Best iPad chart/navigation app

[requiem]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

Happy to help

Which are the chart-plotter features you miss in iSailor? I eventually found every function and even some missing in dedicated chart plotters!

Mainly more traditional plotting functions, e.g. plotting a visual fix or a clearing bearing, and being able to add annotations beyond point features (blocking out an area). I also like being able to use the NOAA charts, as they include the survey dates and quality info, and are regularly updated.

But, that doesn't always work well for RoW, where something like iSailor would be more affordable to cover charts for a large area. (And therein lies the rub, sometimes the available charts drive the app selection.)

The route editing features that wingssail mentioned in post 51 are also handy; I'm used to being able to enter coordinates by hand, build routes from existing waypoints, etc. If you have a collection of routes that often re-use points, or want to include particular spots offshore where you can't just eyeball it and tap, this becomes more critical.

[requiem]

Originally Posted by ranger58sb

Don't have Bahamas charts, so can't to a direct comparison.

Here's an iSailor snap of Chesapeake Bay Bridge area. Haven't ever figured out a way to reduce clutter when ranges are extended like that. iSailor "Tips" says there ought to be a swipe down for "Monitoring Panels" and a swipe up for a "Planning Tools Panel" -- but neither of those swipe options actually appear on our screen.

Same here, so here is that Chesapeake Bay area from SEAiq. The zoom level is a bit odd since some of the charts are compiled at a 1:25k scale and another for 1:80k scale; thus more details in some areas and fewer in others.

[hpeer]

Originally Posted by dlj

Personally I'd like to hear from folk that are doing extensive world sailing rather than only regional sailing. What is being used for circumnavigations for example? Or what is being used crossing oceans, and which oceans? What are folks using in remote areas? Which remote areas did you go to?

dj

I am not a World Cruiser but I have wandered from Southern Labrador to Grenada, up the Erie into the Great Lakes.

There is no one single BEST solution. The app is less important than the selection of charts available for the region of interest. For example “Explorer” are by far the best charts for Bahamas, what ever displays them is fine. Except Navionics, because they display SOME Explorer data but not all and have dangerous data.

KNKW THIS: apps are just a means of displaying chart data. So you need to first decide what is the best chart data for your region then select an app that displays that chart data.

That said l and from my limited experience, selecting for best support of various charts, the single best app for WORLD cruising is:
1: OCPN
2: iNavex

And you may need something else to cover specific areas.

Is there ANY app that will display the Panamanian / San Blas cruiser data?

The old Fugawi for PC was also damn good but sadly gone.

Others may have very good reasons for selecting something else.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by requiem

Mainly more traditional plotting functions, e.g. plotting a visual fix or a clearing bearing, and being able to add annotations beyond point features (blocking out an area). I also like being able to use the NOAA charts, as they include the survey dates and quality info, and are regularly updated.

But, that doesn't always work well for RoW, where something like iSailor would be more affordable to cover charts for a large area. (And therein lies the rub, sometimes the available charts drive the app selection.)

The route editing features that wingssail mentioned in post 51 are also handy; I'm used to being able to enter coordinates by hand, build routes from existing waypoints, etc. If you have a collection of routes that often re-use points, or want to include particular spots offshore where you can't just eyeball it and tap, this becomes more critical.

I don’t know any plotter that allows blocking out areas (???) but all other features you mention are easy to do in iSailor. Especially making waypoints and routes, these are real strongpoints.

For charts you’re locked in to Transas charts. We started using this as a backup to C-Map on a B&G plotter but after a couple seasons in the Bahamas, it has become the primary system as charts are generally good; about the same level as Explorer (=C-Map) and much better than Navionics but I must add that they have a bad rep in the Bahamas and may do better elsewhere. I find them too “course”.

Route editing also works great in iSailor. You can even do it in full visual mode by dragging waypoints around etc. as well as entering coordinates.

[requiem]

Originally Posted by hpeer

Is there ANY app that will display the Panamanian / San Blas cruiser data?

What format is it in? If it's BSB then there's hope for you.

To my surprise I found NOAA actually has ENC coverage there. It's not particularly detailed (only 1:50k scale), but seems to align with satellite imagery remarkably well. The image only shows the borders, but I also toggled the charts on/off to confirm positioning of small islands and such.

[requiem]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I don’t know any plotter that allows blocking out areas (???) but all other features you mention are easy to do in iSailor. Especially making waypoints and routes, these are real strongpoints.

...

Route editing also works great in iSailor. You can even do it in full visual mode by dragging waypoints around etc. as well as entering coordinates.

