Email access while offshore

[ka4wja]

Perhaps my wording was too imprecise?? I didn't mean to imply that everyone had reliability issues, just that rigging comms gear, of any kind, on-board, can have issues....especially when some buy "kits" on-line, etc. and aren't too familiar with the electronics...and the InReach being a portable unit, needs to have clear shot at the sky...

But, in any case, I'm happy that you did you designed / installed your system well...
{FYI, I love Iridium! I was one of the early beta-testers back in the 90's...my brother was a test engineer for Moto back then, he and team were alpha-testers, and I got to test later that year! Awesome, back then!}

Originally Posted by billknny

We have used an Iridium Go for 3 years across the Atlantic and pacific. If there are “reliability issues” with a Go mounted in the cabin using an external antennae, we haven’t seen them. Never once has an email failed to go through. Nor have we had any trouble getting our weather data downloaded.

And condemning that setup as ”costly” compared to the other options you promote is... very strange.

Now, billknny, I do take issue with this last part of what you wrote??
I was not, and don't think I ever "condemned" Iridium....I actually LOVE it!!

And, am I missing something??
David said he had HF Radio already, and just needed to keep in touch with family/friends??
How is "free" more "costly" than buying an InReach or Iridium??


And, FYI...
I'm not "promoting" anything...just answering a question from a fellow sailor.
As you are doing, by mentioning your good experience with Iridium and ext. antenna.





EDIT:::
Okay, I see now...
You were responding to my recommendations to Gary, the original poster, from last month...not David from today...
So, in that case....yes, my words were intended to stress the reliability of a fixed sat comm terminal (which ARE expensive, compared to a GO, etc.), versus the good (and less costly) but less reliable systems (like the "GO")....
I was not "promoting" anything, or at least I didn't think I was....
But, rather I (and I think "hellosailor") was making sure he understood that if he really "must" be in contact, then a sat comm terminal designed for that purpose would be best..

Originally Posted by meshugah

My problem is that I must have regular and reliable email access as part of my work commitments. I simply must be in contact with the office.

And, yes it is PRICEY!!
And, yes....your approach (Iridium w/ ext ant) is good! And, is a workable / reliable system for most...but, in my opinion, not for everyone and if Gary absolutely needed absolute reliability, I stand by my words...(but, probably should've explained things a bit better??)


billknny, thanks for encouraging me to explain better!







fair winds.

John

[hellosailor]

Davil-
Part of the confusion may be because "Iridium" has different meanings. Their trademark attorneys will probably be after all of us.(G)
There is the Iridium satellite network, currently the world leader in networked satellite communications. The current owners bought the original system out of bankruptcy for pennies on the dollar. That and government/military contracts have allowed them to flourish. They also market "Iridium" communication devices that (no surprise) use their own satellite network.
Other companies like Garmin (the new owners of InReach) make only hardware, and have contracts to use the Iridium satellite system with them. In theory anyone can make equipment that will work equally well with the satellite system. There's another satellite system (GlobalStar) which does not offer polar coverage and apparently is having more financial difficulties, and Elon Musk threatens to put up a third system as soon as he can get some 4000 satellites into a very different orbital situation.
But as of now, the iridium *satellite*network* is pretty much the only deal for folks who need coverage in polar areas.

Similarly, it makes no difference who is making the "phone" equipment. With this kind of gear, having a big bad antenna oriented the right way counts for everything. A handheld device (like InReach) will have an antenna that can survive in your hand. A fixed externally mounted antenna will be much larger and generate a much stronger signal. So in this case, "size counts". Regardless of whose clever design the equipment uses.

[davil]

thank you Hellosailor
your description helps
part of my confusion was checking prices for comparison in Amazon
where there are two different offerings.
Garmin Inreach Explorer+ for $ 449
Iridium GO! 9560 Satellite Terminal with Wi-Fi Hotspot. for $ 694

there is about $200 dollars diference,and since have to buy one of these units,like to make sure I get the right one, $ 200 is not that big of an initial problem IF getting the right one,I am usually "el cheapo" and some times I get it right,some times not.

[meshugah]

Hi Guys!

I really appreciate all the input and suggestions received via this discussion.

For much of my proposed cruise from Port Douglas, Queensland to Darwin in the Northern Territory (Australia), I will be sailing between the mainland coast and the Great Barrier Reef. Also, for the leg across the top of Arnhem Land we will be sailing within 50M of the coast much of the time. After carefully reviewing the Telstra cellphone coverage using external antennas for those areas, I believe that I may be able to access cellphone signal for a good part of the cruise if I remain within 50M of the coast. I have therefore purchased a Comset 3G/4G/4GX Wifi/router (recommended by an expert in Sydney) with twin external antennas mounted on the davits of my Catalina 42Mk2. This will create a Wifi hotspot and should enable me to receive emails and access the internet with my laptop and iphone7.

When further afield and away from the coast, e.g. crossing the Gulf of Carpentaria or perhaps if we venture further out into the Arafura Sea, I will be using an Iridium Go! with XGate s/w to receive emails via satellite. Of-course the Go! also produces a Wifi hotspot within the yacht.

So, after considering the options and my need to stay in touch with the office, I have opted for those 2 solutions. I also have a trusty Icom M710 HF radio but don't plan to use it for email at present. I am hoping that the 2 solutions I have chosen provide me with the necessary email connectivity.

Many thanks
Gary on Meshugah.

[double u]

this is the idiot asking:
can the Iridium Extreme do all the things the Go can, or do they complement each other?

