How to make offer for newbie, first ever boat viewing

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Lance Monotone

If I buy a boat I'm leaving NY forever and heading south to live on it. So, as EarlWer suggested, hopefully I can leave it in the yard until spring. The chances of this boat being the one are pretty slim but I'm starting early because I want to be on the move as quickly as possible. I'm done with life in the cold! Brrrr.

Have you even seen the inside of an old 27' sailboat?

I have walk-in closets with more room.

Then there are all the other details like anchoring ....... so you can sleep.

And don't forget in some places in the South, it is absolutely sweltering in July and August so you have to plan for that as well.

[zstine]

I just want to reaffirm what others have said.


No offer before you look. I do think wise to view a few other boats before deciding on an offer.


After viewing, Make a verbal offer slightly below (reasonable room to negotiate) what you are willing to pay with a verbal understanding the offer has contingencies like a satisfactory sea-trial and survey. Once you verbally agree on a price, then write up a purchase and sales agreement (P&S). There are many available on-line, particularly for brokers, but you can delete any broker specific sections. i'm assuming a private sale


Once all contingencies are satisfied (you can renegotiate if something comes up in the survey/trial), you pay the man and get the title (state or USCG), and get a Bill of Sale... and you'll need insurance which may require a survey, maybe not. So you should call a few before you write up the P&S.

[sail sfbay]

You are on the right track. Offer what you think the boat is worth to YOU after viewing the boat, preferably with someone who can assess the boat's condition before you make an offer. Once you close either keep the boat where it is now or put it on a used or new trailer and store it on land or at a boat yard or marina on a cradle.

[thomm225]

Actually you don't need a survey or full coverage insurance, but as a beginner, it would probably be the wise thing to go that route..

I just have liability insurance which is required by my marina. It's about $10/month for $500,000 and I didn't have a survey. (but have owned many boats)

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by thomm225

Have you even seen the inside of an old 27' sailboat?

I have walk-in closets with more room.

Then there are all the other details like anchoring ....... so you can sleep.

And don't forget in some places in the South, it is absolutely sweltering in July and August so you have to plan for that as well.

I have never seen the inside of ANY sailboat. Gotta start somewhere!

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by zstine

I just want to reaffirm what others have said.


No offer before you look. I do think wise to view a few other boats before deciding on an offer.


After viewing, Make a verbal offer slightly below (reasonable room to negotiate) what you are willing to pay with a verbal understanding the offer has contingencies like a satisfactory sea-trial and survey. Once you verbally agree on a price, then write up a purchase and sales agreement (P&S). There are many available on-line, particularly for brokers, but you can delete any broker specific sections. i'm assuming a private sale


Once all contingencies are satisfied (you can renegotiate if something comes up in the survey/trial), you pay the man and get the title (state or USCG), and get a Bill of Sale... and you'll need insurance which may require a survey, maybe not. So you should call a few before you write up the P&S.

Thank you, that's a good plan of action.

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by sail sfbay

You are on the right track. Offer what you think the boat is worth to YOU after viewing the boat, preferably with someone who can assess the boat's condition before you make an offer. Once you close either keep the boat where it is now or put it on a used or new trailer and store it on land or at a boat yard or marina on a cradle.

Thank you, that's helpful advice.

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by Jamesiv1

Nice-looking boat! Especially for the price. Looks like she's been well-maintained and all the fundamentals appear to be sound. I'm jealous.

I'm a year and a half away from getting my sail-away boat... Looking right now for a "learner" in the $3K-6K range. My first boat!

Good luck! I hope you find something great!

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by mvweebles

Lance - looks like a nice boat, fairly priced.

To follow on the back of Boatpoker, process is

1. Look at boat to see if general condition pleases you. You should be able to view as much as you want, though for $10k, it's pretty easy to become a pest.
2. Make offer contingent on whatever inspections you chose to do - hull, machinery, rigging, and sea trial. On a $10k boat, it's tempting to skip a few bases, but are often false economy - a repair costs what repair costs regardless of cost of the boat. Offer is typically accompanied with a 10% refundable earnest money deposit (see note below on FSBO-type).
3. Closing. If all goes well, you exchange money for the title and the boat is yours.

FSBO transactions - as someone else mentioned, think of this like buying a used car. When you use a broker, they have an escrow account to hold deposits. In a pure FSBO transaction, I'd be hesitant to give the seller a deposit for fear they wouldn't return it. Assuming you move forward with survey/inspections, you'll have significant cost outlays, so the seller may be okay foregoing a deposit, but it's something you'll have to discuss/negotiate.

NOTE ON WINTERIZED - this means the boat is in hibernation, possibly wrapped. Sellers are a bit leery to open-up the boat for inspections since they'll probably have to re-winterize at some cost/expense if you decide you don't like the boat. This is a negotiable item. On one side, the buyer can say "if it's for sale, seller bears cost to make it available for inspection."

Good luck -

Peter

Thanks Peter, that's all very helpful information for me to keep in mind during this process. I appreciate your detailed response.

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by LittleWing77

Listen to Boatpoker, Lance.