That's right, most plotters don't have such functionality, which is why I prefer phone/tablet/laptop.

I will probably need to dig through the manual more, because while I've found out how to tweak the waypoints via coordinates, I don't see a way to incorporate existing (non-route) waypoints in routes. Will try to create some examples to show.

[hpeer]

Originally Posted by requiem

What format is it in? If it's BSB then there's hope for you.

To my surprise I found NOAA actually has ENC coverage there. It's not particularly detailed (only 1:50k scale), but seems to align with satellite imagery remarkably well. The image only shows the borders, but I also toggled the charts on/off to confirm positioning of small islands and such.

I believe its a BOOK with hand drawn chartlets.

But they are the best available.

[dlj]

Originally Posted by hpeer

I am not a World Cruiser but I have wandered from Southern Labrador to Grenada, up the Erie into the Great Lakes.

There is no one single BEST solution. The app is less important than the selection of charts available for the region of interest. For example “Explorer” are by far the best charts for Bahamas, what ever displays them is fine. Except Navionics, because they display SOME Explorer data but not all and have dangerous data.

KNKW THIS: apps are just a means of displaying chart data. So you need to first decide what is the best chart data for your region then select an app that displays that chart data.

That said l and from my limited experience, selecting for best support of various charts, the single best app for WORLD cruising is:
1: OCPN
2: iNavex

And you may need something else to cover specific areas.

Is there ANY app that will display the Panamanian / San Blas cruiser data?

The old Fugawi for PC was also damn good but sadly gone.

Others may have very good reasons for selecting something else.

I'm very glad to read this. I've been looking at the modern computer based charts and OpenCPN has been really coming out on top. I will have to look into iNavex, haven't considered that one.

I understand there are some apps that allow you to download satellite images and convert them into charts (sort of) that you can run in OpenCPN and possibly others for areas where you can't find a good chart, or just to use as a second source of looking at what you do have for a chart of an area.

I'm still working on all this... Lots and lots to learn...

dj

[ilenart]

I have been sailing in some pretty remote areas of Australia ie Bay of Isles Esperance / Recherche Archipelago (where most of the official maps are marked as unsurveyed), across the Great Australian Bight, around Tasmania, etc. Have been running OpenCPN, Navionics, iNavX and what ever Raymarine uses. Have found that you need to look at more than one map source to get the best information, you cannot rely on one app. For Western Australia some of the best information was available from the WA Dept of Transport, which you can download for free as pdfs, however it was limited to a few areas and was not available on any app. You could potentially download it into OpenCPN, however the process looked way to complicated. I have also found the Australian OpenCPN maps available from the O Charts website to be unreliable, there was one island in the Recherche Archipelago that was missing, which was included on the three other apps. I also found in Australia that the iNavX and Navionics maps were equivalent, I just found the Navionics app way easier to use than iNavX, which is why I deleted iNavX.

I also found that the Zulu Offshore app very useful in that the comments from other cruises were often the most update for a particular anchorage or location. Was similar to the comments from users on the Navionics app.

Finally I also had onboard every local cruising guide I could find, including WA Cruising Guide, the two SA online guides, two Tasmanian guides, the two Lucas guides for the East coast, etc. They ranged from very good (WA) to out of date (Lucas).

For extended / remote cruising would suggest that you need to have more than one source of information. I had four map apps, plus everything else mentioned above. So far I have not hit anything (touch wood!).

Ilenart

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by requiem

What format is it in? If it's BSB then there's hope for you.

To my surprise I found NOAA actually has ENC coverage there. It's not particularly detailed (only 1:50k scale), but seems to align with satellite imagery remarkably well. The image only shows the borders, but I also toggled the charts on/off to confirm positioning of small islands and such.

For San Blas we normally use the Bauhaus charts, but I looked the area you show up in iSailor and although I think it’s a bit better than your image, I would still use Bauhaus.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by requiem

That's right, most plotters don't have such functionality, which is why I prefer phone/tablet/laptop.

I will probably need to dig through the manual more, because while I've found out how to tweak the waypoints via coordinates, I don't see a way to incorporate existing (non-route) waypoints in routes. Will try to create some examples to show.

I attached some pictures showing how to do this. First picture shows how I use existing waypoints, in this case they are the Explorer waypoints showing up around Great Sale Cay in the Bahamas. You see those waypoints on the chart and I set my route waypoint right next to them, on the safe side. I used to set them right on top but stopped doing that after reports of collisions at often used waypoints, so now I always stay a couple of boat-lengths away if possible. It also allows you to keep a better overview with the original waypoints visible next to your route.

