to have a plan B

I've pulled my anchor up out of 40 plus meters of water. I have the Size 3 Lewmar Ocean with 2kW motor, rated pull 2 tonnes. I don't think this is an issue. In any case, one thing I'm NOT proposing to do, is have greater weight of chain than what I've lived with last 10 years.

slug · 19-07-2020, 08:41

Galvanizing life is unknown

Galvanizing is worn off by the bottom substrate, the chain gypsy and the anchor roller design

The roller assembly is particularly aggressive on galvanizing

Best if Large diameter, the same as the chain gypsy , with a chain guide grove to keep the chain from jumping off and into the stainless bow roller cheeks , machined from plastic is best