Cruising insurance premium doubled

[tfrankum]

I have used several carriers over the years and GEICO / Boat US and Pantaneous America seem to be better. A lot of carriers go to the Lloyds of London for the writing of insurance policies. Lloyds reportedly has suffered losses in their Marine division and have informed Insurance companies that due to huge losses, which were due to weather this year and the fact that this division has lost money over the years that an increase will be forth coming. This may be the reason for the 80% increase.

[Tortuga's Lie]

I bought my Tartan 3 years ago when she was 17 years old, I went through IMIS which sold me a Seaworthy/Geico policy for $650 +/- with decent coverage for the Chesapeake/Delaware/Pamilco areas including limited offshore to do a DelMarVa circumnavigation. This policy is now $1130 for the same coverage.............no claims.
In order to change companies, I would need to shell out for a survey which could run several hundred plus the haul out costs.........
Maybe a liability only policy is starting to make sense!
Tom

[Tortuga's Lie]

On another note about insurance, my house which has a value of over 5 times that of my boat costs about $200/year less to insure than my boat.............go figure.

[14murs14]

Originally Posted by Tortuga's Lie

On another note about insurance, my house which has a value of over 5 times that of my boat costs about $200/year less to insure than my boat.............go figure.

When your house can run on a reef or be struck by another house or drag anchor or run over someone and injure or kill them or....any of hundreds of potential loss and liability scenarios that boats can and do face every year and houses don't... you would expect it to have similar insurance cost to your boat!

[Tortuga's Lie]

Originally Posted by 14murs14

When your house can run on a reef or be struck by another house or drag anchor or run over someone and injure or kill them or....any of hundreds of potential loss and liability scenarios that boats can and do face every year and houses don't... you would expect it to have similar insurance cost to your boat!

This is true, but the house can also be subjected to hurricanes, tornadoes, fires, trees, flooding, lightening, termites, vandalism.........etc. I also have a dock and a center console fishing boat covered in my homeowners policy.

[14murs14]

Originally Posted by Tortuga's Lie

This is true, but the house can also be subjected to hurricanes, tornadoes, fires, trees, flooding, lightening, termites, vandalism.........etc. I also have a dock and a center console fishing boat covered in my homeowners policy.

Curious who you have your policy with, I may want to switch to them. Every homeowners quote we've gotten "covers" the dock against fire, and I think maybe a couple of other highly improbable to damage it things like hail, but excludes any damage from water/floods/tides/storms and pretty much anything else that actually damages docks. Until we recently replaced the pier it was a running joke in the house about ways we could potentially get it to catch and remain on fire such that it would suffer enough damage to actually make a claim.
Also curious who you got to cover termite damage, that's another one that I wasn't able to find an insurance company to cover.

[Oceansailor]

Originally Posted by tfrankum

I have used several carriers over the years and GEICO / Boat US and Pantaneous America seem to be better. A lot of carriers go to the Lloyds of London for the writing of insurance policies. Lloyds reportedly has suffered losses in their Marine division and have informed Insurance companies that due to huge losses, which were due to weather this year and the fact that this division has lost money over the years that an increase will be forth coming. This may be the reason for the 80% increase.

I did check two different Lloyds syndicates. They did not offer any protection north of Grenada or south of Cape Hatteras in 2017. That means they did not suffer any losses. (On Grenada and Trinidad you are covered as they consider it much lower risk than the rest of Caribbean)

Pantaenius covers the entire Caribbean (incl. Florida) under their hurricane clause.
No difference if you lay up in Trinidad or in the middle of Caribbean.
Consequently they suffered big losses 2017. This is the reason for the
50-70% increase 2018.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by john61ct

Companies should have as large a pool as possible, but then vary the premiums drastically based on proven risk factors.

If that means it becomes unaffordable to be in the Hzone anywhere near the season, then so be it, exactly how it's supposed to be.

I could not agree more. Unfortunately that is not what Pantaenius is doing. I believe that has to do with a expansion policy in America...at the cost at an increase in prices to their European clients. Their position is well consolidated in Europe.

[john61ct]

Well the biggest value-factor in choosing coverage is their customer-handling when payouts are called for.

It's not worth saving any amount of money on premiums if they perform poorly on that aspect.

[gsuescum]

Yes. Ours doubled too....

