KISS-SSB as SSB Ground?

[Roniszoro]

I researched the Forum and found great conflict in POV's as to this product. My SSB guru, an enormously respected SSB seller and servicer, thinks it is close to worthless. But I read input form folks on this forum who have been very happy with it, including SSB installers.

My issue is that I have a cored hull and won't drill into it to install a dynaplate, my desired solution, even with all the precautions of making sure there is no water intrusion from the drilled holes (sealing the cored area between the skins). My through-hulls are not bronze, so that is not an option. SSB is a "nice to have" for me but is not essential. (I have an ICOM M802 and a AT-140 tuner, but I could always sell them.)

Also, are there alternatives to a dynaplate or KISS or KISS like system for a ground? Your experiences are most welcome. Thank you in advance for your input.

Ron

[Jim Cate]

Bolt on keel? If so, a keel bolt works quite well.

Jim

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by Roniszoro

I researched the Forum and found great conflict in POV's as to this product. My SSB guru, an enormously respected SSB seller and servicer, thinks it is close to worthless. But I read input form folks on this forum who have been very happy with it, including SSB installers.

My issue is that I have a cored hull and won't drill into it to install a dynaplate, my desired solution, even with all the precautions of making sure there is no water intrusion from the drilled holes (sealing the cored area between the skins). My through-hulls are not bronze, so that is not an option. SSB is a "nice to have" for me but is not essential. (I have an ICOM M802 and a AT-140 tuner, but I could always sell them.)

Also, are there alternatives to a dynaplate or KISS or KISS like system for a ground? Your experiences are most welcome. Thank you in advance for your input.

Ron

Do you have Stainless Steel Lifelines? You could connect the ground to a stanchion bolt below deck, and use all of your lifelines. That would be inferior to using a dynaplate or through hull, but better than KISS. And usually pretty easy to do. You could also then have a wire connected to the same stanchion that you toss overboard while transmitting. Still not ideal, but SSB will work somewhat without anything at all so if it is only "nice to have" that may be enough for you.

[SoonerSailor]

A KISS or facsimile thereof will “work” even if it is far from the most effective counterpoise scheme. You can make something just as effective, and probably more so, by getting some insulated electrical wire, say 12 to 14 gauge, cutting it into 10-15 foot lengths, joining them all at one end with a ring terminal to attach to the AT140, and spreading the wires about the inside of the hull below the waterline, or even some above. There is absolutely nothing special about the KISS except convenience and perhaps protection from water ingress.

[s/v Jedi]

I have a cored hull (1” balsa) and have a capacitive coupling with seawater using a copper mesh that is part of the laminate (but the outer skin) so this isn’t an option for you, but you can try to install copper foil (comes in 3” or 4” wide rolls) from the tuner ground lug through the bilge under the waterline. It will be better than the Kiss product and optimizes chances of capacitive coupling.

[donradcliffe]

All grounds will work to some extent. It is also possible to make a pretty good ground to one metal thru hull. If you use the keel bolt, I would advise putting a capacitor in series so that it is only an AC ground.

[Statistical]

Originally Posted by Roniszoro

My issue is that I have a cored hull and won't drill into it to install a dynaplate, my desired solution, even with all the precautions of making sure there is no water intrusion from the drilled holes (sealing the cored area between the skins).

That is the best solution. You had to do it for your thruhulls. Done right you are good. Done wrong and your thruhulls are leaking water into the core anyways. Given the much smaller diameter of the mounting bolts for a plate this is simpler and easier to get right. Make a 1" hole, fill with epoxy, wait until cured, drill the bolt hole through the center.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Roniszoro

Also, are there alternatives to a dynaplate or KISS or KISS like system for a ground? Your experiences are most welcome. Thank you in advance for your input.

You can use a balanced antenna that doesn't require a ground or counterpoise. One example would be a loop antenna formed by using a connection to the forestay as one pole and a connection to the backstay as the other pole. Another example would be a half wave dipole inside a piece of rope, hoisted as needed.


The dynaplate plus backstay plus tuner combination became the standard because it works acceptably well for all frequencies, can remain in place permanently, and doesn't add windage. KISS-type antennas are a compromise and will not achieve the same effective radiated power that a dynaplate will. Then again, all real-world antennas are a compromise to some extent.

[SY Harmony]

Originally Posted by Roniszoro

I researched the Forum and found great conflict in POV's as to this product. My SSB guru, an enormously respected SSB seller and servicer, thinks it is close to worthless. But I read input form folks on this forum who have been very happy with it, including SSB installers.

My issue is that I have a cored hull and won't drill into it to install a dynaplate, my desired solution, even with all the precautions of making sure there is no water intrusion from the drilled holes (sealing the cored area between the skins). My through-hulls are not bronze, so that is not an option. SSB is a "nice to have" for me but is not essential. (I have an ICOM M802 and a AT-140 tuner, but I could always sell them.)

Also, are there alternatives to a dynaplate or KISS or KISS like system for a ground? Your experiences are most welcome. Thank you in advance for your input.

Ron

Some good suggestions already for “outbound” communications. But if your goal is to just listen and receive wefax, kiss should be fine a bit expensive compared to diy.

[sv_pelagia]

At some risk of backlash:

Our KISS counterpoise has worked well for us transmitting (and receiving) on HAM bands. Two other friends on boats had same, positive, experience with KISS

[Moo]

KISS works, there is no magic involved, but all those random wires inside the boat mean lots of RF inside the boat too. Not good for noise induced into your electronics or picked up by the KISS from your electronics.

Much, much, better to couple to the sea. If you really won't make a through hull, and cant use the keel bolts, then my next choice would be to install copper tapes as mentioned above. One wide strip run fore and aft along as much of the bilge as you can will do it. If want to try a KISS just make one as described by SoonerSailor and try it. Half an hour to an hour and you will know whether it works or not.

Have you checked that your boat doesn't have something already laminated in?