Legal problem and a documented boat

[Wotname]

Obviously you need USA advice but as you have some Canadian advice already, I'll add some down under advice. I suspect the USA will have similar concepts to what Canada and Australia have and only the detail will vary.

State registration and Federal documentation are entirely seperate things and are independent to each other.

In the terms of proving ownership, Federal documentation trumps everything else whether that be bills of sale, state registrations or a simple receipt. Whoever is still shown the Federal (USCG?) documentation still owns the boat be they dead or alive. Only two people can alter the Federal documented title i.e. remove or transfer it.

1. the named owner or their legal representative (executor of estate etc) can either remove or transfer.
2. a judge by way of a Federal court order can change the title.

Maybe the first step should be to ascertain if the boat is still Federally documented and who is named on the title. That should be possible by paying a fee for a Title Search of the Federal (USCG?) records.

If it is still on their records, try to contact the executor of the will and enlist his help in getting the title transferred (even if it was 20 years ago). Failing that, there will be a process to appeal to the court system for a transfer to you but it may be a long and expensive process.

Good luck with the journey!

Maybe the executor removed the boat of the Federal record after the sale to you was completed...

[maine-cruiser]

Someone else mentioned this and I will second it. Call the CG documentation center help line. They were very helpful to me in getting a few loose ends straightened out. They are not out to "get you". I'm sure you're not the first one in this situation.

Bill

[Celestialsailor]

Especially if you are busy, pay the money to have a reputable title company handle the paperwork. They have been through this before.

[Danm1]

Your answer is in here somewhere:
https://www.dol.wa.gov/vehicleregist...ocvessels.html

It seems that if the documentation was never transferred, you should have had to apply for a state title to get registration in your name. If that never happened, you need to get a certificate of deletion from the Coast Guard, or, alternatively perhaps, use your sale paperwork to get a new documentation in your name.

[Bill O]

Originally Posted by maine-cruiser

Someone else mentioned this and I will second it. Call the CG documentation center help line. They were very helpful to me in getting a few loose ends straightened out. They are not out to "get you". I'm sure you're not the first one in this situation.

^^^+1
Totally agree w/the above statement and when I've spoken w/them they were always very helpful.
One helpful hint, be truthful w/them as they take very good notes and they will catch you quickly if you are not consistent in your story.

This wasn't me, but others they told me about trying to pull the wool over their eyes. My motto is there is only one story to remember, that is the truth.

[singlespeed]

You have successfully registered the boat in the state of Washington for several years now. I would assume you would present this registration as the official documentation at any nation's customs and clearances offices and to any maritime enforcement agency that requests it. Why the worry? At this point it is extremely doubtful that the Coasties will check documentation status on a boat that is registered by the state. They can't require you to have both nor dictate that you must be documented if the vessel meets the state's licensing reqirements. The real problem is if you elect to sail to other countries. Some countries still do not honor state registration and require documentation to enter their country.

[Shanachie]

The question that needs to be asked is, whose name is the boat registered under in Washington?

The state of Washington, on its web site, says you have to have proof of title and proof that you have paid sales tax on the transaction to register a boat.



I find it difficult to believe that the OP could persuade the state to issue a registration to someone who couldn't prove ownership of the boat and possibly did not pay sales tax.



This situation gets stickier and stickier. I suspect an attorney and a fat checking account is in order. The state will want to extract its pound of flesh for being fooled for 20 years.

[Mallory4422]

To clear up a few points; yes, I paid the sales tax (painful here in Washington at nearly 10%). As to why the state issued the registration? I have no idea. If I was a expert in documentation and title issues I wouldn't be in this fix, but I know enough to pay the taxes, and the yearly registration fee. The marina would make a fuss if the boat didn't have a current tag.
Thanks for the advice about private documentation services, and the USCG help line. I will drop a note to the USCG about the issue, with some trepidation. In my experience the government is never there to "help", and I confess I hate to admit to making such a mistake. If the USCG doesn't have a nice neat solution, I will contact a local documentation company and see what they have to say. Really appreciate all the helpful advice, and I will update as matters proceed.

