New to anchoring - appreciate advice/opinions

[Sailmon]

Dear All,
Her Diamond (our Freedom 38) is almost ready for retirement cruising. After 32 years of days sailing and vacation cruising on the Great Lakes, we will be casting off the dock lines and heading to New York at the end of July. Hope to be in Carolinas at end of hurricane season and head to Bahamas (and beyond) from there.

While we have been vacationing on our boat for the past 3 decades (makes us sound so old...) we have mostly stayed in marinas and have little experience with anchoring and related use of tender. I hope you can help me out with advice/opinions regarding the following questions.
1. Aside from lunch hook, we currently have 2 anchors on the boat - a Fortress and a plow type (can't remember which brand). While I realize different anchors are more suitable for different conditions and that there will be times when both anchors will be needed, would it be a poor choice to think of the Fortress as our primary anchor (southern U.S. east coast and Bahamas).
2. We have 2 rodes - one is 30' 3/8 BBB chain and 150' 5/8 three strand nylon. The other is 95' 5/16 BBB chain and 205' 5/8 3 strand nylon. Wondering which rode would be best suited for which anchor (plow and fortress)?
3. We have a 9.5' Brig RIB (fiberglass). We will use it as a tender and for an occasional longer excursion - but principally as tender. We hope to anchor and/or pick up balls a fair bit - but not exclusively - will sometimes be staying at marinas. We plan to purchase a Mercury outboard (I am still working as part time associate at West Marine). We are going back and forth between a 6HP and. 9.9HP engine. Recognizing that 9.9 will have significantly better ability to plane and push through chop, the larger engine weighs almost twice as much as the smaller engine.
Recommendations/opinions on all three topics greatly appreciated,
Bob

[Panope]

My 6 HP (4 stroke) will just barely plane 3 (moderately sized) adults in a 10 foot inflatable (air floor).

With 2 aboard, it planes without struggling.

With 1 person, it flys.

I think it is important to have a dingy/engine combination that the crew is able to carry above the high tide line.

Steve

[a64pilot]

Most want all chain rode, ditch the plow, keep the Fortress. If you have to kedge a Fortress is light and easy to carry and while I have never had to use it my understanding is their product support is outstanding. I have Rocna's but if doing it again I believe I would look real hard at a Mantus.
My opinion is there is no one best anchor
Depending on anchor locker size keep all the rope, I have 600' for a parachute anchor.
A small fiberglass boat will I believe plane with less HP than a RIB, and if your leaving soon, you may want a 2 stroke that you can buy in the Islands.
I sized mine with the idea of being able to plane with both of us and a load of groceries, or Dive gear. That took me to 20 HP and I wanted a RIB, with big diameter tubes. Many ways to get there, but I believe a fiberglass boat is way more efficient a hull than a RIB.
Big motor requires a deck crane, in fact I plan on a bigger one than I have as without one I'm not so sure I could get my Wife back aboard as we have high freeboard and no sugar scoop.

[Don C L]

First of all you should check out all the threads here on anchoring especially Panope's and Noelex's. Do a search here for them. The greater amount of chain and rode is for the bow. If you don't have one of the newer generation of anchors like Mantus or Rocna, I'd recommend looking into those for the bow. The Fortress is usually saved by most folks for the stern but it has excellent holding power for its size and weight. I'd add more chain to the stern myself. In my neighborhood I am always anchored bow and stern and Danforths have never let me down when anchored in hard and soft sand. The use of a trip line is occasionally debated here but when I'm anchored in areas that have, or may have rocks, I have found it VERY useful.
Aside from actual anchoring, you may also want to look into "rocker stoppers" to help ease any rolling motion that may invade otherwise idyllic anchorages. I use them regularly in my area, but anchorages here occasionally get a swell moving in from odd angles at night.

[Stu Jackson]

https://www.westmarine.com/WestAdvis...nchor-Securely

[UNCIVILIZED]

One thing to remember in terms of the anchoring equation, is that everything needs to work together as a system. Starting with the anchor, shackle(s), rode, bow roller, chain stopper or pawl, windlass, cleats, & anchor locker. As well as the bolts, backing plates, & deck construction under & around all of the above hardware. Plus your snubbing system. And of course techniques.

