Mayday calls - where is that exactly?

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by derfy

You sound knowledgeable. I would like to understand this. I find nothing the COLREGS about the obligations of a vessel receiving a distress, nor in the USCG Rules of the Road. But I do find this reference in SOLAS.



Please comment on....


SOLAS Chapter V, REGULATION 33 - Distress messages: Obligations and procedures


1 The master of a ship at sea which is in a position to be able to provide
assistance on receiving a signal from any source that persons are in distress at sea, is bound to proceed with all speed to their assistance, if possible informing them or the search and rescue service that the ship is doing so.


[It does not say to report the signal to the Coast Guard and stand by for orders.]

Solas 2018 contains multiple reference to the GMDSS , regulation 33 further allows rescue agencies to actually requisition rescue assets and control them. 2018 Regulation 33 makes it very clear that government SAR are responsible not the ship per se. 2018 SOLAS specially mentions GMDSS regulations as pertaining while not specifically mentioning them all.

GMDSS carriage requirements specifically support ship to shore distress alerting. It’s a requirement that two independent means of reaching the shore . The key is “ reaching the shore “

GMDSS removed the solas 1911 model of distress handling , ie largely between vessels. Modern GMDSS and 2018 make it clear that “ contracting “ governments are responsible for SAR , ships must be willing to attend but 2018 Solas and GMDSS procedures place control primarily in search and rescue agencies these must be government run and controlled.

Furthermore in the US GMDSS regs are laid out in CFR title 47 part 80 subosrt W

You will see it clearly places control of a distress situation in the hands of the mrcc.

Remember in GMDSS it’s not a requirement that your distress broadcast reaches other ships it IS a requirement that your distress reaches the store.

GMDSS does not resolve an obligation on ships to get involved but it clearly moves control to the requisite government run shore facility. This is fundamentally different to the 2011 SOLAS convention.

Ҥ 80.1121 Receipt and acknowledgement of distress alerts by ship stations and ship earth stations.

(a) Ship or ship earth stations that receive a distress alert must, as soon as possible, inform the master or person responsible for the ship of the contents of the distress alert.

(b) For VHF and MF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall not transmit a distress alert relay, but should listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes and, if appropriate, acknowledge the alert by radiotelephony to the ship in distress and inform the coast station and/or Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all ships” on these bands may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(c) For HF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes. If no distress communications are heard and if the call is not acknowledged by a coast station, the ship shall transmit a distress relay on HF to the coast radio station and inform the Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all Ships” on HF may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(d) In cases where distress alert continues to be received from the same source, the ship may, after consultation with the Rescue Coordination Center, transmit a DSC acknowledgment to terminate the call.

(e) A ship station in receipt of a shore-to-ship distress alert relay (see § 80.1113(e)) should establish communication as directed and render such assistance as required and appropriate.

Hence a ship so receiving distress alerts then follows the GMDSS procedures. Such procedures say you attempt to coordinate with the rescue controlling centre. That centre has the legal power to direct you as required.

[David Mathis]

A few years ago on Lake Champlain we heard a frantic VHF call from a lady who appeared to be unfamiliar with boating or emergency procedures. She was the only person left in the boat and did not know her location, understand lat/lon, or could recognize any landmarks. It was a rough day and the USCG did not have a boat in the area; It was a dire emergency. She was advised to open the little red door on the radio and press the button for at least five seconds or until it beeped. Just like magic, her location appeared on our plotter, we went there and saved a life. No doubt, without the emergency signal, at least one life, possibly two would have been lost. It's a great system.

[CaptTom]

Originally Posted by David Mathis

A few years ago on Lake Champlain we heard a frantic VHF call from a lady who appeared to be unfamiliar with boating or emergency procedures...

Thank you for sharing that story. And thank you for maintaining a radio watch and taking action which saved a life.

I think this goes a long way toward answering those who question why they should bother turning on their radios.

[boat driver]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Solas 2018 contains multiple reference to the GMDSS , regulation 33 further allows rescue agencies to actually requisition rescue assets and control them. 2018 Regulation 33 makes it very clear that government SAR are responsible not the ship per se. 2018 SOLAS specially mentions GMDSS regulations as pertaining while not specifically mentioning them all.

