Cruising without insurance, how tough?

[Tellie]

Insurance companies aren't worth billions because they are customer friendly after they take your premium. I make no bones about my disgust for insurance especially the ones forced on me in a free country. If I could have invested all the insurance premiums I've paid over the years and made a modest 6% on it I would be self insured by now. Now I watch people who could have done the same who have never made a claim worry if they'll be able to even afford the premiums in a few years and end up going without after all. Sorry this is a personal peeve with me sorry for the rant. Oh and by the way, in this country there's a little document whose truths we hold self evident that says we do have a right to travel freely. There's no implied privilage at all."The right to travel is a well-established common right that does not owe its existence to the federal government. It is recognized by the courts as a natural right." Schactman v. Dulles 96 App DC 287, 225 F2d 938, at 941.

[Mike Banks]

You lot seem to be missing the point. I do not care a rodent's rear end whether you are insured or not. I am insured--and if I wallop you my insurance will make good the damage to your vessel--so you should be thankful I am covered. If however you wallop me--I will claim on my cover who will fix up my boat--and I am on my way. What they do to recover their cost from you, since you insist on being "free" does not concern me in the least--

Lotsa luck!!

[Tellie]

Does your insurance company charge you extra for that false sense of security Mike?
Just kiddin. When in Rome, I suppose when I make land fall in Australia I'll abide by their rules. But here in the land of the ever diminishing free there's a cold one with your name on it on me. We can sit and discuss what we think of lawyers and how effective they really are or not and American colloquialisms about stones and blood.

[Mike Banks]

Bring on the coldies--

[Madwand]

Originally Posted by Fishspearit

If I were buying a $100,000 or more boat, then yes, I agree I would want everybody else to be insured as well so that they could subsidize my necessary full coverage insurance. Keep my rates down and all that. But I intend to buy a boat which I can fix, which is not so valuable that a scrape of the paint job would cost $10,000 to fix. We're not sailing around in egg shells out there, boats get banged and dinged and run into.

That's just pure selfish and irresponsible. If I have a nice boat and you run into it with your POS boat, you think it's my problem...Everyone should have a POS like yours and then we could all just smash each other's boats up with no regard to cost.

[Tellie]

Selfish
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishspearit
If I were buying a $100,000 or more boat, then yes, I agree I would want everybody else to be insured as well so that they could subsidize my necessary full coverage insurance. Keep my rates down and all that. But I intend to buy a boat which I can fix, which is not so valuable that a scrape of the paint job would cost $10,000 to fix. We're not sailing around in egg shells out there, boats get banged and dinged and run into.

That's just pure selfish and irresponsible. If I have a nice boat and you run into it with your POS boat, you think it's my problem...Everyone should have a POS like yours and then we could all just smash each other's boats up with no regard to cost.


So you come out with your fancy POC and announce to every one around that "Here I am and if you touch me I'll sue you". Sounds just like that one kid we all grew up with that would talk a game then when someone called him on it he'd cry touch me and my mommy will sue you. We beat the crap outta him anyways. Asking someone else to pay for your protection is the height of selfishness and irresponsibility. You wanna come out and play, pay your own way.

[cal40john]

I think folks should be more clear as to whether they are addressing a moral/ethical problem or whether they are debating what the laws actually are.

In the U.S. I'm fairly certain that your wages could be garnished if the judgement is against you and you don't have the funds to pay. If you believe that this is not ethical, contact your congressman and start campaigning to change the laws. You would then have a specific solution to try to convince people to vote for, rather than just complaining it isn't fair.

John

[Tellie]

Laws are based on moral and ethical beliefs held. If someone believes it is moral and ethical to threathen everyone else with laws suits so they can come out and play risk free then we diverge in opinion. This notion again that you'll find huge compensation in US courts beyond civil court because you feel pissed and want extra flesh is a notion not based in US law ethically or morally. I'll splain it to you Lucy like any attorney worth his salt will tell you. We can persue this if you want but you won't be happy with the results. Wage garnishments would be a highly highly unlikely out come and even if one were to get such a judgement over a case concerning your boat you probably won't get much repair work done on the $10 or $20 you're unlikely to get each month anyhow. Your attorneys fees will end up costing you more than the repairs in most likelyhood. The solution is simple and ethically and morally responsible. You get the insurance you want to cover what you want.