[Danm1]

WA should not have given you a registration without documentation in your name or evidence that you applied for it; or, alternatively, issuing a state title. Is it possible you forgot? Here's a service that might be able to tell you if WA thinks the boat is documented or titled for $20 bucks. If you're lucky it's titled and you can request a duplicate copy.
https://www.boat-alert.com/

[wholybee]

I actually think this might not be a problem. First, the difference between registration, and title. Title is proof of ownership. Registration is proof of paying annual fees. Depending on state, they sometimes don't have to even be the same person. I'm not sure if you ever got title in the state of Washington(you paid Tax, that is usually part of the title), but if not, and if you still have the documents from the sale, you could probably do that. If it has been registered to you for a long time, just explain the situation and provide the bill of sale, and they will probably do it. Especially if the boat is "new" in Washinton and not owned by anyone else there.

For the USCG document. That document is equivalent to registration. It is NOT proof of ownership. To get a USCG document, you need to provide proof of ownership. Typically, in a sale or transfer of ownership, the bill of sale is used, on the specific USCG form, notarized etc. However, state title is also acceptable. So, if you can get a Washinton state title, just send that it, and no problem.

Source? I did this in 2015. Previous owners were not dead, but all I did was get a generic bill of sale, and state title. Then a year later I did the documentation, using the state title instead of the bill of sale with all the other requirements.

[somanyboats]

Paying the registration fee each year does not mean that you are registered in the state of Wa. That tax is owed because you are using the boat in the state. Were you assigned registration numbers? If not, then take the bill of sale to one of the DOL places and tell them the boat has not been documented for years. You'll be assigned numbers and a title. If you get a runaround ask your bank who they use for escrow on boats. See if they can help you.

[Overdue]

It might be worth the relative minimal effort to call the executor of the estate, if you still have his/her name and telephone number. This might not be so complicated. If you do not have his/her name, call the Probate Clerk for the County Court where the previous owner resided when he/she died, and ask them to search (many court docket records have been computerized more than 20 years) and give you the Docket Number, name and address of the attorney that handled the estate and name, address and telephone number of the executor. Then Google to get current addresses/tele numbers.

If around and willing to help, the executor should be able to get a new - currently dated Certificate (in PA, called a Short Certificate [probably called something else in CA] - proves the individual is the executor and legal representative of the estate. It works like, but is not called, a power-of-attorney. Power-of-attorney is for when a person is alive, and ceases to be legal once the person dies.), and have the executor sign whatever forms necessary to show proof of transfer - even with date of sale 20 years ago. Maybe the USCG office can provide a form(s) for this situation.

If the executor has passed or cannot be found, call the attorney that handled the estate. The sale to you is most likely documented in the estate file at the courthouse, showing the boat as an asset on the asset inventory, and your name as the transferee. You should be able to get copies (certified from the Probate Clerk) of the inventory list and sale details. The USCG might accept the certified copies from the Court, in lieu of the signature of the actual executor, and your notarized Affidavit "Executor forgot to sign the USCG form". Sometimes Affidavits are accepted as substitutes for missing documents, especially when the individual that was supposed to sign - is now gone, maybe died, or cannot be found.

Good luck, report back to update us.

[jheyland]

I boat my boat thinking it was not registered. I luckily had the proper paper trail to transfer the title easily.

I then reached out to the Coast Guard to register the boat only to find it had a dormant registration. With my title, it wasn't a great lift to get the documentation transferred to my name - a phone call to them did help in clearing up exactly what was required.

[ewaldorf38]

As far as I know, the documentation number will remain the same as the previous owner, just send in any documentation you have on the sale of the boat. The CG has a great website for every situation as far as documentation, regardless of the amount of time gone by. You should not need a lawyer and not have an issue re-documenting your boat

[ewaldorf38]

You should not have a problem documenting your boat as I believe you will use the same documentation number as the previous owner. The CG has an outstanding website that allows a solution for every situation including yours. You will no need an attorney, just proof of purchase information.