GMDSS carriage requirements specifically support ship to shore distress alerting. It’s a requirement that two independent means of reaching the shore . The key is “ reaching the shore “

GMDSS removed the solas 1911 model of distress handling , ie largely between vessels. Modern GMDSS and 2018 make it clear that “ contracting “ governments are responsible for SAR , ships must be willing to attend but 2018 Solas and GMDSS procedures place control primarily in search and rescue agencies these must be government run and controlled.

Furthermore in the US GMDSS regs are laid out in CFR title 47 part 80 subosrt W

You will see it clearly places control of a distress situation in the hands of the mrcc.

Remember in GMDSS it’s not a requirement that your distress broadcast reaches other ships it IS a requirement that your distress reaches the store.

GMDSS does not resolve an obligation on ships to get involved but it clearly moves control to the requisite government run shore facility. This is fundamentally different to the 2011 SOLAS convention.

Ҥ 80.1121 Receipt and acknowledgement of distress alerts by ship stations and ship earth stations.

(a) Ship or ship earth stations that receive a distress alert must, as soon as possible, inform the master or person responsible for the ship of the contents of the distress alert.

(b) For VHF and MF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall not transmit a distress alert relay, but should listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes and, if appropriate, acknowledge the alert by radiotelephony to the ship in distress and inform the coast station and/or Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all ships” on these bands may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(c) For HF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes. If no distress communications are heard and if the call is not acknowledged by a coast station, the ship shall transmit a distress relay on HF to the coast radio station and inform the Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all Ships” on HF may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(d) In cases where distress alert continues to be received from the same source, the ship may, after consultation with the Rescue Coordination Center, transmit a DSC acknowledgment to terminate the call.

(e) A ship station in receipt of a shore-to-ship distress alert relay (see § 80.1113(e)) should establish communication as directed and render such assistance as required and appropriate.

Hence a ship so receiving distress alerts then follows the GMDSS procedures. Such procedures say you attempt to coordinate with the rescue controlling centre. That centre has the legal power to direct you as required.

Omg-
The initial discussion was discerning a mayday call on the Great Lakes- now we are discussing ships and gmdss?
Get simple to the small boat recreational market~ Recommend, emphasize, sell a gps for the DSC button,
Be situational awareness to you surroundings, and respond if you are in the vicinity to help.
Mayday is help , and v5hose without DSC and gps still do exist.
The system works as a professional, commercially with multiple methods.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by boat driver

Omg-

The initial discussion was discerning a mayday call on the Great Lakes- now we are discussing ships and gmdss?

Get simple to the small boat recreational market~ Recommend, emphasize, sell a gps for the DSC button,

Be situational awareness to you surroundings, and respond if you are in the vicinity to help.

Mayday is help , and v5hose without DSC and gps still do exist.

The system works as a professional, commercially with multiple methods.

Well this stage if you’ve not got DSC radio the equipment is very old. I’ve had DSC vhf now for 20 years

Professionally the GMDSS rescue procedures are well understood as all training emphasised it now for 20 years. Albeit the USA took a while too long with Rescue 21.

I routine receive all distress altering via DSC these days to the point where the DSC alarm is annoying

What really should have been added to the ITU DSC Spec was a simple way to send gps location along with a DSC alert.

Really these days solas V should be upgraded to mandate DSC radio on ALL craft over or equal to 8 metres

[donradcliffe]

All I get out of this thread is that emergency comms are still inconsistent and seriously screwed up. I used to get way too many DSC alerts in Europe about people who jumped off ferries 300 miles away. These alarms were earth shatteringly loud, even if the VHF volume was turned down all the way and flipped every VHF radio to Ch 16. The only solution to minimize crew fatigue was to turn off the radio.

Now I get zero DSC alerts. Offshore there is very little traffic that is not important to me, so I leave 16 on and the volume loud enough that the person on watch will hear a distress call. However, when I get within 300 miles of the US coast, I get Pan Pan calls from the USCG about boats in need of assistance 400 miles away. These calls are repeated every half hour for about 10 hours. In a short handed boat on autopilot, there is no one standing at the steering station, and to minimize crew fatigue is to turn the volume down.

