Affordable GPS/VHF to possibly go with autotiller ST1000

[alfreddiaz]

I am looking at buying a new VHF radio with AIS. I like the price and features of the Horizon GX2200, which does a decent job of showing you ships in the area.


I currently have a Raymarine Autotiller ST1000 that is NMEA capable.



I also want to one day have a dedicated GPS chart plotter (I am currently using Navionics Boating HD on my cell phone)


QUESTION

WHAT VHF RADIO AND CHART PLOTTER WOULD YOU RECOMMEND THAT I BUY?


Please keep in mind that I want to connect my VHF, Chartplotter, and Autotiller.





MAX BUDGET


VHF: $400
Chartplotter: $500


I already own the ST1000 autotiller.



USE:

I am not a bluewater sailor. This will be for inland navigation on the Columbia River and occasional overnight trips in the Puget Sound.



Thank you.


Skipper Al
S.V. Carried Away - Harpazo
Catalina 25

Port Kelley, Washington

[smac999]

You are probably going to want a nmea 2000 radio. And a plotter that has both nmea 2000 and nmea 183.

If you buy the 2200. You need a plotter with 2 com ports. One for the radio at high speed and one fjor the pilot at low speed. 2 ports is now very rare.

[dougweibel]

An alternative would be to use a NMEA2000 to NMEA0183 converter to connect to the autopilot, but this will add a bit of cost. However it will give you a lot more flexibility on the plotter choice.

Even so, not many plotter choices available at $500. Most at that price point seem oriented towards small fishing boats with fish finder being the primary feature and maps/everything else secondary.

[alfreddiaz]

Doug and Smac999


Thank you for the replies. You made me realize a couple things about mycommunications connectivity needs.


1. My current ST1000 uses NMEA 0183
2. The VHF I was looking at was NMEA 2200
3. It would be easier to match the 0183 than try to convert.


I have since decided on the Icom M506. The GPS Store has it new for $350, Hodges Marine for $500 (not certain why the big different). It has both NMEA 01834 and NMEA 2000.


Finally, I realize that a new chart plotter is going to be out of the questions, so I am looking at a used Garmin 420s, which is NMEA 0183, which I should be able to pick up for $150.





So here is what I am looking at for a possible communication/navigation setup.



*Currently installed - Raymarine Autotiller ST1000 with NMEA 0183

*Future purchase - Icom M506 VHF radio with AIS with NMEA 1083 & 2000

*Used Garmin 420s Chartplotter with NMEA 0183.



If you see any problems with this configuration, please let me know. There are lots of used 402s on the market, so I should be able to get a good deal.


Thanks.


Al

[Snore]

Alfred,

I am a big fan of networking all devices. But, as you have noted, sometimes it is just not worth it.

There is a GREAT article in January PS written by a rather insightful delivery captain. The key is to work up a network map. What do you have, what data needs to move between the devices and how will you accommodate future growth (if applicable).

It looks like you have a good plan, Raymarine Autotiller ST1000 with NMEA 0183, Icom M506 VHF radio with AIS with NMEA 1083 & 2000, Used Garmin 420s Chartplotter with NMEA 0183.

There is no golden rule that you have to go to 2000! Keep in mind how and where the boat is being used.

[dougweibel]

Hi Al,

You could certainly go that way although I'm not sure I would. It all depends on your long term goals with the boat I suppose. While $150 is cheap you are investing in old technology. Why not a nmea2000 compatible used plotter? It may be better to get the beginnings of a nmea2000 backbone in place so that when it is time to replace your wind instruments, for example, you will have a more up-to-date infrastructure to work with.

Also, there is a used M506 on Ebay at present:
https://www.ebay.com/i/383465895219?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=383465895219&targetid=88628106998 1&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9028883&poi=&campa ignid=9248481498&mkgroupid=99428719168&rlsatarget= aud-622524042958la-886281069981&abcId=1141156&merchantid=8012294&gcli d=Cj0KCQjw-Mr0BRDyARIsAKEFbeeVYXbU44vr44Tomr_bIEC-Bl6s7s6MN5hezygd21A7dWTGzDu_2-gaAnLeEALw_wcB

[dougweibel]

I was just perusing used chart plotters and it seems like a real crapshoot. However, you can get in to a new Raymarine Axiom 7" for just over $500 (hodgesmarine.com - I've ordered stuff from them before). I had one of the larger Axiom chart plotters on my last boat and liked it. The free LightHouse charts are OK too. Unless I were looking for a drop-in replacement for an existing plotter that died I think I'd much prefer to spend a few hundred more and get a current generation plotter.

[Pete7]

Al, what do you hope to gain from wiring up the ST1000 to the network? Your setup only achieves a receive AIS, I wonder if you should aim for a Transmit AIS instead.

We used a ST2000 for a decade but in stand alone mode, worked perfectly and in coastal sailing since you are going to be in the cockpit anyway pressing a button occasionally to change course wasn't really a chore. Just don't sit next to it with a mobile phone in your pocket

The little Garmin 4xx and 5xx range are brilliant and again owned one for a decade, its still in daily use.

We have now upgraded but I didn't want to look at a 2" VHF screen for AIS information and I wanted a transponder AIS too. The solution was a Raymarine V50 refurbished from RM which is a basic VHF. To this I added an EM Trak AIS to transmit AIS. The output is 1830 and 2000 so will feed 1830 to our Garmin 555 and 2000 to the RM VHF and a second RM Element CP.