Also, how weight sensitive is your bow? As this will have an impact on some of the gear you choose, & also where you stow it. Plus, if you're going anchor shopping, a lot of the new generation anchors mentioned tend to be a bit large dimensionally, for many bow rollers. And you can check on their spec's with regard to this via their websites. Where there's also a good deal of anchor/anchoring knowledge, info on anchor & rode selection, etc.

One other excellent resouce here on CF are Thinwater's posts. As he's done a lot of testing on rodes, anchors, & the science behind what works, what doesn't & why. Especially regarding rodes.

[JPA Cate]

We have 2 rodes - one is 30' 3/8 BBB chain and 150' 5/8 three strand nylon. The other is 95' 5/16 BBB chain and 205' 5/8 3 strand nylon.

Check the fit, for your 5/16, because there are many differences in how the chain fits in the "pockets" in the gypsy. If the fit is poor, the chain can jump out of the gypsy, and if part of you is in the way, well, chain can be pretty darn hard on flesh.

Once you get out into the Pacific, there are a few very deep anchorages. We've anchored in 80 ft., the shallowest we could find. This is, of course in coral waters, where your nylon is vulnerable to chafe. This is why many of us go to all chain rode.

The assumption here is that the 30 ft. of 3/8 chain is for the stern line, paired with the Fortress. You might actually want more nylon, as you will often drop the stern hook first, and paying out the line, move forward to where you need to drop the bower anchor and fall back, till you have the desired scope out, whilst retrieving the excess stern line. However, probably 1/2" 3 strand would do you for this application. (For instance, Atuona, in the Marquesas)

This leaves you with the 5/16 chain and 205 of 5/8 back of it and a plow anchor of unknown weight and manufacture. You can probably get it to work for you. Imho, it is not optimal. After you've checked out noelex's thread "Pictures of Anchors Setting" and Panope's "Videos of Anchors Setting", you may want to re-evaluate your primary anchoring set-up. Evans Starzinger has recently posted on the former thread, and he has some interesting things to say about trying to get hooked in difficult sea bottoms, as well.

As to the dinghy motor, I'd be inclined to go with the 9.9. We have a 15 horse, and never have thought we needed a crane. We have a mast, and a main halyard, and made our own hoisting sling for that motor, and Jim just walks it back and puts it on the motor mount at the stern, with the halyard supporting its weight. There have been times when we might have wanted more horsepower, but have trusted our engines for exploring far off, preferring to leave the mother boat where it is safest, and using the dinghy to go diving, or pure exploring. The concept has worked well for the 30 yrs. we've been cruising.

Ann

[MLOI]

Anchors and chain are relatively cheap.
And last a long time.
When you are siting at anchor somewhere do you really want to be thinking that for a few extra $$ you could have had a better anchor than what you have? We had a perfectly adequate delta, but newer generation anchors are better, particularly at resetting. I have not regretted turning the delta into a garden ornament, and have greatly increased marital harmony with an easy setting anchor.

(A 20 kg Rocna and 50 m of chain cost me a little over $1k. Insurance is $2k a year, yet it is the anchor which gives me the best sleep at night...)

As for outboards? Work out the maximum weight you want to deal with, then buy the most powerful engine in that weight range. We have a 9.9 hp 2 stroke on a 3m RIB, which planes with 4 of us, and really easily with less than that. And I can lift it one handed if needbe, and it is easy to store on the rail.

Mike.

[Delancey]

Just finished six months on a 40' mono cruising in Florida and the Bahamas where the owner says he will be cruising. Have had great experience so far using a Mantus with 50' of 3/8" chain backed up with 200' of 5/8" 3-strand as my primary.

Figure we spent somewhere around 150 nights at anchor, with maybe 100 of those nights in a reversing tidal current that was sometimes quite strong (+3 knots or so). In all that time up and down Florida and the Bahamas I almost never had to anchor in water much deeper than about 10' MLW.