The USCG has seriously big radios. Pre DSC I made a mayday relay call on Ch 16 from 400 miles south of the Mexican border for a ship 50 miles south of me, and it went through. The "any vessels in the area are asked to keep a sharp lookout and assist if possible" doesn't work well. I was headed down the coast past Monterey one rough evening and heard this call for assistance from CG Monterey for a broken down SeaRay at Pt Sur, which was about 30 miles from the CG station. You could tell from the conversation that the CG really didn't want to dispatch one of their boats on a mission which would probably last all night. Finally a vessel said they were in the area and could assist if needed. They were 30 miles out, and could arrive on scene in 2 hours. As the conversation continued it turned out they were a 200 meter ship with a turning radius of about half a mile. Station Monterey couldn't raise a commercial tower who would take the job in 30 knots of wind, so a bit later one of their 85 footers blew by.

What I would LIKE is a system which would alert me to a distress in an area which I could reach before anyone else, and would damp down the others to a red flashing light.

I am sure that with AIS and DSC technology that this is possible, and I would happily buy a new radio if necessary.

[goboatingnow]

There is certainly merit in being able to select on a DSC distress radio alerts “ within a radius “
Option this would require changes to imo GMDSS and solas rules however.

I find these days not too many DSC alerts , mainly refugees these days. Olympia radio seems to calmed down

I do appreciate DSC alerts for weather , safety of nav etc. better then the old voice announcements.

DSC is far from perfect but way better then voice only.

I do find NAVTEX great for a record of distress alerts as all distress alerts get duplicated on NAVTEX I recently added a paper printer to my NAVTEX and it’s invaluable. In fact it would convince me to switch off the vhf in future.

[GreenWave]

Originally Posted by Jammer

I make it a point to keep a pad of paper aboard, and something to write with that isn't affected by water -- either a pencil or a space pen. I think it's worthwhile to take steps to make sure the VHF is easy to understand throughout the boat. Usually this requires adding an extra speaker or two.

Isn't paper affected by water?


Here is what I came up with. My engine panel is located below my Cockpit MFD. It has a clear lexan cover on it (that lifts up for access). I keep a wax pencil there and can write down whatever I want on this panel. Every trip I jot down start time, engine hours etc. Can also quickly jot down call signs, LAT/LON, etc.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by GreenWave

Isn't paper affected by water?

Depends on the paper. Good quality paper will at least remain usable. There's some stuff like what Field Notes sells that is specifically intended for wet environments.

[JBsurfin]

Originally Posted by GreenWave

Isn't paper affected by water?


Here is what I came up with. My engine panel is located below my Cockpit MFD. It has a clear lexan cover on it (that lifts up for access). I keep a wax pencil there and can write down whatever I want on this panel. Every trip I jot down start time, engine hours etc. Can also quickly jot down call signs, LAT/LON, etc.

I also use a wax pencil and jot on the cabin exterior wall in the cockpit. Everything is right there, easy to read and waterproof. Comes off with a hand wipe.

[bensolomon]

Originally Posted by JBsurfin

I also use a wax pencil and jot on the cabin exterior wall in the cockpit. Everything is right there, easy to read and waterproof. Comes off with a hand wipe.

Genius idea!!! Thanks!!!

[derfy]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Solas 2018 contains multiple reference to the GMDSS , regulation 33 further allows rescue agencies to actually requisition rescue assets and control them. 2018 Regulation 33 makes it very clear that government SAR are responsible not the ship per se. 2018 SOLAS specially mentions GMDSS regulations as pertaining while not specifically mentioning them all.

GMDSS carriage requirements specifically support ship to shore distress alerting. It’s a requirement that two independent means of reaching the shore . The key is “ reaching the shore “

GMDSS removed the solas 1911 model of distress handling , ie largely between vessels. Modern GMDSS and 2018 make it clear that “ contracting “ governments are responsible for SAR , ships must be willing to attend but 2018 Solas and GMDSS procedures place control primarily in search and rescue agencies these must be government run and controlled.

Furthermore in the US GMDSS regs are laid out in CFR title 47 part 80 subosrt W

You will see it clearly places control of a distress situation in the hands of the mrcc.

