Non-stop to Bahamas from Halifax, Canada - in late fall: Suicide? Advice please.

[flyingfin]

Head to Bermuda, if you have any systems failures, you can always ride the gulfstream to the UK. Just take enough food & water!

Or hire a captain to run the vessel to Bahamas and just fly there to meet up.

Look ahead for prevailing winds by checking www.windguru.cz, then Map tab, then Forecast tab

[multi-hulls]

Maybe put a feeler out for additional crew?

[multi-hulls]

I think capnjack is onto something...what's the worst that could happen...kick you out of the country? LOL

[Classicsailboat]

Tropical storm 16 has just developed in the western Caribbean and is forecast to hit land near the florida panhandle Sunday night.

[serbben55]

If you need a help, I can help you as a crew from Halifax to Bermudas and then to Bahamas. I have 22 yrs experience in delivering boats on east and west cost. just drop me a letter and let me know about the situation

[SVTatia]

Originally Posted by Grant Gordon

Hi there. I did the Halifax - Bermuda trip last year and will be doing it again later this month. It's best to wait until later in October (I've left as late as Nov 11 but that's pushing it a bit). The prevailing winds start to shift from SW to W or NW. Much nicer ride. It's about 740NM from here to St. Georges. That should only be 5 or 6 days on your boat.

Originally Posted by NSboatman

Heya- totally doable. It's all about picking your weather window. Grant has it about right- as do others. Pm me and I may be able to help you with picking a window. Can certainly show you how we do it anyway. Done that run a fair number of times now... lost track to be honest. Where are you in halifax?

Originally Posted by capnjack.morton

Let me stir up a hornets nest here. I've done all the legs of that trip, and to sail by Bermuda without stopping seems worse than a shame. It's been my understanding that a ship may stop in any port as necessary for safety, including respite from weather, need for necessary repairs, need to replenish exhausted provisions or water, etc. The process falls under entry "under protest". At this point, my betters, maritime lawyers, armchair lawyers and the like, can jump in to educate us all on that process, clarifying whether it's the maritime equivalent of urban myth or legitimate.
If you were to enter Bermuda at St. Georges using that process, they would want to see what the emergency was, which in your case would most likely have to do with provisions or weather, and your stay would probably be limited to the time necessary to set things right. It might also be that Elena could not leave the boat, but it would give you at least a couple of nights of rest at anchor, and the chance to replenish food, fuel, and water, as needed.
Now let me duck, as folks launch their assaults.

I agree with the above and capnjack has a good point.
I would still go towards Bermuda planning to stop there. The other side of the gulf is warmer and it will be quicker.

So get the weather window and pay attention to the gulf stream and where the east/west or north/south walls are. You don't want to have wind against the gulf.

NDBC - National Weather Service Marine Forecast FZUS52 KMFL

[CSailor]

Thank you, everyone... your replies and advice are right on the spot for what we need, very useful (and funny - "quit smoking after that trip"). What we really need is to know that although it is doable, it is dangerous. Knowing the kinds of things that have happened on the route - two sailing ships going down, some making it, some not, is important ammo for us and our plan of action.

Of course, we could winter in Halifax aboard this non-insulated, fiberglass, charter yacht, sans heater. The boat might make it, but we probably wouldn't. Besides that, we want to - no, we HAVE to - go on with our lives. We refuse to play this pathetic Immigration Canada optics game any more. Hell, it's been 11 years since we fled Russia, then Turkey, on the same boat, and Elena is still stateless! We simply can't waste more of our lives frozen into the ice playing the victim card. We'd rather play the Trump card, asking for USA's mercy to let us crawl down the coast. Or take our chances with the ocean. We have GOT to sail. We are taking back our lives. If that means we are taking our own lives, so be it... at least we aren't letting someone else take them.

And knowing what is out there, and being able to explain that, or even show some of your posts and experiences to a US border officer, or even the President, in an open letter, just might get us access to safe harbor on the way south, to the regrouping and ass-saving grounds.

So keep it coming, cruisers forumers... you're great!

.... and Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you!
Elena & Meg (AKA Morgan Stone)

[Classicsailboat]

Don’t let the frustration of your situation have you make a bad decision. If you go to sea the real question is can you and your boat survive a hurricane. Matters little that others have done it successfully in the past, or that you have experienced crew on board. Don’t be afraid to change your mind. Good luck.

[leboyd]

Originally Posted by Cpt. Jay Boland

Weather window and 100 miles from coast max. I have been associated with two traditional large sail vessels, each went down on October 29, off Hatteras. Perfect storm and Sandy. Longer but safer.

In my opinion, this is the best advice you've received. I wouldn't even venture out more than 50 miles from US coast. It will be longer and slower, but you have nearly a 100% chance of making it safely. On your boat, 50 miles sounds like a short distance. In normal weather it's "only" a ten hour trip. But if something like the new storm "Nate" gets in the way, your ten hours could easily turn to twice that sailing in big seas. You could make a direct, straight run for it in perfect weather and never even blink an eye at danger. However, with your concerns (which are valid) why even risk it going to Bermuda? Just hug the US coast and if provisions or weather require you to "come ashore mate," then so be it. I believe you do have the right for emergency stopping by boat in any port.

Fair winds and keep us update on what you decide and how your trip goes.

[brownoarsman]

Is it your boat or yourselves that are not allowed back into the USA for the time being? If just yourselves, then, as suggested earlier, and if funds permit, hiring a delivery captain who CAN legally duck in and out of US ports with your boat (but without you), and then meeting the delivery captain in the Bahamas is likely the safest option.