He is a exceptionally experienced boat surveyor (what he doesn't know about boats isn't worth knowing) and also a august, and genuinely helpful, Forum Member.

Good luck!
That Cape Dory looks just about right (but be wary of pictures. Go see her).
Warmly,
LittleWing77

Thank you, I'm still waiting for the broker to get back to me. He doesn't seem to be very motivated on behalf of the seller. I inquired about viewing the boat on Saturday and he responded right away with a few questions about what I'm looking for, but didn't respond about viewing this particular boat.

Then yesterday evening he sent me a list of boats that had no resemblance to my specs, but didn't mention the boat I asked him to see. I had to ask him again what was up with this boat. Only then did he say this boat was still available and asked me if I wanted to make an offer, which is when I started this thread. He sent me a PDF that outlined the buying process, which said they request (but do not require) an offer before viewing, and that the buyer can cancel the offer if they don't like the boat after viewing it. I dunno. I'm getting a little sketched out by him and I'm thinking maybe this one is not worth the trouble because if he's like this at the very beginning, the rest of the process is going to be a nightmare.

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by Lance Monotone

I have never seen the inside of ANY sailboat. Gotta start somewhere!

It's a good boat to start with, but the permanent liveaboard part might be a problem.

[Scubaseas]

Nice example with a lot of nice stuff on it. If you like it put a deposit on it pending a survey. Price to me seems fair but your surveyor might be on BUC net to check. Or join BoatUS and get a price check from them. BoatUS Members can get three? value checks per year if I recall. Check the chain plates and especially the stem head fitting on your examination or on the survey. They were known to be an issue on CDs of that vintage and a bit of a project to fix properly.

If you want to sea trial you will be liable for re winterizing costs and any launching or recovering costs.

[joelhemington]

Originally Posted by Lance Monotone

Hi,

I've found a boat in my budget and I would love some advice about how to arrange a viewing, having never sailed or looked at a potential boat for purchase before. This isn't about how to survey a boat, but more how to manage expectations between myself and the seller when this is the very first boat I have ever looked at and will likely not be buying it (at least right away until I have seen others). You never forget your first time, they say :P

This is the boat: https://www.popyachts.com/sloop-sail...ew-york-164150

So, all that said, forgive me if this is not the right place to ask this, or perhaps it's gauche to ask at all, but here goes...

I understand that to view a boat, it's customary to make an offer first. Is there a rule for how much to offer vs the asking price, sight unseen?

Does anyone see any obvious problems with this boat from the pictures?

Does it appear to be worth what they're asking?

What should I offer for this boat?

This is complicated by the fact that there's noplace to put her right now if I do purchase her, as I live in upstate NY and all the marinas are closed for the winter. How do I handle that?

Okay, I guess that's enough questions for now. I very much appreciate your opinions and advice and I hope I'm not being a horrible human by asking them.

Start here Marine Survey 101, pre-survey inspection
Never make an offer sight unseen and boats in this price range may not justify getting a proper survey. Read the above and then go see the boat prior to making any offer. I'm surprised that there's a broker involved with this deal (they only get 10%) Usually the owners sell boats in this price range as brokers just don't want to fool with it - maybe this means that owner just wants this boat gone. While the Cape Dory is a well respected pedigree, you'd want to perform a sea trial to make sure it actually floats and all the sea cocks are not shot. Since the boat is winterized, there's no way anybody will be taking it out for the sea trial anytime soon which would explain the brokers lack of interest. Maybe keep your powder dry and join a sailing club where you can sail on many different boats before buying one.

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by Scubaseas

Nice example with a lot of nice stuff on it. If you like it put a deposit on it pending a survey. Price to me seems fair but your surveyor might be on BUC net to check. Or join BoatUS and get a price check from them. BoatUS Members can get three? value checks per year if I recall. Check the chain plates and especially the stem head fitting on your examination or on the survey. They were known to be an issue on CDs of that vintage and a bit of a project to fix properly.

If you want to sea trial you will be liable for re winterizing costs and any launching or recovering costs.

Thanks for your advice and mentioning the things to check on this particular boat. Very helpful

[Lance Monotone]

Originally Posted by joelhemington

Start here Marine Survey 101, pre-survey inspection
Never make an offer sight unseen and boats in this price range may not justify getting a proper survey. Read the above and then go see the boat prior to making any offer. I'm surprised that there's a broker involved with this deal (they only get 10%) Usually the owners sell boats in this price range as brokers just don't want to fool with it - maybe this means that owner just wants this boat gone. While the Cape Dory is a well respected pedigree, you'd want to perform a sea trial to make sure it actually floats and all the sea cocks are not shot. Since the boat is winterized, there's no way anybody will be taking it out for the sea trial anytime soon which would explain the brokers lack of interest. Maybe keep your powder dry and join a sailing club where you can sail on many different boats before buying one.

Yes, the price might very well explain why the broker is less than responsive. I'm planning on joining the Albany Yacht Club and I just posted on crew available. Not much I can do until springtime except keep researching my options. Thanks for your advice!