[David M]

The boat I skipper has pollution insurance. There is enough diesel fuel stored on that boat to cause millions of dollars of damage should the boat sink. Interesting thing is, the boat would not even have to leave the dock to cause all this damage. This is yet one more good reason to have insurance.

[Tellie]

Originally Posted by David M

The boat I skipper has pollution insurance. There is enough diesel fuel stored on that boat to cause millions of dollars of damage should the boat sink. Interesting thing is, the boat would not even have to leave the dock to cause all this damage. This is yet one more good reason to have insurance.

Good and interesting point David. Out of curiosity I wonder how many of our policies cover millions of dollars for that?

[Fishspearit]

Wow, I sure kicked a hornets nest by starting this thread.
Since I originally posted at the beginning, my views have changed a little bit. I do have insurance now(not because of any moral or ethical reasons though) so if you see my boat you need not fret " It's that crazy fishspearit guy without insurance!". I ended up buying a boat that's more than I can afford to lose, so that's my reason for having insurance.
When I first started this thread my thinking was 'If I accidently damage an expensive boat, their insurance will fix it for them.' The problem with that though, as I now know because I've been researching insurance policies and reading through them, is that most of the full coverage insurance policies WON'T fix the boat. Maybe there are better policies out there, but for any daredevil crazy,insane,and muddle-headed enough to live in Florida all we can get is 'depreciated value' policies with exclusions for 'scraping,marring, or denting' of the hull. Since the boat is more than 8 years old, any damage will be depreciated down to 15-20% of the replacement cost, minus the deductible of 5% of the hull value. So in other words, now that I'm paying nearly 5% of my hull value every year for full coverage insurance, if I suffer any damage short of a total loss I probably won't get much of anything towards the repair. Unless the damage is caused by somebody with insurance, then maybe I'll get something towards the repairs from their insurance company.

So now I've had a change of heart, YES! Everybody else should have insurance to protect my boat since I can't count on my own policy to fix it. (That's sarcasm for those who don't recognize it in print)

But if you damage my boat and don't have insurance, I'm not going to sue you. I'm just going to expect you to man up and take care of it as best you can.

[hellosailor]

"I'm just going to expect you to man up and take care of it as best you can."
And if you guy who hits you does so while you are at the masthead, and you break both legs and a couple of vertebrae as you come down express style...So you can't collect anything but have to sell you home,boat, car, cashier you life savings, etc. in order to ante up a common quarter million dollar medical bill during your first year in rehab...
...Are you still going to say "Well, he did the best he could." Rather than try to seize all his assets and garnish all his income?

Damn generous of you, fishspearit. You could be cannonized for sainthood that way!

[Tellie]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

"I'm just going to expect you to man up and take care of it as best you can."
And if you guy who hits you does so while you are at the masthead, and you break both legs and a couple of vertebrae as you come down express style...So you can't collect anything but have to sell you home,boat, car, cashier you life savings, etc. in order to ante up a common quarter million dollar medical bill during your first year in rehab...
...Are you still going to say "Well, he did the best he could." Rather than try to seize all his assets and garnish all his income?

Damn generous of you, fishspearit. You could be cannonized for sainthood that way!

Holy Christopher Reeves Batman , that's happened to me just that way at least six times this year already. Back to the Batcave Robin where all is safe and there aren't any boats for miles around.
PS No more Bat pole for you, State Farm called and said it had to go.

[Randall]

I contacted a insurance agent and they told me if i leave the state of fl they dont cover the boat. So when i buy my next boat if i take a loan which i wont maybe they wont let me leave fl ither.

[Tellie]

Originally Posted by Randall

I contacted a insurance agent and they told me if i leave the state of fl they dont cover the boat. So when i buy my next boat if i take a loan which i wont maybe they wont let me leave fl ither.

You wanted to leave the state of Florida????? Maybe even sail a little further off shore?? Why, how selfish and irresponsible of you.