Overwintering in the Ice

[Dockhead]

I'm thinking again about where to keep the boat during the winter.


For years, I went back to Cowes every September, which is a fabulous place to overwinter the boat. Winter cruising in the Solent, all services, sailor community, everything. In those days (before the pandemic) we had an office in London, so I could live on the boat and commute to London.


But the pandemic changed all that -- we closed the office in London, my best friends there moved away, and my work in the Nordic countries has reached a high level of intensity which requires my presence there.


Furthermore my best sailing friend bought a Discovery 67 which we sail during the winter, so I have little time for my own boat during that season (we crossed the Atlantic last year).



So since the pandemic, I have been overwintering in Denmark, near Copenhagen. Sea doesn't freeze, and I have friends there. I have been sailing East in the spring, making a long circuit around the Baltic during the summer, and then coming back to Denmark in September or October.



But I've been thinking it would be nice to have the boat closer by during the winter, to make it easier to work on her. I could put her in Tallinn harbor, for example. More expensive than Denmark, but vastly more convenient. The only issue is that unlike in Denmark, the sea does freeze there. It normally does not freeze more than 40cm thick and not for long these days, and some winters these days the sea doesn't freeze at all.


Is this a problem? Will it damage my gel coat? What if I use a bubbler?


I'll be grateful for any tips.

[RaymondR]

Interesting problem we tend not to have in Australia.

Bublers plus a collar made from large diameter lay flat hose full of antifreeze around the hull at the waterline??

[hpeer]

Being steep we have just frozen in on the rare occasion. Others use bubbler which seem to work well.

The issue is not just freezing in, it can also be moving sheets of ice that are more troublesome. If cooking in an area with a good bit of current that can be an issue. We were on a dock along a Canal that could have strong current. Up river ice dams would break up and enter the Canal then rub along the boats and dock. Bubblers don't help then.

Not likely but a consideration.

[wrwakefield]

DH- I kept a Valiant Esprit 37 (Bob Perry; heavy hand layup FRP hull) in Valdez, Alaska for 14 years.

There was a significant inflow of fresh water in that harbor that floated on top of the salt water- freezing solid in extreme Wx on occasion; but rarely longer than a week or two.

I guestimate the ice was about 10cm thick, but never measured it.

It was enough to hold the boat firm- like being on the hard. I always worried the wind, and/or me being onboard while frozen in would damage/ scratch the hull at the ice line.

Another exacerbating factor was getting a dump (up to 1m) of heavy wet snow overnight while still frozen in- which often happened once it started warming up after a freezing event.

My worries were unfounded as no damage was ever noticed- even upon close inspection when hauled out.

I never tried a bubbler, but I did observe that every time the ice started melting, it started at the hull and worked out from there. (I did have heat in the boat...)

Would I be comfortable with 4 times that thickness of ice as in your case? I might be inclined to try and keep it away from the hull by experimenting with bubbler(s) (although I have never used one...)

On the other hand, if a bubbler didn't keep the ice far enough from the hull to prevent chafing when the boat moved on its dock lines (e.g., high winds) would the hull be better off frozen in solid?

Please share what you learn. (I'm interested even though ice in our current winter slip rarely exceeds 1cm, and then only for brief periods...)

Cheers, Bill

[Benz]

I have spent several winters living aboard where the sea froze, sometimes thick enough to walk on. There was absolutely no damage to my FG hull: it would take a LOT of moving ice to damage a hull, and no amount of ice can scratch it (Try it: take a chunk of ice and beat it against your boat as hard as you can. The ice is softer than paint or gelcoat. It may abrade the antifouling if it moves against it, but not the other surfaces).

[hpeer]

Not all ice is equal. Salt water ice is often softish. Fresh water ice can be quite hard and sharp. Arctic ice will melt and refreeze as fresh water. Rain or snow on salt ice can lead to hard ice. We were on an estuary down river from an ice dam that broke. That was a lot of damn ice, and hard.

It is not common, but is a consideration.

More a problem with tumblehome;I have seen boats freeze to the dock at low tide only to be held down and swamped as the tide rises.

[CFS Klopas]

Sailing in a part of the world that routinely freezes, the Great Lakes, just about everyone hauls out every winter. Bubblers are considered necessary and sufficient for the few who overwinter in the slip, as well as careful winterization of any internal water.

[Dockhead]

Thanks for all the useful replies.


I'm still of two minds about it.


Winterizing the water system wouldn't be good because I would want to be able to use it during the winter, even if I'm not going to be sailing. I guess a certain amount of electric heat would solve that.

[Drunkonwatch]

Try to get a deep spot if it’s a short term freezing the ocean can help some, it’s the tide and ice that Fs the gel cote give a scout about. Also I always try figure where the storm drains are the fresh water can ruin a spot with layers. I have never seen bubblers in action most places I been it would futile or we would watch the weather and be around the boat if was made of wood like during winter cod fishing.

[Drunkonwatch]

I’m guessing there no berg issues so the entrance is where I always loiter just my opinion but if there’s a chance to travel further and be ice free I chose ice free been presented with that exact dilemma in Alaska.

[deblen]

https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ng-272764.html