You have lots of choice, but its Spring so not too many bargains about, more will appear in the Autumn if you are willing to wait whilst watching e bay and craigs list etc for an opportunity in between, like the Garmin 420.

Pete

[alfreddiaz]

So, I will try to keep my response as short as possible.


My reason for the investment is I would like to have some type of AIS warning system before heading of to the Puget Sound this summer or, one day, down south for Catalina Island for a couple weeks. All I have currently is my Raymarine ST1000 Autotiller and Navionics HD on my cell bothn which is great for cruising the Columbia River, but I am wanting to do a my first trailer trip this summer and would really feel more comfortable knowing when those big ships are near.


That's my main goal. That said, it seems that if I buy the Icom M506, I get a VHF with an AIS alarm and a screen that shows me my direction and location of the approaching ships.


My current VHF works fine, but it is at least 2 decades and probably much older.




It is true that I don't expect to get much out of connecting my autotiller to my VHF. But connecting it to a chartplotter would be a plus, but not necessary. It just makes sense to buy stuff that I can connect.


Again, the main goal is to be able to get a warning on those big ships. And that is why I am looking for a VHF with AIS warning.



So, my plan is by the Icom M506 and get it as close to $300 that I can (new).


I am still open to suggestions and would consider a chartplotter with AIS and just keep my old VHF.


Thanks.


Skipper Al

[dougweibel]

Al,

I hear what you are saying about why you want AIS, and I'm a big fan. I went from no AIS, to AIS receiver, to AIS transponder, and each step has brought obvious benefits while out cruising. One thing I'm not a fan of, though, is trying to interpret AIS data on a little VHF screen. Another thing I find annoying is that Navionics has never added the ability to display AIS data as a feature, unless they did it lately and I haven't noticed. I like Navionics, but as described below I often ran Navionics and OpenCPN on my tablet simultaneously because OpenCPN will integrate AIS.

I"m going to toss out another suggestion I have used that is very inexpensive that worked well for me. Rather than replacing your VHF take a look at the Quark-Elec QK-A026 AIS Receiver with NMEA Multiplexer + WiFi + GPS, about $135 on Amazon. There are a couple other variants if you prefer NMEA2000, etc., though this version would hook to your autopilot and provide it a backup GPS. You will need separate GPS and AIS antennas - I used an inexpensive Shakespeare rail-mount VHF antenna. AIS and VHF are in the same band. I used a very small puck-style GPS antenna that I just taped to the AIS case.

All in you'd be ~$200. Not that much less than your solution but the big benefit is this AIS RX will stream data to your phone or a tablet. I used an inexpensive 7" tablet running OpenCPN. This ends up giving you a lot of the functionality you would get from a chart plotter - moving maps incorporating current position, velocity and course info AND with AIS targets displayed on the same map. Much easier to interpret, and more useful, than the AIS displays I have seen on VHF radios. You can quickly pull up time and distance of closest approach on any AIS target, have course lines plotted with closest approach distances updated in real time, etc.

[smac999]

the icom 506 will not send ais data via nmea 183. the nmea 183 is only for GPS data.

so if you get the 506 you want a nmea 2000 plotter.

also there is 3 versions of the 506 so be carefull if buying used. non ais non nmea 2000, non ais nmea 2000, and ais / nmea 2000.

if you get a nmea 183 only plotter. and a nmea 183 vhf (stardard hor) it must have 2 nmea ports. so you can feed ais input, and gps output. at 2 speeds. some of the older garmin ones could split the input and output speeds though. needing only one port.

[Snore]

If you are headed to open water, I am NOT a fan of AIS receive only. IMHO receive-only is a waste.

Contrary to what others posted- check the manual. I know a GX-2150 will push AIS data via NMEA0183 to a ‘vintage’ Garmin 440 plotter and the plotter will display it.

That is what I have. I feel that was a waste go to a Vesper with Wi-Fi. It will convert 0183 to 2k and 2k to 0183. And put it all on Wi-Fi. Once again a Garmin 440 will display AIS and alarm. But check the manual for your device.

When you are “out there” most ships and competent yachties will alter course to give you room.

If I had to do over, I would have kept my old radio and simply gone to AIS transponder.

Feel free to PM me or check article in PS.

[alfreddiaz]

Snore,

You got me to consider a different route. That is good. I appreciate all the advice. That said, what do guys think of the OWNA Chart Plotter and AIS transponder. I can get a new one for about $400. And it is NMEA 0183, which should connect easily to my auto tiller.

KP-39A - ONWA Marine Electronics Co. Ltd.

If I bought this, I would keep my current VHF.

Thanks.

Skipper Al

[dougweibel]

Originally Posted by alfreddiaz

KP-39A - ONWA Marine Electronics Co. Ltd.

Never heard of it. I see a sparse few reviews around that seem positive. They sell on Amazon but apparently have not even sold enough to have a review there yet. The chart plotter functionality, other than working with C-Maps and Navionics, seems very basic.

If you are on a tight budget at that price point it might be hard to resist. You will be taking a risk on a no-name product with little to go on. Could be great. Could be poorly made crap. Remember you will also need to budget for a second VHF antenna or an antenna splitter. Also you'll have to buy a map card from C-Map or Navionics, or use the built in maps. They don't say where they got their map data so who knows what they are.

Also beware there were other chinese? manufacturers selling inexpensive AIS transponders a while back that turned out to not be FCC certified. There is a small chance you could get in trouble using such gear.