Always put out all the chain but never more than twenty or thirty feet of rope additional max which got me to round about 5:1 including tide and freeboard. Only dragged once in a spot that was thin sand over marl but was mainly due to being in a hurry to get the anchor down for an approaching squall and not having time to ensure a proper set.

We also have on board a Fortress with 50' of 5/16" high test chain backed up by 200' of 5/8" brait. This has sat in a cockpit locker the entire season and has never been used. I am sure it will come in handy someday but in all those nights of reversing current I never felt the need to set a second anchor. Get rid of your plow. You won't miss it.

I know a lot of salty blue-water types say ya gotta have all chain. Maybe for the cruising the Pacific but for Florida and the Bahamas I ain't buying it. In ten feet of water 50' of chain with 20' of rope out is the same as having all chain with a snubber except it's a lot less $$$ and a lot less weight up on the bow.

Also, we don't have a windlass which I know many consider a must have. I am sure they are nice we but never had a problem not having one. Maybe when I get old or get a bigger boat I'll want one. Anyway, that's what worked for us. Hope it helps. Have fun out there!

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

One thing to remember in terms of the anchoring equation, is that everything needs to work together as a system. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>

So true:

Why NEW GEN Anchors are Better:

Anchors & TEST Results of New Generation Anchors EXCELLENT & Important

Anchor System Sizing Tables (Reply #6) & Why Swivels are a bad idea Ground Tackle & Anchor System Sizing TABLES & Swivels

Steve’s Anchoring 101

The Rocna. All 20kg of it with 100ft of chain. The rest of the world can debate all they like. When I pull into a place like Bodega Bay at midnight and the fog is so thick I can't see the jetty 50 feet away to make an entrance, I drop my hook in the rolling ocean swells with the surf crashing (Foster says it's like staying in a cheap Best Western beside the highway), and I sleep. And in the morning I have a windlass to pull the beast up and I wouldn't trade it for anything. (I also wouldn't add more chain - this works perfectly in 25 to 30 feet of water - you let all the chain out and you tie off nylon at the preferred scope and don't bother with snubbers and chain hooks and all that stuff...)

This was our best upgrade.

[Don C L]

Originally Posted by Stu Jackson

Anchor System Sizing Tables (Reply #6) & Why Swivels are a bad idea Ground Tackle & Anchor System Sizing TABLES & Swivels
[/I]

I still have yet to be convinced swivels are good or necessary things.

[Stu Jackson]

Originally Posted by Don C L

I still have yet to be convinced swivels are good or necessary things.

I agree. Read the link to find out why they suck.

[Spade Anchor]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l59f-OjWoq0

[Delancey]

I like the Spade. It's a nice design. It's all curvy. Very French looking.

As Panope notes, he also likes it because it's curvy. If it weren't for the curves he would have chosen the Mantus since it performs just as well if not slightly better. If you like curves and are willing to pay TWICE as much pound for pound get a Spade.

Otherwise get a Mantus, or any other new generation anchor for that matter really since they more or less all perform the same given the endless variety of variables that can influence an anchors ability to set and hold.

Whatever you do replace the plow with a new anchor. You will sleep better.

[Spade Anchor]

Originally Posted by Delancey

I like the Spade. It's a nice design. It's all curvy. Very French looking.

As Panope notes, he also likes it because it's curvy. If it weren't for the curves he would have chosen the Mantus since it performs just as well if not slightly better. If you like curves and are willing to pay TWICE as much pound for pound get a Spade.

Otherwise get a Mantus, or any other new generation anchor for that matter really since they more or less all perform the same given the endless variety of variables that can influence an anchors ability to set and hold.

Whatever you do replace the plow with a new anchor. You will sleep better.

In the video Panope notes that he prefers the Spade over the Sarca due to the curves of the Spade. Panope's comments on the Mantus are that it "it is too spindly looking and may be too spindly looking for use" and "does not look robust".

The Spade Anchor is currently on Sale for 30% off. So a 45lbs Mantus costs $379.99 and a 44lbs Spade Anchor costs $529.99 a difference of $150. So for about what you pay for one night at a hotel you can now sleep on the hook with a Spade Anchor.
https://www.spadeanchorusa.com/produ.../spade-s-steel