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**skipmac** · 06-08-2020, 08:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Beat me to it

. All independent testing I've seen shows these "new-gen" anchors outperform most older-style across the board. This also coincides with most anecdotal evidence, as well as my own experience.

Same here. When I first put a Rocna on my boat when I backed down to set the anchor I learned very quickly to take ALL the slack out of the rode first. Otherwise you risk snatching the windlass off the deck.

I might add that one should emphasize "independent" testing. I've seen results published in a number of sources that were performed by several different groups all of which had no connection with any of the anchor manufacturers.

Another point I think all agree on, the most holding power by weight and probably by size as well is the Fortress anchor. Also fantastic customer support. The only downside, they don't reset as reliably as the new gen anchors when the pull is reversed.

Lost Horizons · 06-08-2020, 08:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingssail

The boats sail less well with the excess weight on the bow

Why? I think it is the opposite. Depends on the degree of excess, off course, but if the design waterline plane is parallel to the water surface, why would the boats sail “less well”?

Lost Horizons · 06-08-2020, 08:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by skipmac

the Fortress anchor. Also fantastic customer support.

Not in my experience. I sent an inquiry to their technical support a few months ago and never heard back. I would call it a lack of customer support.

Cheechako · 06-08-2020, 08:50

I had the 44 Delta on a 42 cat and it worked well. So I would guess the 55 is about right for that boat. Of course, when it comes to anchoring, bigger is always better, but bigger is heavier too. 85# seems vast overkill to me. Especially if it's supposedly a better anchor!

I don't remember the Delta coming loose throughout the E Caribe. UNLESS the wind clocked 180, then the Delta would come loose. A fault of that particular, and many actually , anchors. I would dive the anchor a lot, and in sand it would often completely disappear under the sand if the wind was blowing.

mcneilms · 06-08-2020, 08:50

Thanks for all the responses. I tend to agree that the Cat manufacturer just gave an anchor for day use and it is not really intended for the cruiser that anchors overnight regularly.
I will go with the bigger mantus.

CarlF · 06-08-2020, 08:55

Manufacturers like the Delta because it's cheap, people are used to it, and it fits just about all rollers. I suffered through one for about 5 years before the new gen anchors came out. My previous boat's CQR held better.

I have no doubt that a 55lb Manson, Rocna, Spade, or Mantus would set better than the 55lb Delta - as would a 85lb of any of them.

When you used to have to lift an anchor by hand, getting by with a small anchor was often necessary for your back. As your boat likely has a windlass, there's no reason not to go with a big anchor. Pushing the windlass button doesn't get any harder.

If you are worried about extra 30lbs of weight in the bow of a cat, use a little less chain, use a smaller size G4 chain and/or have the 2nd anchor be very light (aluminum Spade or Fortress) and stored aft. You'll hardly ever use it except to row out in the dinghy to set as a kedge anchor.

Mike OReilly · 06-08-2020, 08:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingssail

I guess I'd like to read a couple of these tests, searching on this forum for "anchor holding test" came up with nothing, and internet search came up with one west marine test.

Do you know of some?

CF's own Panope is a great source:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCy1...fcf4asEG_bulHA

Practical Sailor has been doing tests for decades. I'm not longer a subscriber, but when I was you could access all the archives.

Here's a random selection of hits that come up when you search "yacht anchor test"

And then there are the endless tests done by manufacturers. These are taken with a grain of sand, although comparing them across the board will give useful data.

There's lots out there, plus all the anecdotal evidence in the cruising community.

BTW, I should have added that the one 'older style' anchor which continues to show its worth is the Danforth/Fortress. These consistently produce the highest holding forces. HOWEVER, this is in a more narrow set of substrate; typically firm mud to sand. This is why most cruisers who anchor in a wide variety of bottoms don't usually use this style of anchor as their main bower. But most of us do carry one (or more).

Scrimshaw4 · 06-08-2020, 09:28

After 20 years with another style anchor I switched to the Mantus. I have never experienced a more secure anchoring experience on any other ground tackle on numerous other boats than I had with the Mantus. Some times anchoring in strong tidal areas with strong wind and it rotated and reset almost within the shank length. We're 16 tons and never dragged. Sound anchors provide sound sleep. If they say 85 then I'd strongly urge you to get that size. Be prepared to hold on when you deploy it cause it will stop you like you were tied to a piling. JMHO

singlespeed · 06-08-2020, 09:39

Bigger is generally better, but make sure your windlass can handle the extra weight.

SV__Grace · 06-08-2020, 09:43

The manufacturer needs to provide an anchor with a new boat as a safety regulation. Most seem to go for lunch-hook sized Deltas. The higher end manufacturers often upgrade to stainless steel anchors. No self respecting, knowledgable cruiser would want either of those and would immediately replace them.

I think of these anchors as "placeholders" as they have to put something there and they can't predict what a new owner would want or need.

Why they don't provide new owners an option to choose the anchor they want is a mystery to me, it's not a big expense considering the final price tag of a new boat. Personally I'd rather pay a few hundred more than have to replace and get rid of a useless anchor.

Izikalvo · 06-08-2020, 09:45

Stick with the anchor manufacturer guidelines, not many have holding power values but all gives you the size and weight of the boat you should consider.

**skipmac** · 06-08-2020, 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by wingssail

I guess I'd like to read a couple of these tests, searching on this forum for "anchor holding test" came up with nothing, and internet search came up with one west marine test.

Do you know of some?

Practical Sailor has done a series of anchor tests under different conditions, different bottom types, etc.

**skipmac** · 06-08-2020, 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Horizons

Not in my experience. I sent an inquiry to their technical support a few months ago and never heard back. I would call it a lack of customer support.

Certainly based on your experience I could not disagree. My experience was the opposite. Bought a used Fortress that came without the mud attachments. Called Fortress to buy the parts and they promptly sent them to me at no charge. Have heard several similar comments over the years from other forum members. Maybe they just don't like people from Seattle.

I believe one of the principals from Fortress is on this forum. Maybe send them a PM.

**skipmac** · 06-08-2020, 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Horizons

Why? I think it is the opposite. Depends on the degree of excess, off course, but if the design waterline plane is parallel to the water surface, why would the boats sail “less well”?

Putting weight in the ends of the boat increases the moment of inertia meaning as the bow or stern moves up or down on a wave the inertia of the mass in the ends of the boat want to continue moving up or down even after the wave passes by. The effect is commonly referred to as hobby horsing.

I had a 34' boat with a large anchor and a smaller backup on the bow and a lazarette on the stern with a small portable generator, the propane tanks, spare oil, gas and a few odds and ends. So a lot of weight in both ends of the boat. Most of the time I never noticed any negative effects but close hauled in short, steep waves the boat would pitch like mad. The bow would rise up to the peak of the wave and keep on rising after the wave passed like it had been launched off a ski ramp. Then it would come crashing down into the trough with a bang, the mast would slam forward and all the rigging would shake. Certain combinations of waves and point of sail it was borderline dangerous.