California bans the sale of Denatured Alcohol

[a64pilot]

What astonishes me is that alcohol is banned and acetone isn’t?
It would seem that if your after VOC’s you go after paint and spray cans?

[SV THIRD DAY]

The Once Golden State....people and businesses that pay taxes are bailing...the State is Doomed. Like Venezuela it's demise provides a good political lesson on how to destroy a once prosperous State.

[gamayun]

Sorry peeps. The bashing of California can stop now. Denatured alcohol has not been banned here. What is happening now is a Working Group of the state's air resources board (CARB) is going through a review of the "formulation" of certain products including pet care, nail and hair stuff for possible reductions in their volatile organic content (VOC). According to a meeting in July, CARB wouldn't even start considering a regulatory change to require reformulation until next year. This happens all the time to your products -- especially paints and solvents -- to reduce the amount of harmful air emissions, but life goes on and we breath easier and no one is the wiser. Perhaps because denatured alcohol is nearly 100% volatile (i.e., it evaporates almost immediately) it could eventually not be sold here because it would be too difficult or expensive for companies to modify it, but that's not currently the case. And I'm sure CARB would take that concern under careful consideration. Public workshops (including webinars so you don't have to be there in person) are happening now with CARB for receiving input.

https://ww3.arb.ca.gov/consprod/consprod.htm

• Fall 2019: Public workshop to identify and quantify
emissions benefits of regulatory options

• Late 2019/Early 2020: Additional public workshops
as needed

• Late 2020: Proposed regulatory amendments for
Board consideration

[SV THIRD DAY]

Originally Posted by gamayun

Sorry peeps. The bashing of California can stop now.

No to the Contrary....you just confirmed how insane California is.
CARB forms a working Group to Ban Denatured Alcohol, while the Emissions of Human Waste and smoldering campfires burning trash and plastics in the States Homeless Camps is out of control.

The California Bashing will continue and with Good Cause.

I didn't Escape from the Pit of California to Mexico just for the Tacos!

[gamayun]

Originally Posted by roverhi

Went from there to West Marine in Oceanside. They had two gallons left which I bought. They didn't know for sure Alcohol was banned but said there had been a run on it..

This is also why we have a run on gun sales when Democrats are in power.

Fear.

This should be Time's best salesperson of the year.

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

What astonishes me is that alcohol is banned and acetone isn’t?
It would seem that if your after VOC’s you go after paint and spray cans?

IT'S NOT BANNED! For good griefs sake people, we've provided page after page after page of proof that it isn't banned and several sources for buying it, against as far as I can tell the word of a minimum wage store clerk at a hardware store somewhere as the only indication it has been "banned". You and the rest of the posters here are I'm sure reasonable, intelligent folks. You have to ask yourselves, why is it that you refuse to acknowledge this despite all the evidence provided and none provided to the contrary?

[senormechanico]

Alcohol is not banned, there are no poops on the streets and "The Americans are not at the airport !"

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

IT'S NOT BANNED! For good griefs sake people, we've provided page after page after page of proof that it isn't banned and several sources for buying it, against as far as I can tell the word of a minimum wage store clerk at a hardware store somewhere as the only indication it has been "banned". You and the rest of the posters here are I'm sure reasonable, intelligent folks. You have to ask yourselves, why is it that you refuse to acknowledge this despite all the evidence provided and none provided to the contrary?

sorry but me thinks the supply chain is a better place for indormation on a specific products availability not a sailing forum site.

[dwedeking2]

It's not banned you just can't buy it...


Raised and lived a large portion of my life in Southern California. Leaving for Hawai'i was the best decision ever. I always stayed for the weather and things you could do ("but the weather is great"). Found out that keeping more of my disposable income was more important than a few extra sun days.



When I lived in Ensenada, MX it was interesting the contrast when I crossed back up to meet friends in San Diego for the weekend. The number of signs telling what you can and can't do. Go to the beach, "only surfers here", "only swimmers here", "don't loiter around the life guard tower". Couldn't see the sunset through the forest of signs...

