America’s Cup - ETNZ launches 1st AC75 (new)

[MicHughV]

one thing is for sure....nobody expected this....

for a moment there, it looked like LR was going to be 4-2.....and then dropped off their foils...a death knell in these boats..

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by CassidyNZ

One thing I couldn’t understand: on one leg in the first race (third leg?) ETNZ were getting a huge lift, great VMG and then they tacked in the middle of the lift. I was apoplectic. Even back in the dark ages when I raced, you NEVER tacked on a lift - you’re going straight into being headed - very poor VMG. Maybe they were escaping dirty air but their VMG was ripping. I don’t get it.

Maybe JMH can chime in after watching the detail the way he does.

I agree that it is unusual to do this. Hazarding a guess, assuming that they weren't at the boundary or the layline, since they were behind in race 1 it could be that they specifically wanted to get (or stay) 'out of phase' with LR.

You'll need to give me an exact time during the race to take a more specific look at it.

[CassidyNZ]

Originally Posted by jmh2002

I agree that it is unusual to do this. Hazarding a guess, assuming that they weren't at the boundary or the layline, since they were behind in race 1 it could be that they specifically wanted to get (or stay) 'out of phase' with LR.

You'll need to give me an exact time during the race to take a more specific look at it.

From the YouTube clip “Live Day 3” go to 28:10 and watch.

At 28:17 ETNZ tack onto starboard at the RHS boundary.

At 28:38 their track shows clear signs of a lift (wind shift to the right) their VMG goes to 21.4kn compared to LRPP who on the same starboard tack has a VMG of just 13.5kn. That’s 8kn better!! LRPP’s lead falls rapidly.

At 28:58, in the middle of the lift, ETNZ tack back off the lift and their VMG falls through the floor, LRPP’s lead skyrockets as ETNZ gets headed.

So was it dirty air? With such an amazing VMG, I don’t believe it. I reckon bad judgement reading something on the RHS of the course that wasn’t there.

[boatman61]

Gotta give the TV companies etc VFM if you want them to keep buying the screening rights.. no 'excitement' no revenue to be made.. F1 on de water..
Cynic 61..

[ChrisJHC]

Originally Posted by dfelsent

Quick question. How is everyone watching? Us, combo nbcsn and tvnz live. You?
Just curious. Etnz requires a vpn for me.

It’s being live streamed on the offical AC website.
It’s also on YouTube - particularly good for catchup if you can’t watch it live.

Given the AC is being ignored by the Aussie mainstream media there’s no problems not finding out the result until you can watch the replay.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by CassidyNZ

From the YouTube clip “Live Day 3” go to 28:10 and watch.

At 28:17 ETNZ tack onto starboard at the RHS boundary.

At 28:38 their track shows clear signs of a lift (wind shift to the right) their VMG goes to 21.4kn compared to LRPP who on the same starboard tack has a VMG of just 13.5kn. That’s 8kn better!! LRPP’s lead falls rapidly.

At 28:58, in the middle of the lift, ETNZ tack back off the lift and their VMG falls through the floor, LRPP’s lead skyrockets as ETNZ gets headed.

So was it dirty air? With such an amazing VMG, I don’t believe it. I reckon bad judgement reading something on the RHS of the course that wasn’t there.

I think this is somewhat of an illusion caused by both boats tacking during this period combined with the light air.

ETNZ are at the end of their post tack process, and LR are at the beginning.

Also note that because of their smaller wings ETNZ sail even lower out of the tacks in general than LR - ETNZ need to keep their boat speed up.

So I don't think ETNZ are in a huge lift, they are just coming onto their normal upwind height after their tack. So the track that appears to show the huge lift is just ETNZ first sailing low out of the tack at the RHS boundary to build speed, and then taking height as they can - SCREEN SHOT 1 BELOW.

In addition, they know that LR is going to tack on them so it's normal to try and take height in those situations.

LR's VMG is so low at that moment because they are even earlier in this post tack process - they are still in the speed build phase and are therefore sailing low (and still slow too). This process is all amplified in light air - SCREEN SHOT 1 BELOW.

