Dealing with Sailors and drugs.

[Dooglas]

For those of you who say abusing stimulants is no worse than abusing alcohol - I don't associate with people I encounter falling down drunk at the yacht club either.

[Chotu]

Wow!!!

May I just say you never cease to amaze me? (In a good way)

That is all.

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

Honestly, I think you guys are a little off base.

Don (the OP) does ocean racing. He spearheads race crews--AND he does not want intoxicated people on his crew, nor problems for the boats' owners from the Coast Guard. A lot of these popular drugs are illegal. It would be a huge problem for him for crew on the vessel he is skippering.

So, with the implied question, I think he needs to make it clear that crew under the influence of illegal drugs are not welcome [and maybe alcohol, as well], and get the crew who want to crew to get their urine tested each time before coming aboard. Perhaps the owner will pay for the testing, because you don't want any of it present when the CG boards with their swipes. Some of the drugs impair decision making where they are a danger to the rest of the crew, especially downwind in 30 kn. with the chute up. [I've crewed on boats having storm chutes. Racing is different from cruising.]

I'm a retired drug counselor, with a Masters in psych. with a specialization in chemical dependency treatment, and also, people treated with thorazine (it's an anti-psychotic drug with many side effects) may also exhibit nystagmus.

The thing is, Don can't tell from the symptoms what the cause is, so he needs a simple, enforceable policy.

Ann

[boatman61]

There is a time and place for everything.. anyone who does not recognise that is a waste of space.
I'd be more worried about steroid users personally.. recreational drug users are rarely competitors.. its just too stressful..

[wholybee]

I have had close friends and family live with addiction, and had to deal with the problem in my own home before I took to cruising. It sucks, for the addicted, and everyone around them.

I am very clear to my potential crew that my boat is clean and dry. I have had my boat searched a number of times by drug dogs (and there was nothing to find) but I am clear on this point, that I have the right to inspect my crew's bags, and that all medications, prescription or not, need to go in the first aid case. Then I tell the story of when I caught a crew member smoking weed in a country it was not allowed, and that I dragged them to immigration, removed them from my crew list, and made them call their mommy to buy them a plane ticket. The goal is that anyone thinking they might use will simply want to look for another boat.

Another possible issue that has happened to a couple of my friends. Crew coming aboard were serious alcoholics, and got the idea that a several week passage where there was no alcohol available would be a good way to quit. It turned into a medical emergency when the crew nearly died from withdrawal.

The best you can do is just be very clear of your expectations, and do everything you can to know your crew. I now prefer to single hand over taking on crew I don't know.

[Boatyarddog]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

Thanks for all the input.

I have a lifetime of experience with drunks, and kind of know what to expect and how to deal with it.

Part of my delivery crew notes

"Alcohol and Drugs XXXXXXXX is a drug-free boat, and NO RECREATIONAL DRUGS WILL BE TOLERATED! (While California may have legalized marijuana, the Coast Guard is still enforcing federal marijuana laws, which can result in forfeiture of the boat.) Alcohol under way will be limited to one beer or glass of wine per day in good weather. "

The only time I had trouble with alcohol under way was with a couple of internet Australian crew, who got drunk one watch on passage from Singapore to Phuket. They got reamed out and didn't give any more trouble.

I'm not sure what he was high on, but probably not PCP (violence was not his first reaction). Cocaine use peaked around here 25 years ago, and the youngsters have moved on. Definitely not weed, dude. Meth is endemic in the large homeless population here, but is said not to be a recreational drug.

I assume that every police academy has classes in recognizing and dealing with situations like this, and if they don't there is on-the-job training their first week.

Well, you could have just been honest and asked if he was okay, feeling okay, and explain why you were concerned.
In a polite way.
You can tell more about a person when you offer assistance, and how it's received.

That would be a compassionate response.
Much more appropriate than a generalization, due to Unknown reasons.
Boatyarddog

[David Mathis]

Do you really care what drug he is using? The simple answer is: He can't come on your boat regardless of his skills. If you need a crew, keep looking.

[sailorladd]

That is a very sad story, I was young once and my entire life's dream revolved around acquiring a yacht to sail around the world.

