Nav aids from the beginning

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Rob_P

Ask the missus if it's a problem to go shopping without any of that "land" stuff around.

Doncha just love newbies who come here knowing nothing, freely admit it, ask for advice and then proceed to continuously denigrate very experience cruisers when they offer good advice!


Sounds like the very definition of a troll to me

[Rob_P]

Originally Posted by StuM

Doncha just love newbies who come here knowing nothing, freely admit it, ask for advice and then proceed to continuously denigrate very experience cruisers when they offer good advice!


Sounds like the very definition of a troll to me

Trolls are people who post personal attacks against others. Attacks which come out of nowhere and are done for no apparent reason except to get attention for the troll.

Curmudgeons are sourpusses who occasionally act very much like trolls on the internet except with less humor and grace.

N00bs are people who come seeking information, encouragement, and edification and who usually get flamed by trolls and sourpusses merely for asking questions and questioning the answers because no one ever gains true understanding merely by following the advice of "elders" who "always do it that way."

To wit:

I have NO exposure to, or experience with, navigational aids. Telling me to go get a magnetic compass and learn to use it isn't helpful when I'm trying to get information about ELECTRONIC navigational aids, what hardware I need, and what software would best suit my requirements.

Denigrating me for my response that it's difficult to get lost here because there's a GIGANTICALLY HUGE freaking continent in the direction the sun rises from anywhere I could conceivably wind up when I'm out on the ocean around here, isn't helpful either.

Navigational aids would be extremely helpful to find my way home without having to stop and ask for directions after following my nose east and finding myself on a seashore someplace. Not wanting to ask for directions is a "guy thing." I'm sure you understand.

[Jim Cate]

Navigational aids would be extremely helpful to find my way home without having to stop and ask for directions after following my nose east and finding myself on a seashore someplace.

Rob, what you don't seem to be grasping is that while chart plotters make things easier, it benefits you to have the basic piloting skills to fall back on should the electronics stop working. And things like a magnetic steering compass and a hand bearing compass are some of the tools that one uses for such piloting. Contemptuous dismissal of suggestions that you acquire and learn the use of these basic tools isn't earning you any brownie points with the folks you are asking for help. Your blasé assumption that if you simply sail towards the rising sun and all will be well is perhaps a bit naïve. Your subsequent defense of the position was a bit aggravating to those who were but trying to help, for there are quite a few spots on the west coast where one might not want to fetch up in reduced visibility.

Acquiring and understanding the electronic gear is also important, no doubt about that, and there are plenty of folks here who can help with that. It is easy to fall into the trap of "needing" the latest and greatest e-whizbang, and there are a few advocates of such that will likely chime in. As you evaluate the conflicting opinions that will roll in, pay special attention to the few who are actually actively using such devices whilst cruising, for their opinions may well differ from those who read the glossy magazines.

And BTW, the "spouse" (that I should consult re provisioning) and I have been full time cruisers for 35 years now, and yes, we understand about needing shore access.

Jim

[Uricanejack]

My personal nav aids
I carried my own as an instructor or charter.
1 nice pair of Bino’s I like 10 x 50 Nikon.
1 hockey puck HBC.
1 Breton plotter or knock off.
You could add a decent pencil.

Boat should have charts and publications on board.
Not nav aids but. A leather man, multi diver and a decent small flashlight come in handy.

[Rob_P]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Rob, what you don't seem to be grasping is

*clipped because it's nonsense*

Jim

Jim, I'm sorry but I've reached the end of my rope with you.

I didn't ask about "how to navigate", I asked about what electronics I need. What I got from you was worthless garbage that you keep trying to pawn off as "knowledge" when it isn't. It's not applicable and it assumes without facts that I don't know how to use a compass/map/chart and thus have less knowledge than the average cub scout.

Which is really really insulting on a basic level. Insult which you then add to by flaunting your "experience" and implying that anyone who questions you about it is stupid, argumentative, or a forum troll trying to stir up controversy just to get attention.

This isn't the first time you've done this in one of my threads either. So thank you for your input, but please refrain in the future from telling me things which have no relevance and then insisting on telling me it's my fault that you don't understand the question presented.

Thank you.

[HeinSdL]

Originally Posted by Rob_P

Jim, I'm sorry but I've reached the end of my rope with you.

I didn't ask about "how to navigate", I asked about what electronics I need. What I got from you was worthless garbage that you keep trying to pawn off as "knowledge" when it isn't. It's not applicable and it assumes without facts that I don't know how to use a compass/map/chart and thus have less knowledge than the average cub scout.

Which is really really insulting on a basic level. Insult which you then add to by flaunting your "experience" and implying that anyone who questions you about it is stupid, argumentative, or a forum troll trying to stir up controversy just to get attention.

This isn't the first time you've done this in one of my threads either. So thank you for your input, but please refrain in the future from telling me things which have no relevance and then insisting on telling me it's my fault that you don't understand the question presented.

Thank you.

Rob, we're all (supposed to be) sailors on this forum. On the whole I find the sailing community in real life a very pleasant community to be a member of. Perhaps we can try and emulate this here on line, bearing in mind that communication on line is a lot tougher to 'get right' as opposed to shooting the crap between neighbours on a jetty?

I haven't been here that long but after a while I think you kind of see who is who here, meaning someone who has posted thousands of messages, most of which are really quite helpful & supportive, can surely not have such bad intentions as you allude to.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Rob_P

Jim, I'm sorry but I've reached the end of my rope with you.