ETNZ then tacks away just before arriving at LR's track to avoid their dirty air - SCREEN SHOT 2 BELOW.

Later you can see from virtual eye that LR also followed the same process too, a speed build and then coming up to their normal upwind height too, but it's less amplified than with ETNZ because of LR's bigger wings - SCREEN SHOT 3 BELOW.

(although note that LR also bear off a bit again too after this, but that's separate - you hear Jimmy say 'little build, pressing' so that's a slight bear off to gain speed, either because of a slight lull and/or because they were approaching the layline and wanted more boat speed before tacking)

Hope this helps

SCREEN SHOT 1


SCREEN SHOT 2


SCREEN SHOT 3

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by fxykty

LRPP came close to falling off their foils after a gybe in really light wind prior to the start and TNZ were able to cross over them and get on top of LRPP to gas them more. TNZ decided to tack instead of gybing. If LRPP had kept their speed then TNZ would have had a tough decision whether to try to stay to weather or to blast through to leeward. That tactic doesn’t really work in light winds with the larger wind shadows.

This was a really nice move by ETNZ in race 2 (finally! but it may only work once, LR will be on to this tactic now...) (and it only works once per day, as the following boat into the start...)

It's been mentioned multiple times that the start box is quite small for these boats and these speeds. Entry is at 2min and even in light air they start to reach the edge of the box at around 1m30s, and start the turn to come back at 1m15s - and that is still a lot of 'time to kill' to not end up being early at the start line.

And as we have seen, 'killing time' is difficult in light air and comes with a big risk of coming off the foils.

So ETNZ followed LR out towards the edge of the box as normal. At this point the trailing boat decides if they want to 'lead' or 'follow' back to the start.

In light air you don't want to lead as you will be slow and trying to kill time, but being 'pushed' by the other boat and therefore vunerable.

So often the following boat will continue to follow the lead boat at the edge of the box, into the gybe, and then either try to get below them to create 'the hook' (leeward boat) or to windward with enough gauge and speed to roll them.

We haven't really seen the later yet, at most it's been even at the line, but with the weather boat being able to get the advantage by tacking on the leeward boat at the LHS boundary.

But in race 2 ETNZ feigned that they would follow in the start box, continuing to bear away to be sure that LR would gybe, and then bailed out at the last minute to head high up into the box instead.

But it was a planned move, you can hear it on the coms - Ashby or Tuke says 'he's (LR) early Pete', and Pete says 'we'll tack, we'll tack' (even while they are still bearing away feigning to follow LR into the gybe) - SCREEN SHOT 1 BELOW (1m03s to the start).

After ETNZ tacked they bore away a bit at first to keep foiling and again we hear Tuke (I think) say 'still early for the pin' - that's the far end of the start line, so even ETNZ are totally early still (at 0m45s to the start).

So then you hear 'big up here' and they head up high up into the box again to kill some more time. At this point LR is way low in the box, going slow (remember they have time to kill too) and ETNZ has a huge amount of windward gauge on LR.

Because of this windward gauge, at 0m28s to the start ETNZ has a huge amount of room to be able to bear off, reaching, and go for the line. They are at 28.2kn boat speed and accelerating rapidly, very good! - SCREEN SHOT 2 BELOW.

At the same time, LR is at 17.4kn and because they are low in the box, they can't really bear off to accelerate, in fact it looks like they will struggle to even lay the pin end of the start line from there, not good! - SCREEN SHOT 2 BELOW.

At 0m14s to the start, LR is hard on the wind still trying to accelerate at 19.5kn, while ETNZ is still reaching, now at 35kn, and rolls straight over LR who have zero options - SCREEN SHOT 3 BELOW.

And we all know what happens after that. ETNZ come hard on the wind, hit the line with enormous pace, and it's game over for LR at that point.

Just to rub salt in the wound LR are also now sailing directly in ETNZ's dirty air too. Further, LR is restricted from tacking away, out of the dirty air, because their boatspeed is so low.