[hellosailor]

Gary-
If "50M" means 50 miles rather than meters? You are in for a surprise. Cell phones, at least here in the US, will not work more than 16 (statute) miles from a tower. Even if there is a perfectly good signal and line of sight, the cellular systems look at the signal latency (delay in return response) on every connection, and automatically reject any tower that is more than 16 miles away, in the assumption that "there must be a tower closer to them". This is part of how they determine which towers will have to arbitrate and share the loads, While that may differ for some carriers--I would strongly suggest you do some reality checking with your carrier and your equipment before expecting anything near or above 16 miles. In many places, the towers are also oriented to cover the areas where people and traffic are expected. In which case there may be plenty of roads and houses in sight--but your signal may simply not reach 3 miles offshore.
The cellular carriers, at least in the US, will not disclose any technical information to the public. They are concerned about both security and trade secrets versus competition.

[meshugah]

Originally Posted by double u

this is the idiot asking:
can the Iridium Extreme do all the things the Go can, or do they complement each other?

The Iridium Extreme is a satellite phone, whereas the Iridium Go is a satellite router which creates a WiFi hotspot in side your boat for up to 5 devices simultaneously. You can use your existing smart phone, tablet or laptop to communicate with the world via the Iridium Go. The Go is about half the price of an Iridium sat phone.

Hope that helps.

[meshugah]

Hellosailer:

I understand exactly what you are saying, however Telstra was at one time our government owned sole national phone service here down under. It was sold off by the government and listed on the stock exchange some years ago. Despite the problems which afflict many large corporations, it has the best mobile phone network in this country. If you check their coverage maps which are very detailed you will see that their coastal towers radiate out to sea quite a long distance and if external antennas are used that distance can be increased substantially.

My yacht has been berthed in Port Douglas for 9 years during which time I have spent a significant amount of time sailing around the Great Barrier Reef. Yeh, it’s a tough life, but some has to do it, right? In all that time I have made lots and lots of calls from out on the reef using my iPhone, over distances of 20M or more. The calls get more and more patchy the further out you are, as would be expected. Now that I have installed a WiFi router with twin 1.5 metre antennas on my davits, I do expect the range to be increased substantially. The proof of the pudding will be in the eating, and I propose to try it all out in June.

Time will tell all.

[meshugah]

By the way, a number of Sydney to Hobart race entrants have used exactly the same configuration as I have now got for cellphone coverage while travelling along the coast.

[double u]

Originally Posted by meshugah

The Iridium Extreme is a satellite phone, whereas the Iridium Go is a satellite router which creates a WiFi hotspot in side your boat for up to 5 devices simultaneously. You can use your existing smart phone, tablet or laptop to communicate with the world via the Iridium Go. The Go is about half the price of an Iridium sat phone.

Hope that helps.

this I had understood. for us the question is, if the Go has capabilities that the Extreme does not, like can we get email (say via uuplus) through the ex. too?

[meshugah]

Sorry mate, I don't know the answer to your question.

[Anders]

Originally Posted by hellosailor

Gary-
If "50M" means 50 miles rather than meters? You are in for a surprise. Cell phones, at least here in the US, will not work more than 16 (statute) miles from a tower. Even if there is a perfectly good signal and line of sight, the cellular systems look at the signal latency (delay in return response) on every connection, and automatically reject any tower that is more than 16 miles away, in the assumption that "there must be a tower closer to them". This is part of how they determine which towers will have to arbitrate and share the loads, While that may differ for some carriers--I would strongly suggest you do some reality checking with your carrier and your equipment before expecting anything near or above 16 miles. In many places, the towers are also oriented to cover the areas where people and traffic are expected. In which case there may be plenty of roads and houses in sight--but your signal may simply not reach 3 miles offshore.
The cellular carriers, at least in the US, will not disclose any technical information to the public. They are concerned about both security and trade secrets versus competition.

It's around 35 km for a GSM system but there are extended range versions that do much more than that.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by double u

this I had understood. for us the question is, if the Go has capabilities that the Extreme does not, like can we get email (say via uuplus) through the ex. too?

The Extreme will also get data, and I think at the same (low) speed as the Go, but you can't get the bulk data packages for it, like you can for the Go.

I bought a Go for the unlimited data plan at $139 per month - quite a deal. For the handheld phones you pay for the data by the minute.

[Pegasos]

p { margin-bottom: 0.25cm; line-height: 120%; } Hi Gary on Meshugah


I need to retract my advice regarding Telstra. I am finding that their actual coverage on the ground (water?) is not nearly as good as their maps imply. At Lizard Island you need to take you phone and its external antenna up the hill to get signal. From there on all the way to the Escape River we had no signal. A big Telstra tower at Portland Roads was damaged some time ago and will apparently not be replaced until December, which explains much of the blackout. From Escape River through to Seisia coverage is OK. Then nothing till Gove, not surprising. I’m now on the Arnhem coast and finding sporadic coverage, quite a bit less than what's shown on the Telstra maps. In retrospect I wish I had a satellite device of sorts.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

The Extreme will also get data, and I think at the same (low) speed as the Go, but you can't get the bulk data packages for it, like you can for the Go.

I bought a Go for the unlimited data plan at $139 per month - quite a deal. For the handheld phones you pay for the data by the minute.

I've now been using this device for a while and it is astonishingly good.

Plain text emails and even attachments of moderate size go through without a hitch. $139 is the price, as it turns out, of being truly connected for a month even offshore.

So this makes it ideal not only for email, but for getting GRIB files from Saildocs. Through the "send" command in Saildocs, you can also get their system to reduce a webpage to plain text and email it to you, which it does almost instantly. This is really useful for official weather forecasts which are published online in "printable" form.

I'm an old radio guy here, but I am really amazed at how useful this satellite system is.