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by dwedeking2

It's not banned you just can't buy it...

That may sound silly, but I believe without getting into legal arguments, but that was pretty much how it was during prohibition. I believe it was legal to possess and consume, but its manufacture, sale and transportation was illegal.

[Apollo366]

And how FoolHardy was that?

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

That may sound silly, but I believe without getting into legal arguments, but that was pretty much how it was during prohibition. I believe it was legal to possess and consume, but its manufacture, sale and transportation was illegal.

And that isn't the case here. As several of us have pointed out ad nauseum, it's perfectly legal to sell, transport, and own in CA and you can place an order on Amazon or go down to your local Grainger today and do all 3 of those things!

[redneckrob]

Originally Posted by gamayun

This is also why we have a run on gun sales when Democrats are in power.

Fear.

This should be Time's best salesperson of the year.

I think you've actually hit on it. It appear that this is a classic self fulfilling prophecy. Someone went to their local hardware store to buy denatured alcohol and they happened to be out, just like they may have been out of 1/2" stainless washers for supply chain reasons alone. The stock guy on the floor throws out some random crap he pulled from his behind about the 'gubmnt banning it. The person took that and ran with it after doing absolutely zero additional checking to see if there was an iota of truth to the matter, and posted to their like-minded friends that it had been banned. They, again without absolute credulity and apparent unable to spend even 2 minutes to check the veracity of this, whipped themselves into a frenzy and ran out to buy up what they erroneously believed to be the last remaining stock of denatured alcohol. Since it's not a particularly fast moving product carried in very many places, this unexpected blip in demand probably ran through the existing stock pretty quickly, causing "shortages". That fed into the false narrative that it had been "banned", when in fact it was very fools who started and spread the false narrative who had caused the shortage in the first place! And as you can see here, if a set of circumstances matches a preconceived narrative you've got, especially if it involves "those morons" in the other political party, no amount of evidence can convince you that your original story was wrong. Apparently you just ignore it? Baffling, and pretty damn depressing at the end of the day.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by redneckrob

I think you've actually hit on it. It appear that this is a classic self fulfilling prophecy. Someone went to their local hardware store to buy denatured alcohol and they happened to be out, just like they may have been out of 1/2" stainless washers for supply chain reasons alone. The stock guy on the floor throws out some random crap he pulled from his behind about the 'gubmnt banning it. The person took that and ran with it after doing absolutely zero additional checking to see if there was an iota of truth to the matter, and posted to their like-minded friends that it had been banned. They, again without absolute credulity and apparent unable to spend even 2 minutes to check the veracity of this, whipped themselves into a frenzy and ran out to buy up what they erroneously believed to be the last remaining stock of denatured alcohol. Since it's not a particularly fast moving product carried in very many places, this unexpected blip in demand probably ran through the existing stock pretty quickly, causing "shortages". That fed into the false narrative that it had been "banned", when in fact it was very fools who started and spread the false narrative who had caused the shortage in the first place! And as you can see here, if a set of circumstances matches a preconceived narrative you've got, especially if it involves "those morons" in the other political party, no amount of evidence can convince you that your original story was wrong. Apparently you just ignore it? Baffling, and pretty damn depressing at the end of the day.

I dream of the day when AI has advanced enough that any online article or comment can be parsed for "facts", compare them with a database of verified facts, or has the ability to do some lookups (eg find a regulation or law)... and then can either verify or debunk the "fact" and provide a truthfulness score or rating right on the page. Of course the commenting on CF would drop by 20 to 25%, and breitbart.com would cease to exist.

[Calif.Ted]

"Let's go to Rick's Restaurant" I suggested
"Oh, That place is no good anymore, it's always crowded and you have to wait for a table" says my friend.
You forget California is a big freakin' place if your complaint is too crowded, too regulated, too many homeless (ain't that one universal ?), too urban, too remote, etc. etc. you are just in the wrong locality. "We don't all live in Hollywood" was an advertising slogan for a grocery chain.