Remember in GMDSS it’s not a requirement that your distress broadcast reaches other ships it IS a requirement that your distress reaches the store.

GMDSS does not resolve an obligation on ships to get involved but it clearly moves control to the requisite government run shore facility. This is fundamentally different to the 2011 SOLAS convention.

Ҥ 80.1121 Receipt and acknowledgement of distress alerts by ship stations and ship earth stations.

(a) Ship or ship earth stations that receive a distress alert must, as soon as possible, inform the master or person responsible for the ship of the contents of the distress alert.

(b) For VHF and MF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall not transmit a distress alert relay, but should listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes and, if appropriate, acknowledge the alert by radiotelephony to the ship in distress and inform the coast station and/or Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all ships” on these bands may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(c) For HF, ships in receipt of a distress alert shall listen on the distress traffic channel for 5 minutes. If no distress communications are heard and if the call is not acknowledged by a coast station, the ship shall transmit a distress relay on HF to the coast radio station and inform the Rescue Coordination Center. Distress alert relays to “all Ships” on HF may only be sent by a ship who has knowledge that another ship in distress is not itself able to transmit the distress alert, and the Master of the ship considers that further help is necessary.

(d) In cases where distress alert continues to be received from the same source, the ship may, after consultation with the Rescue Coordination Center, transmit a DSC acknowledgment to terminate the call.

(e) A ship station in receipt of a shore-to-ship distress alert relay (see § 80.1113(e)) should establish communication as directed and render such assistance as required and appropriate.

Hence a ship so receiving distress alerts then follows the GMDSS procedures. Such procedures say you attempt to coordinate with the rescue controlling centre. That centre has the legal power to direct you as required.

Your answer elaborates on the role of shore-based Rescue Coordination Center to control an incident and requisition assets. Okay, interesting.

But my question was really intended to understand the exact responsibilities of a ship's master when a distress signal is received. Can you summarize those obligations as simple bullet points? Thank you

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by derfy

Your answer elaborates on the role of shore-based Rescue Coordination Center to control an incident and requisition assets. Okay, interesting.

But my question was really intended to understand the exact responsibilities of a ship's master when a distress signal is received. Can you summarize those obligations as simple bullet points? Thank you

* to receive the DSC alert

*to wait for DSC alert to be acknowledged by the sending station and if not to relay the DSC alert onwards

To correspond with the mrcc and offer assistance and place themselves under the authority of the mrcc

To carry out the directions of the mrcc as to their actions in the distress operation including being released from an obligation to take part

[StuM]

Originally Posted by derfy

Your answer elaborates on the role of shore-based Rescue Coordination Center to control an incident and requisition assets. Okay, interesting.

But my question was really intended to understand the exact responsibilities of a ship's master when a distress signal is received. Can you summarize those obligations as simple bullet points? Thank you

UNCLOS:
Article 98
Duty to render assistance
1. Every State shall require the master of a ship flying its flag, in so far as he can do so without serious danger to the ship, the crew or the passengers:
(a) to render assistance to any person found at sea in danger of
being lost;
(b) to proceed with all possible speed to the rescue of persons in distress, if informed of their need of assistance, in so far as such action may reasonably be expected of him;
(c) after a collision, to render assistance to the other ship, its crew and its passengers and, where possible, to inform the other ship of the name of his own ship, its port of registry and the nearest port at which it will call.

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by StuM

UNCLOS:
Article 98
Duty to render assistance
1. Every State shall require the master of a ship flying its flag, in so far as he can do so without serious danger to the ship, the crew or the passengers:
(a) to render assistance to any person found at sea in danger of
being lost;
(b) to proceed with all possible speed to the rescue of persons in distress, if informed of their need of assistance, in so far as such action may reasonably be expected of him;
(c) after a collision, to render assistance to the other ship, its crew and its passengers and, where possible, to inform the other ship of the name of his own ship, its port of registry and the nearest port at which it will call.

So basically what we need Stu is for everyone out there to keep their VHF on and tuned to 16/67, or scanning and if you hear a Mayday call put a waypoint in your MFD and do a goto on the autopilot and listen for anyone else who might be closer.

Then we need the rescue coordinator to choose the responding vessel or vessels or aircraft.