Oversized Anchor

[s/v Jedi]

Windlass breaking down... you know those thingies are really sturdy and don't easily break down. When you live at anchor most of the time, you maintain it, check connections for corrosion, clean & grease it etc. It won't just give up without warning.

And now, imagine yourself at that lee shore with winds piping up to 50 kts. You really think you can pull a lighter anchor (66 lb? 40 lb?) up by hand? A smaller anchor doesn't make the chain lighter or keep the bow steady right over the anchor. Been there, done that, was much younger and couldn't repeat it today. When this happens, we let the anchor slip. The chain is followed by 200' of 3/8" polypropylene rope which I'll cut from the boat. It'll float and be there for me to pick up again later.

cheers,
Nick.

[stillbuilding]

I have just consulted Ian Nicholson's Boat Data Book published in 1978. He gives the following recommendation for anchors (CQR, Danforth etc) for long range cruising for a 53 - 59' yacht;

1 @ 36kg/80lbs
2 @ 54kg/120lbs
2 @ 100kg/220lbs

The author notes "long range cruising assumes that the yacht may have to ride out a hurricane. In these conditions a modest increase in the weight and size of anchor over the average will sometimes save the ship."

I may be getting a bit more cautious but this advice sounds fairly good to me although I would consider the more recently designed anchors a better choice at these weights.

[s/v Moondancer]

I agreee with Jedi, I have the biggest anchor my windlass can handle...If this one dies I am getting the next size of windlass and the next size of anchor...but you have to live with what you have unless money is unlimited. I also have a big fortress and my next purchase is a bigger fortress.

When my windlass quit for a day I ran messenger lines from my big electric jib winches and raised the anchor 30 ft at a time.

You will be pleased with the Rochna 55.

Happy anchoring Phil

Phil

[jackiepitts]

It makes sense to go with the biggest anchor you can carry. Also what Nick said about pulling ANY anchor up by hand in 50 knots of wind seems to kill the argument of going with a smaller more manageable size.
The bad news is I am getting really concerned on how we are going to fit this Rocna 55 on our existing roller. My husband suggested we use it as a storm anchor and use our 75 lb. as a primary for normal conditions.... I am not sure if I like that idea. The other option is to possibly build a custom roller similar to what Rocna has on there website but I am not totally sure that would work either. I guess we need to get out there and start doing some serious measuring.
Jackie

[Vasco]

Originally Posted by jackiepitts

The bad news is I am getting really concerned on how we are going to fit this Rocna 55 on our existing roller. My husband suggested we use it as a storm anchor and use our 75 lb. as a primary for normal conditions...
Jackie

It seems silly to get this anchor and then save it for exceptional conditions. You want a good hook even for "normal" conditions because "normal" can change awful quickly. I think you're right in modifying your set-up so you can use the Rocna 55. You will not regret it.

[donradcliffe]

Jackie
If your new anchor is too big to fit on your existing bow roller, you can avoid an expensive rebuild of the bow. Weld a short piece of gavanized pipe on the anchor shank at a 45 degree angle so that the pipe catches under the bow roller and locks the anchor in place a few inches in front of where it would normally stop. A picture or diagram would really help explain, but I don't have that technology. My boat came with that system, and I have used it for years on two different anchors and never had a problem with it affecting the anchor setting or strength. It also makes the anchor self-launching because it sticks out a bit further from the boat in its storage position.

[s/v Jedi]

If you are gonna put that Rocna 55 in the bilge and continue using that old CQR instead, you really need to rethink all this. You should have bought a couple of big Fortress anchors (that can be disassembled) instead.

Plus, you are going to regret it. I have seen so much trouble and misery caused by CQR's on certain bottom types...

Changing the roller/arrangement is well worth it imo!

cheers,
Nick.

[jackiepitts]

Well after measuring it seems that we should be able to fit the 55 kg Rocna on the roller with some modification.
I am really excited to get it and try it out after all the good input. It should take about 2 weeks for delivery. Last night the wind picked up to about 30 knots sometime after midnight and I kept thinking how nice it would have been to have that big Rocna set rather than the 75 CQR.
Jackie

[MarkJ]

Originally Posted by jackiepitts

I kept thinking how nice it would have been to have that big Rocna set rather than the 75 CQR.
Jackie

Happiness is knowing the anchor is bigger than necessary and there's more chain out than necessary

When we started cruising we used 3:1 scope. Now we ALWAYS use way, way more. Often 10:1. Often we just run it out to our 50 meter chain connection. Then if deeper or blowing I shackle and extra bit of chain accross the chain join and we let out whatever we have space to let out.

The only problems we ever get now is having too much out. And thats always easily solvable Pull a bit in

Also I think Rocna has a tandem anchor eye so if facing a hurricane you could attach another anchor in tandem (note: NOT twin anchors but tandem - there's a difference)

[mesquaukee]

In light coral sand nothing beats the biggest heaviest anchor that you can possiblely fit and a lot of heavy chain to keep the pull on the anchor parrellel to the bottom not hoisting it up out of the bottom such as a 3:1 scope will do in a blow.
Up north in heavy mud or clay you can get away with with almost anything as the suction of the clay will not allow it to break out easyly.

[George Wade]

Originally Posted by MarkJ

Happiness is knowing the anchor is bigger ...
Also I think Rocna has a tandem anchor eye so if facing a hurricane you could attach another anchor in tandem

That shackle hole in the crown of the anchor can also be used in a foul anchorage: full of old chains, wire cables, railway bogys. You shackle a stout line to it, attach an orange bouy to the end and will be able to haul it out of any entanglement.

[MarkJ]

I think the trip line hole and the tandem hole are different...
this from the rocna website... do I sound like an ad for them?

Most anchors have a hole near their crown. However, this is not an attachment point for a tandem rode! It is for a trip line. Never use it for the tandem anchor, as it will unbalance the primary anchor when load is applied. It is also frequently not strong enough, intended only to take the weight of the anchor itself. From one cruiser: “I’ve torn the trip hole out of a 110 lb CQR. Mexican panga caught the float and pulled it at about 25 knots. No corrosion, just ripped the shackle right through the steel of the anchor.”
Anchors which cannot have tandems attached directly to them include the CQR, Bruce, Delta, Spade, and Danforth types.
The only anchor which has a tandem attachment point, designed and tested specifically for this purpose, is the Rocna. This is because the designer wished to be able to use a tandem set-up when cruising in Patagonia and Antarctica, and made sure to include such functionality on his new development.

[Endojoe]

I hadn't ever heard of Tandem Anchoring until you mentioned it Mark, here's a great link with further info for everyone to read...

[Highlander40]

The problem with tandem anchors. Don't expect to pull up and reset in bad conditions. I spent the night tied to another boat because they anchored poorly with tandem anchors and couldn't pull them up in windy conditions.
One good anchor (next gen) lots of chain and a real snubber. The Spade, Rocna etc. all hold the bottom better with less wasted iron.

[mesquaukee]

I have used tandem anchors in bad blows and reset them. It is doable if you use no more than 10 ft of line (3/4" rope) between them. Then when the first anchor is up on the bow roller the 2nd anchor is off the bottom and you do not have to fight with a bunch of chain. You also have to set up a length of line from the shackle of the 1st anchor ( the one on the bow roller) that is attached part way to the 2nd line to facilitate the easy lifting of the 2nd anchor from over the pullpit.