I didn't ask about "how to navigate", I asked about what electronics I need. What I got from you was worthless garbage that you keep trying to pawn off as "knowledge" when it isn't. It's not applicable and it assumes without facts that I don't know how to use a compass/map/chart and thus have less knowledge than the average cub scout.

Which is really really insulting on a basic level. Insult which you then add to by flaunting your "experience" and implying that anyone who questions you about it is stupid, argumentative, or a forum troll trying to stir up controversy just to get attention.

This isn't the first time you've done this in one of my threads either. So thank you for your input, but please refrain in the future from telling me things which have no relevance and then insisting on telling me it's my fault that you don't understand the question presented.

Thank you.

Says the guy stamping his feet in a temper yet craps himself over the most basic of sailing exams..

[StuM]

Starting to see a pattern here. Note the first thread with a similar outcome by the same new member

Ask a question, get good advice, respond with incorrect comments revealing total ignorance, spit the dummy when errors are politely pointed out by very helpful and experienced members.


FWIW, I didn't see anything in the OP limiting the question to electronics."I have nada, zip, nothing in the way of navigational aids. I will be buying the "binder" of our local charts one I get into ASA103 in a week or so, but other than that, I don't have anything."
Someone very sensibly suggested a hand bearing compass and immediately we get into the aggressive, dismissive comments culminating in the dummy spit

[AKA-None]

Originally Posted by StuM

Starting to see a pattern here. Note the first thread with a similar outcome by the same new member

Ask a question, get good advice, respond with incorrect comments revealing total ignorance, spit the dummy when errors are politely pointed out by very helpful and experienced members.


FWIW, I didn't see anything in the OP limiting the question to electronics."I have nada, zip, nothing in the way of navigational aids. I will be buying the "binder" of our local charts one I get into ASA103 in a week or so, but other than that, I don't have anything."
Someone very sensibly suggested a hand bearing compass and immediately we get into the aggressive, dismissive comments culminating in the dummy spit

This is what I also read meaning that Jim’s comments seem perfectly in order. Eg get the basics of needed but non electrical nav aids then consider electronics.
I presume others made the assumption that no nav aides meant no electronic nav aides.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

This is what I also read meaning that Jim’s comments seem perfectly in order. Eg get the basics of needed but non electrical nav aids then consider electronics.
I presume others made the assumption that no nav aides meant no electronic nav aides.

I figured he meant electronic as that's all folks can be bothered with today.. Look at a screen and press some buttons.. but further down thread I agreed with Jim that he'd need a compass to go with his paper charts.

[requiem]

Originally Posted by AKA-None

I presume others made the assumption that no nav aides meant no electronic nav aides.

Indeed, I took it to mean he had a plan for the paper side but was looking for guidance on the electronic side. There are many ways to interpret online postings, and to take offense easily is to similarly make assumptions about what was intended.

On reflection, I should have included the hand-compass in my "analog" list; I had left it out because I consider it a more fundamental bit of kit (like a PFD) that's applicable regardless of the nav tools in use.

"Just head east" is a perfectly fine joke, but intended more seriously, well, there's a reason the California coastline is responsible for the largest peacetime naval loss in US History.

(And lollipops? You kids get lollipops these days?!)

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by requiem

(And lollipops? You kids get lollipops these days?!)

Jim was fending off ships sides with a boat hook when this guy was fending off shop windows with a lollipop stick..
Old Royal Navy expression..

[jalmberg]

If you have a chart plotter and paper charts, you are good to go. Resist the urge to buy a lot of stuff. This s is hard, but there will be plenty of things you will really need if you buy a boat.

As for tablets and nav programs, people generally recommend what they have. I use an iPad and AquaMap but someone else will have something else. The big problem with tablets is they overheat and shut off if left in the sun. A real chart plotter is much better for cockpit use, in my experience.

Have fun.

[skenn_ie]

A basic GPS receiver which shows Lat and Long. Get practiced with transposing that info onto your charts. Navionics for Android or iphone of iPad. Download charts for your area.

[Bluechart]

Originally Posted by Rob_P

I have nada, zip, nothing in the way of navigational aids. I will be buying the "binder" of our local charts one I get into ASA103 in a week or so, but other than that, I don't have anything.

I would like to have my own navigational device, even though the charter boats I'll be using will have their on-board plotter, for 2 reasons:

1. Redundancy is king.

2. I will be buying my own boat some day (highly likely but still a maybe) and will need something then. Being totally familiar with my own navigational display will be a plus at that point.

So, beginning at the beginning, I'm thinking of a tablet for this. Something like a Samsung with a 10" screen and built in GPS instead of cellular GPS.

But, where do I go from there?

Boating Navionics
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/boatin...es/id744920098

Will allow you to navigate all the way to Hawaii for example, built in GPS on iPad is all you need. AND you get Active Captain with it, so you can see and read comments by fellow cruisers on where and where not to anchor.

While in the Sea of Cortez we were sailing north, and Active Captain alerted us to a rock formation 300’ x 300’x 5’ deep, that was surveyed by a fellow cruiser.
(Many areas of the Sea of Cortez have not been surveyed since the late 1800’s!)

On my laptop, I’m running Rose Point Software, Coastal Explorer.
You can use a simple USB GPS puck for vessel location.

I’m using the iPad and laptop in addition to my chart plotter/Nav Instruments.