[CSailor]

Originally Posted by leboyd

In my opinion, this is the best advice you've received. I wouldn't even venture out more than 50 miles from US coast. It will be longer and slower, but you have nearly a 100% chance of making it safely. ... Just hug the US coast and if provisions or weather require you to "come ashore mate," then so be it. I believe you do have the right for emergency stopping by boat in any port.

Fair winds and keep us update on what you decide and how your trip goes.

Yes, I think that's an excellent plan! Right now the wind is blasting up from the southwest. We're watching wx charts with every new issue, little highs building in and vanishing and gribs are showing a cold front (or polar high outflow) next Wednesday... but we've got the groceries stowed, the tanks full and we're ready to spark up the coffee grinder and hit the open sea in a hour's notice. We'll definitely provide updates, and even position reports via Elena's site, when we're underway, at least a few days from now.

We've decided to write to President Trump in an open letter to explain how this LGBT couple from Canada ended up inadmissible - it might get us back into USA (we hope) and more than that it will dispel a myth or two some people have about this northern utopia (and it's optics driven immigration and refugee system). BUT that's politics and gives us a sick headache, all we want to do is live our lives, have our dreams, our freedom, and the right to point the boat in whatever direction we want.

Oh yeah, and a catamaran... we REALLY want a fast, capable cat.... ah, to dream.

[KP44]

Just two chicks? Women are just as capable as anyone else.
Sounds like a good sized, capable boat. Just reef early and remember that the boat can take more than any of us can. So trust the ship and trust yourself.

[CarlF]

I really would not write Trump. Even Obama probably wouldn't have helped. Unfortunately, your overstaying the visa put you on the wrong list. This has been true for a long time. It's hard to fix. You really don't want them to pay attention to you.

In Bermuda you would have two options to explore with the officials.

The easiest is for just the vessel and yourself to be cleared. It is not at all uncommon for vessels to have one or more crew members who are not allowed to land in a country. They have to stay on the ship. Happens all the time.

The fallback is to claim temporary refuge for your boat due to weather, supplies or mechanical issue. This is a longstanding international right. Can it be denied? Sure but not lightly. I'd be really surprised if an island nation like Bermuda turned you down. Since it has to be an emergency you can't plan ahead. Just show up. You have to be convincing to officials that you don't intend to stay longer than necessary.

I agree that you don't want to be anywhere near Hatteras in late fall. That's where storms are born. You don't see them coming until they are on you. I only take the ICW to get past Hatteras at this time of year - but you obviously can't do that.

The rhumb line from Halifax to Bermuda is 500 miles from Hatteras in much safer waters. The Bermuda route also means only one "distress" stop. It will be very hard to go down the US coast without needing to stop several times. They aren't going to believe you.

The hurricane risk is pretty easy to manage as long as you have reliable weather reports along the way. Assume you'll need 6 days to get to Bermuda. Take enough diesel to motor for at least two days if you have no wind - maybe 20 extra gallons in jerry jugs to your boat's 50. At the 3 day half-way point, if the weather reports show any hurricane that conceivably could get to you in five days turn around and go back to Canada or into the US and claim refuge. With satellite or HF weather, there is no reason to ever be at sea near a hurricane.

Once you get to Bermuda, they will certainly not make you leave if there's any hurricane risk at all.

Finally, are you positive the Bahamas will accept you? I would have expected Bermuda to be less trouble than the Bahamas.Their immigration is quite formal and not all rules are consistently applied (or well understood). In any case, remember you will need $300 in cash to get a cruising permit for the boat.

https://www.nassauparadiseisland.com...on-us-citizens

[NSboatman]

Don't be frozen by fear. Yes there's risk - it's a BOAT after all. Yes you can die, and yes the North Atlantic in October can be a freaking scary place (It can also be a wonderfully peaceful place). But it gets worse form here on in, so if you're going, don't miss the next real window. You could die on a coastal passage too - certainly the traffic is a lot more, and if you fall overboard you're equally likely to die within a few miles of shore as you are 500 miles offshore.

Plenty of less capable boats have made the trip you propose to do, at this time of year. Just go into it with your eyes open and with a good weather window.

I've done this trip a good number of times, each way, and only once did we really properly get our arses kicked, and in retrospect that was predictable and poor forecasting by me. Every other trip has been reasonably comfortable and ocasionally gorgeous.

Now, the arse kicking was not fun - we were knocked down, pooped repeatedly, tore almost every sail, lost our dodger, engine, got several hundred gallons of water below; and spent 12 hours surfing and crashing down truly vicious short seas in the Gulf Stream essentially out of control. We made it thru but only just, and it was truly a survival situation at the peak...

but - a bone-stock CS36 with old sails, completely inexperienced crew (first trip), and no significant planning in evidence left from Halifax 12 hours after us, and arrived in Bermuda about 12 hours after us, with no more damage than a torn dodger. They lay hove-to to a huge parachute sea anchor that they found on the boat... and slept for 12 hours.

I felt like a noob- and I had probably close to 30,000 nm offshore experience by that stage.

so - do your homework, prepare the boat, prepare yourselves, find the window, and go. just DON"T go if you don't get a good window - there is no shame in the coastal plan B if the weather isn't cooperating. Some years it's the only (reasonable) option - but only you can make that final decision.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by Classicsailboat

Tropical storm 16 has just developed in the western Caribbean and is forecast to hit land near the florida panhandle Sunday night.

Probably worth letting this one pass before setting off