I eventually had to build one from scratch as that was my only choice, I wonder if I would have turned to drugs if that final avenue had been closed to me... maybe alcohol..."Where there's a will, there's a way." I always say...

I keep stressing to people that we all of us, have so much inside us that we are unaware of... tap into your inner self, it is full of wonderful surprises!!

[donradcliffe]

I did query the lad's peers, and they said cocaine was his drug of choice and still very available. Plus, they find him a little weird.

I did several Transpacs with a coke dealer, but he never got high underway.

The bartenders at the YC are used to dealing with drunks, and will cut them off because they and the club can be liable if they knowingly serve a very intoxicated person.

Needless to say, the lad will not be on MY crew list.

[MicHughV]

Interesting topic.

I'll add my 2c.

In the 35 plus years that I have been afloat, I have never once come across a sailor of any kind that had a drug problem of any kind. Not once...not ever.

Alcohol...sure....but drugs...no....

There could be a myriad of reason to explain a sailor's strange or unusual behavior, and I've seen plenty of that, but I doubt a drug habit would be at the forefront.

Methinks this topic could use a re-think.

[JPA Cate]

It CAN BE a problem for people who go offshore and then have to run the Customs & Immigration gauntlet on return; and I can guarantee you that none of the men who hire Don to run their boats want any kind of a legal hassle. Which IS why he has the policy, and it is so clear. In the US, drug possession and use is an issue. Ymmv. Protects everybody but the drug user.

The grandiosity that accompanies cocaine usage can lead to poor decisions. Not someone I'd want on my foredeck.

FWIW, the effects of various drugs on mentition and coordination, all the way to psychotic effects, are well documented in medical journals, they are all too real.



Ann

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

I was in the Yacht Club after the beer can race last night, and encountered a guy in his 20's, who has a reputation as a pretty good sailor. He was unable to maintain a rational conversation, seem to be struggling with himself, and his eyes shook (Nystagmus). He didn't recognize me, but in his mumbling, he seemed to be upset that he couldn't have the things I had, like a house or boat of his own. He wandered out a few minutes later with a young woman in tow.

I do empathize with his generation, because in my day affording a house and a 25 ft boat was in the reach of most people with a decent job. Now it is not, and the yacht club gets greyer every year and many young people turn to drugs to escape.

I don't think he was drunk, because his speech wasn't slurred. My best guess is that he was on Meth, but I realize that I am insufficiently trained know. I really need to learn more to ensure that I won't be stuck on a boat in the middle of the ocean with crew in that condition. I don't think the yacht club staff is sufficiently trained in how to deal with members or guests like that either.

"escape from what"?

[JoetheCobbler]

Hello.
My name's Joe, and I'm addicted to sailing And living aboard.

[gonesail]

hard to say .. he could have been tired and had too much sun. maybe had a bad day or fight with girlfriend. i always try to give young folks the benefit of the doubt but then again i was not there and i don't know the guy

[paralog]

Originally Posted by donradcliffe

I was in the Yacht Club after the beer can race last night, and encountered a guy in his 20's, who has a reputation as a pretty good sailor. He was unable to maintain a rational conversation, seem to be struggling with himself, and his eyes shook (Nystagmus). He didn't recognize me, but in his mumbling, he seemed to be upset that he couldn't have the things I had, like a house or boat of his own. He wandered out a few minutes later with a young woman in tow.

I do empathize with his generation, because in my day affording a house and a 25 ft boat was in the reach of most people with a decent job. Now it is not, and the yacht club gets greyer every year and many young people turn to drugs to escape.

I don't think he was drunk, because his speech wasn't slurred. My best guess is that he was on Meth, but I realize that I am insufficiently trained know. I really need to learn more to ensure that I won't be stuck on a boat in the middle of the ocean with crew in that condition. I don't think the yacht club staff is sufficiently trained in how to deal with members or guests like that either.

While i don't condone illegal drug taking at anytime I would suggest that you take a good hard look around your fancy yacht club and i bet there are a fair amount of the members who struggle with Alcohol and probably quite few that like a sniff or two of columbia's finest product. Do you go sailing with them?

[Oeanda]

Stating the obvious for no real good reason, but- a drug that comes in liquid form is still a drug, IMO. Alcoholism- destroyer of my true love’s life. Ugh. What a horrible disease