[biohead]

Answer yes, our policy for the last two years was written by TopSail UK. No claims and very easy to work with personnel. I got my renewal notice(renewal January 2019) and sent in the usual no changes response. A couple of weeks later the agent called back and said their underwriters (Lloyds) was no longer writing for non UK vessels in the Caribbean. I contacted several agent/brokers who all had a similar story Lloyds is not covering boats in the Carib. I am now considering a policy with Novamar that has a 55% increase in the premium for almost identical coverage. With TopSail there was a hurricane coverage exclusion but I could still be in the zone. New policy says I need to be out of the zone.

Some of the quotes I got were simply stupid and the"zone" is different for each company. We were staying in the southern Carib Martinique through Grenada....one policy said there was no southern limit to the zone and we had to be north of St Augustine. Isn't that were all the storms wind up and at full strength?

John
SV Annie
Amel Super Maramu
Carriacou

[Journeyman]

As the guy who started this post I should report I went with Llyod’s again for my all-Western Mexico, all-Sea of Cortez, all-seasons, & all -weather policy.

Nobody else was even closely competitive. Pantaenius was particularly disappointing. Despite all their advertising to the contrary.

[KD on Tropic]

It’s not any better in Australia... I have a Catin Indonesia... it may as well be on Mars for the way I am being treated... Topsail, Pantaenius and several others are not in slightest bit interested... and more the case... have between little and absolutely no understanding when it comes to what is really happening in our play ground.
I was using a company in Germany... they were really good... 1 claim... lightening strike... about AUD$5,000 worth... no issue... that was about 6 years ago... did not get my renewal on time for 2019... so I called... they apologise and sent it out... no change... about AUD$4,400 fully comp... in Indo... what I was expecting till the next day when I got the “oh dear... we sent you the wrong invoice” email... price went up to AUD$7,000... and boat value insured went down AUD$100,000 and items like lightening strikes, motors, masts, sails, Tender, tender motor and others were no longer insured... so what’s the point of paying AUD$7000 if I get nothing and a lesser insured value???
Now I am trying to get 3rd party... and struggling to get anyone to even look at it!!!!
It seems as if the Insurance industry are no longer interested except for your vessel is on the hard... cotton balled... in a vacuum.... surrounded by armed guards.... and you can only peek under the covers once a year!!!...
It’s a very dissapointing attitude... but at least the GM’s and CEO’s will go home with a big fat bonus!!!
So... does anybody know of any insurer that will do 3rd party on a yacht in Indo

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by KD on Tropic

It’s not any better in Australia... I have a Catin Indonesia... it may as well be on Mars for the way I am being treated... Topsail, Pantaenius and several others are not in slightest bit interested... and more the case... have between little and absolutely no understanding when it comes to what is really happening in our play ground.
I was using a company in Germany... they were really good... 1 claim... lightening strike... about AUD$5,000 worth... no issue... that was about 6 years ago... did not get my renewal on time for 2019... so I called... they apologise and sent it out... no change... about AUD$4,400 fully comp... in Indo... what I was expecting till the next day when I got the “oh dear... we sent you the wrong invoice” email... price went up to AUD$7,000... and boat value insured went down AUD$100,000 and items like lightening strikes, motors, masts, sails, Tender, tender motor and others were no longer insured... so what’s the point of paying AUD$7000 if I get nothing and a lesser insured value???
Now I am trying to get 3rd party... and struggling to get anyone to even look at it!!!!
It seems as if the Insurance industry are no longer interested except for your vessel is on the hard... cotton balled... in a vacuum.... surrounded by armed guards.... and you can only peek under the covers once a year!!!...
It’s a very dissapointing attitude... but at least the GM’s and CEO’s will go home with a big fat bonus!!!
So... does anybody know of any insurer that will do 3rd party on a yacht in Indo

Did you try the Marine Shop in Opua, NZ?
https://www.marine-insurance.co.nz
They were pretty quick to get me a quote for cruising through Indonesia. Its not the best coverage, but at least they say they can write it.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by Paul L

Did you try the Marine Shop in Opua, NZ?
https://www.marine-insurance.co.nz
They were pretty quick to get me a quote for cruising through Indonesia. Its not the best coverage, but at least they say they can write it.

Thanks for that.
Who is the underwriter and company they are selling for?

Some info here.
https://www.marine-insurance.co.nz/About-Us
No mention of NR or EW so that's a big plus.