Finally a really really awesome start from ETNZ, sticking to LR

Feigned the follow, got away from LR, were able to kill their time by carving an S so never got slow, and then were high in the box and could reach to the start at max boat speed.

I think that even if LR were not extra slow in the box ETNZ would still have rolled them with more boat speed from this high position in the box.

Really well done ETNZ! (for once!)

(as I said though, I'm not sure how many times this trick will work, but at least it worked to keep the score at a draw so far)

SCREENSHOT 1 (1m03s to the start)


SCREENSHOT 2 (0m28s to the start)


SCREENSHOT 3 (0m14s to the start)

[Pelagic]

Does anyone know what kind of monthly financial package each team indivdual gets paid?

Are the foreign ones taxed in New Zealand?

I doubt if they have a union or that money is the main reason to put years into it.... but curious if they are being compensated fairly?

[fxykty]

Team members get paid a salary (contractors or employees I don’t know). The principals (helm and skippers and flight controllers) likely have extra benefits and they all likely have a performance bonus.

US citizens are taxed on worldwide income regardless of how paid. Others likely not, but will be taxed either here or in their employer’s country depending on how the contracts are structured.

[fxykty]

Very light breeze and NIWA forecast barely makes 7 knots today. The NE sea breeze is trying to get established, but is fighting a SE system breeze.

4-5 knots on the course right now, with a bit more at the lower end.

[jmh2002]

And professional sailors at this level get paid big bucks like in most other top level sports.

The problem is that the availability of that work and that salary is variable.

An AC program could be great since you may be on a salary for maybe several years.

At other times you may be jobless and without any salary at all.

Or it's intermittent when off overseas for various one off events, or a regatta circuit for a while.

So a lot of the mid level guys have side gigs of some type. And/or they work in the industry, such as being sailmakers, riggers, etc, and have understanding bosses.

[CassidyNZ]

Originally Posted by jmh2002

(as I said though, I'm not sure how many times this trick will work, but at least it worked to keep the score at a draw so far)

As far as I see it, the starboard entry boat always has the advantage of following the port boat to see what they are going to do. Not much the leading boat can do about that. I guess that the lead boat could, instead of what has been the customary gybe, tack instead and neutralise the advantage like that which ETNZ had.

But then the following boat can still create separation which allows them to exercise a time-on-distance start, hitting the line at speed. The more I consider it, the more I reckon the port entry boat is at a disadvantage, not the other way round.

But Burling/Tuke should concentrate on what they do best (keeping clear of LRPP) rather than trying to teach the match-racing master new tricks.

[Pelagic]

Curious how New Zealand is handling income tax for AC crew now.

In 1999 when we arrived in Auckland in October, all of us Superyacht crew, were issued work visas which I objected to.

That meant tax declarations for a foreign visiting crew on a pleasure yacht.

Took the soliidarity and threat from all the foreign Superyachts Captains to leave, forcing a meeting with one of their interior ministers to convince them that we were tourists and not subject to NZ income tax declarations.

We just could not allow that precedent to start!

Luckily she realized that our crew work and live on foreign registered boats and not on land for them to cancel the work visas and re-enter us as tourists.

Shaky start to the best AC ever!

[Pelagic]

If I remember AC pre-starts were 5 minutes, now only 2 minutes.

Seems to me that longer prestarts would create more finesse thru practice in duelling foilers... not to mention better viewing

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by CassidyNZ

But Burling/Tuke should concentrate on what they do best (keeping clear of LRPP) rather than trying to teach the match-racing master new tricks.

Yes, maybe 'trick' was a poor choice of word. It's a normal match racing technique.

But the trick was breaking any predictable pattern. All the teams analyse what the other teams seem to do most often in certain situations - that's both by habit, as well as by what their boat prefers - and try to predict what their opponent will most likely do in certain cases.

And of course the feignt by ETNZ was a necessary part of pulling this off too, since up until the moment that LR gybed, LR still had the option to tack instead and follow them high into the box too, if ETNZ showed their hand too early.

That's all part of the game