Yep - we dragged!

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Thanks Bill O.

We too draw 6.5 - may I ask what anchor you’ve used?
We have several onboard - CQR, Danforth, Delta & our current primary; Spade (all oversized )

Thanks again,

For mud the Danforths the best tho' I quit using them when on one occasion a pebble jammed the flukes as it flipped preventing it digging in again.. a strong Spring ebb tide then put us in an embarrassing position alongside the Poole entrance chain ferry.. mid channel.. my Aux Seagull O/B was in bits at the time as I was trying to fix a starting problem when we dragged.. gave up Seagull engines as well as a result of that..

[SVRocinante]

Originally Posted by zeehag

thunderstorms get 150 ft chain.
min 120. sometimes second anchor or a kellet, depending on area.
woke in zihuat one night with strange wind sensation.,,saw a t-boomer cell approaching and let out 30 more feet chain. was good. we stuck.
good luck figgering out your needs. each boat and area is different.

Thank you zeehag
I have plenty of chain but not much swingroom. That said, perhaps I should have simply deployed more of it when we saw the thunderstorm approaching, since swingroom goes out the window in those conditions!

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

At the moment, my best guess as to why we dragged is that the sudden and extreme change in wind speed & direction pulled the anchor out - we had been lying with our transom pointing north all day and the storm blew in from the north.

Yep, been there, done that... around here...

Another influence sometimes is fallen leaves covering the substrate, so setting can sometimes take some extra work to get the flukes down through all that. San Domingo Creek might be leafy; can't remember...

Originally Posted by Tingum

Many of the creeks in Md. have no bottom, the water just get thicker as you go deeper!

Originally Posted by danielamartindm

Thunderstorms and microbursts are wild cards that can unseat any anchor- even if you dove on it and observed the set before turning in. I applaud your attitude and desire to learn. I know nothing of that anchorage, and hope that others here who do will be able to offer suggestions. A Fortess holds best in mud. Fair winds, skipper.

I don't remember San Domingo Creek being as soft as some of the other "slime" anchorages around here, but then we might have found a small thick mud place there at the time... or maybe we just didn't have one of the cyclonic storms pass through when we've been there.

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Thanks Tornadosailing - I don’t have a Fortress, but do have a Danforth.
Might switch to that for the remainder of our time on the Chesapeake.

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Thank you Ben, just might switch over to my Danforth for our next few stops on the Chesapeake as we continue north.

Don't expect magic from the Danforth. Part of the reason an equal-weight Fortress does better in soft mud is because the flukes are larger. A second part is because of the adjustable fluke angle. The third part is from the mud palms that also influence the setting angle.

I don't mean don't use the Danforth, just that it may or may not be great depending on size and weight relative to your boat length, windage, weight/etc. and the quality of the soup du jour wherever you might be anchoring next.

FWIW, we use an adjustable SuperMAX anchor here in the Chesapeake, with a Fortress as our hot spare. I don't think that means you need to rush right out to Amazon and buy a SuperMAX (although I do recommend it as a good anchor), but carrying a Fortress as the Danforth-style spare -- and as our primary, before we mounted the SuperMAX -- has been very useful for us around here.

-Chris

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Thanks Bill O.

We too draw 6.5 - may I ask what anchor you’ve used?
We have several onboard - CQR, Danforth, Delta & our current primary; Spade (all oversized )

Thanks again,

We had a Rocna 40kg down and ~75' of chain (from the snubber) in 7-8'. The immediate 180 wind shift accompanied by the heavy gusts even laid our boat over for a few seconds.


A Danforth or Fortress of decent size should hold well in the muddy bottoms.


Bill O.

[Bean Counter]

You could provide a few more facts to be useful. Length and weight and type of boat, depth, height of bow roller from water line,chain size, rode type, anchor weight.


So for example, we have anchored in that creek in stormy conditions too, at least there is little surge. Our boat is a 45 ft Cat, 20+ T fully loaded, 88 lbs anchor that meets manufacturers sizing guide, 7/16 all chain rode that meets manufacturers sizing guide, bow roller 6 ft above water line. At high tide in that creek say 9ft deep. So 7:1 rode would be (9+6)*7 = 105ft. In storm conditions we use 10:1. If you are restricted because of other boats then using too short a rode will have its consequences. If your anchor and chain are underweight for the boat size that too will have its consequences. Then, if your set up has met all the sizing requirements that likely leaves a fouled anchor by its own chain, log or weed on the bottom etc not allowing it to re-set.