The second image shows the waypoint edit with the coordinates at the top. Just tapping them brings up the edit mode.

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by requiem

Same here, so here is that Chesapeake Bay area from SEAiq. The zoom level is a bit odd since some of the charts are compiled at a 1:25k scale and another for 1:80k scale; thus more details in some areas and fewer in others.

Four screenshots of the same Chesapeake Bay Bridge area, for comparison. (Sorry, can't do Bahamas.) Upper left iSailor Android version (again), upper right NOAA raster, lower left NOAA vector, lower right Aqua Map Marine.

I would use a scale like this for big-picture presentation -- alongside a closer-in view on a different device (plotter, laptop, tablet, etc.) -- and the iSailor/Transas clutter makes it not easily usable for me. The two NOAA examples are snipped from TimeZero (Windows version), and I may have decluttered the vector version through the object presentation menu... maybe 12-ish years ago, so can't quite remember that off-hand. I find the two NOAA charts easy enough to use, but I've been using raster charts for so long it's taking me a bit to get used to vector.

Anyway, the Aqua Map version is about perfect for big picture and the Admiral usually has her 10" tablet set like that to backup whatever I'm displaying on our two plotters -- usually a close-in and a far-out NOAA pair, depending.

FWIW, I seldom bother to use waypoints for navigation, so I haven't tried to compare that function across systems. Just doesn't ring my chimes. Our area here is relatively simple, so even the few waypoints I set on our previous Furuno system didn't get much use. In that system, the AP was networked with the MFD, but even so, I found using it with waypoints/routes was more work than necessary. Our AP on this boat is currently stand-alone, slightly complicating the potential, but then again pushing the "go straight" button is just about all we usually need.

-Chris

[hpeer]

Ranger;

This post is fantastic as it shows the difference between PRESENTATION FORMATS.

They all show the same data, just presented differently.

Chart making is a very old profession, and at heart it is a well developed art.

The art has been honed over centuries by dedicated professionals with the goal of providing clear, important information in a STANDARD FORMAT. Standard so that when you look at a chart, even a new chart, you understand the iconography.

This is demonstrated above in the official government RASTER chart. Every chart has the same underlying principals and has been optimized for the displayed scale.

For example - This means that even in small scale charts significant hazards are noted. Once you attention is caught then you can go to a more local chart for details. This utility is lost in vector charts, and seasoned professionals have lost their boats.

It is the same reason all air traffic is conducted in English, a single standard is required.

While non-raster charts are adequate I prefer raster because I grew up looking at paper charts and their message is intuitive.

I do use AquaMaps in the USA, and find their presentation pretty good, but still find the decluttering troublesome.

I like OCPN and iNavex because I can view taster charts. OCPN has great ability to change vector chart presentation; what is displayed and how. At best it is not as clear as a raster chart, it takes learning and skill to make those changes, it is far too easy to omit something important, and I am not a trained cartographer who should he making those decisions.

[ranger58sb]

I'd forgotten I have another chart source on the same tablet. This is a C-Map chart from the old Plan2Nav app (which C-Map has since replaced with the Embark app).

The chart here is very much out of date, but illustrates the difference in clutter than I mentioned with the iSailor/Transas chart. Looks like there's a sounding every 23' or so (hyperbole) in the Transas chart; I don't see how they can have so many more data points and so would otherwise suspect those are guess-timates based on averaging and smoothing. Hard to see more important stuff though, with all that clutter on the screen.

Originally Posted by hpeer

OCPN has great ability to change vector chart presentation; what is displayed and how.

TimeZero (and the Furuno MFD versions of the same vector charts) offers that, too. I think I probably decluttered the TZ/vector presentation on this machine many years ago during the initial setup.

-Chris

[s/v Jedi]

What we have here is operator error, caused by affinity with paper charts and being unfamiliar with features of vector charts.

Note that commercial shipping uses vector charts and that current raster charts are made from the vector charts, meaning vector charts are the reference.

I included some screenshots of the same area that has different scale charts available. By making tiny adjustments in scale you get completely different presentations and users are supposed to learn and use these techniques before setting off and doing actual navigation with these charts.

Also, on the right you can see some chart options for vector charts. Chart bounderies let you know there is a more detailed chart available for which you need to zoom in.

For dealing with cluttering, you need to zoom out a little to loose that level of detail, or zoom in to spread it out more.