[goat]

I was on a friends boat that started to drag. We let out more scope and continued to drag. Finally pulled up the anchor. Just as it cleared the surface, a piece of carpet fell off the anchor. If I hadn't been standing in the right place to see it, he would have blamed scope, anchor brand and who knows what else.

[SVRocinante]

Since we have gotten into naming anchors, I was hanging on my Spade 120.
55 lbs, galvanized - designed for 59’ / 35,370lb vessel vs our 40’ 17,500lb

I also have a CQR, a Delta & a Danforth on board.

[SVRocinante]

Thank you ranger42c

[SVRocinante]

Thanks Bill O.
Was curious to see if you were using a Fortress as well... your holding on the Rocna makes me think I might have failed to set properly in the first place... our scope was very similar. Snubber tied off at the 75’ mark, but the snubber length was probably shorter (about 15’)

[zeehag]

Originally Posted by goat

I was on a friends boat that started to drag. We let out more scope and continued to drag. Finally pulled up the anchor. Just as it cleared the surface, a piece of carpet fell off the anchor. If I hadn't been standing in the right place to see it, he would have blamed scope, anchor brand and who knows what else.

fort jefferson , opb, we dragged for all 5 days there... slight breeze..we flew.. pulled up anchor.. had some old drift net on the cqr-- cut it away and i kept the net for use in my boat as a souvenir. seems the net was barely buried under sand and prevented proper holding.

[SVRocinante]

Originally Posted by goat

I was on a friends boat that started to drag. We let out more scope and continued to drag. Finally pulled up the anchor. Just as it cleared the surface, a piece of carpet fell off the anchor. If I hadn't been standing in the right place to see it, he would have blamed scope, anchor brand and who knows what else.

Crazy stuff!

[Bean Counter]

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Since we have gotten into naming anchors, I was hanging on my Spade 120.
55 lbs, galvanized - designed for 59’ / 35,370lb vessel vs our 40’ 17,500lb

I also have a CQR, a Delta & a Danforth on board.

We know a boat that had a spade anchor. They loved it. Then had it re-galvanized and all the lead melted out in the process, but no one noticed until they dragged. They ordered a new one, weighed it and it was underweight - so maybe worth checking that is does weigh 55 lbs.

[SVRocinante]

Originally Posted by Bean Counter

You could provide a few more facts to be useful. Length and weight and type of boat, depth, height of bow roller from water line,chain size, rode type, anchor weight.


So for example, we have anchored in that creek in stormy conditions too, at least there is little surge. Our boat is a 45 ft Cat, 20+ T fully loaded, 88 lbs anchor that meets manufacturers sizing guide, 7/16 all chain rode that meets manufacturers sizing guide, bow roller 6 ft above water line. At high tide in that creek say 9ft deep. So 7:1 rode would be (9+6)*7 = 105ft. In storm conditions we use 10:1. If you are restricted because of other boats then using too short a rode will have its consequences. If your anchor and chain are underweight for the boat size that too will have its consequences. Then, if your set up has met all the sizing requirements that likely leaves a fouled anchor by its own chain, log or weed on the bottom etc not allowing it to re-set.

Thanks Bean Counter
Provided some of the info after the fact - I used (8+4)*7 = 84 & put out 90ish all chain, oversized anchor,etc.

I too use 10:1 WHEN I’M EXPECTING storm conditions - LOL!
This caught me by suprise... saw the storm clouds, but dismissed it as “just another thunderstorm” - expected heavy winds, but not the 40 & 60 knot gusts.

Thinking that was my biggest mistake - should have simply let out more chain & then pulled it back in if nothing materialized.

[SVRocinante]

Originally Posted by Bean Counter

We know a boat that had a spade anchor. They loved it. Then had it re-galvanized and all the lead melted out in the process, but no one noticed until they dragged. They ordered a new one, weighed it and it was underweight - so maybe worth checking that is does weigh 55 lbs.

Thanks - will do!

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by SVRocinante

Thanks Bill O.
Was curious to see if you were using a Fortress as well... your holding on the Rocna makes me think I might have failed to set properly in the first place... our scope was very similar. Snubber tied off at the 75’ mark, but the snubber length was probably shorter (about 15’)

Your Spade should be way oversized relative to our displacement/40kg Rocna and should be fine. We always have ~25' of snubber out (dual leg).


I think any anchor will have a difficult time handling a strong 180 wind shift. Good thing was it reset quickly.


Also if you are in the main creek area, the bottom may get "soupy" from over anchoring. Try that side cove I mentioned previously as it's a little further down the creek and less popular for anchoring due to the 2 minutes more one needs to motor into town.



Bill O.