MMSI change for old radios

[wholybee]

If your issues is specifically with Boat US, you could try Power Squadron.
https://www.usps.org/php/mmsi_new/

I believe it is free.

[garychurch]

The USCG web site quoted below...

“MMSI Overview

Maritime Mobile Service Identities (MMSIs) are nine digit numbers used by maritime digital selective calling (DSC), automatic identification systems (AIS) and certain other equipment to uniquely identify a ship or a coast radio station. MMSIs are regulated and managed internationally by the International Telecommunications Union in Geneva, Switzerland, just as radio call signs are regulated. The MMSI format and use is documented in Article 19 of the ITU Radio Regulations and ITU-R Recommendation M.585-6, available from the ITU.

How to Obtain an MMSI Assignment

In the United States, the National Telecommunications Administration (NTIA) provides MMSIs to federal users, and the Federal Communication Commission (FCC) provides MMSIs to everyone else. NTIA is as Executive Branch agency under the Department of Commerce, and the FCC is an independent agency.

U.S. Non-Federal User

In order to obtain an MMSI, mariners required by regulation to carry a marine radio and those who travel outside the U.S. or Canada to foreign ports must apply to the Federal Communications Commission for a ship station license or an amendment to a ship station license. State and local governments can generally obtain an FCC ship station license at no charge.

Mariners not required to carry a marine radio (e.g. recreational boaters) and who remain in U.S. waters can obtain an MMSI through approved organizations such as BOAT US 1-800-563-1536, U.S. Power Squadron, and Shine Micro (primarily for AIS).

How to Update or Change an MMSI Registration

If your MMSI registration information or contact information changes for any reason, you must update your registration. If you sell your DSC-equipped radio or AIS or the boat these devices are mounted on, you must cancel your MMSI registration and should inform the new owner of the need to reregister the MMSI. This is necessary to ensure that the Coast Guard is able to contact the right persons if a distress situation were ever to occur. These registration changes can be accomplished by contacting the organization or agency which originally registered your MMSI. If you do not know which organization registered your MMSI, you can identify that organization by comparing your existing MMSI against those listed in the document MMSI ship station blocks allocated in the US (updated 01 December, 2020).”

That still leaves two major question. If you get a new MMSI number and overwrite (reprogram) the old MMSI with the new numbers. You should be good. Cancelling the old MMSI was the responsibility of the previous owner, not the new owner. The second question is who can reprogram the MMSI. Generally this can be a marine electronics shop authorized to work on your radio. If this can be done on site (your boat) no reason to pull the radio and send it back to the manufacturer.

Good luck.

[oldjags]

The problem is you cannot transfer an MMSI number from BoatUS to the USCG. They use different numbers, and BoatUS-issued MMSIs are only supposed to be used here in the US.

USCG-issued MMSIs are valid world-wide, so if you have an EPIRB and AIS, and plan to travel up to Canada or the Caribbean, for instance, you probably want a USCG issued number.

When we bought our boat, it came with an Icom VHF with a BoatUS-issued MMSI. I had an EPIRB from my old boat with my old USCG-issued number, so it made sense just to update the MMSI registration info on the EPIRB and use that number for it and my AIS transceiver.

But now the old MMSI in the Icom VHF causes problems. Since my AIS is transmitting a different MMSI number, The VHF thinks there is another boat with the same name tailing us everywhere we go! I've learned to ignore it on the MFD, but I have to turn off the collision warnings to keep them from sounding continuously. I'd kind of like to have that alarm functional.

Eventually, I'll have to either get a new VHF, or take that one off the boat and send it somewhere to get it reprogrammed.

It's too bad the VHF companies can't use a process like cell phone companies do to unlock phones. You give them the serial number, they give you a security code, then you reprogram it yourself.

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by oldjags

It's too bad the VHF [Marine Band radio] companies can't use a process like cell phone companies do to unlock phones. You give them the serial number, they give you a security code, then you reprogram it yourself.

Actually, Standard-Horizon has just such a system. Its use began about 2017 in their new models. The MMSI in the DSC radio can be reset "with advice from the manufacturer" by the end-user in the field using just the radio itself, no special cables nor special programming applications. For more information see

Reset of MMSI of DSC Radio by End User
Reset of MMSI for DSC Radio by End User - CONTINUOUSWAVE

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by oldjags

USCG-issued MMSIs are valid world-wide...

First problem: the MMSI is issued by the FCC, not the USCG.

Second problem: you seem to be implying that certain MMSI's are invalid outside of the USA. That is not true. The operation of the radio will not be affected by its geographic location. There is no geo-fencing built into a DSC radio that makes it stop working if it goes outside the USA.

The FCC regulations are clear about what ships need to get an FCC-issued SHIP STATION license: ships are required to have a radio, ships that make international voyages, ships that contact foreign shore stations. For those ships, the FCC issues a SHIP STATION LICENSE and gives the ship a radio CALLSIGN, and, if the applicant desires, an MMSI for DSC calling and AIS identification.

Only ships that do not make international voyages, do not contact foreign shore stations, and are voluntarily-equipped with a radio are able to be avoid getting an FCC SHIP STATION LICENSE. They are considered to be licensed-by-rule, and are typically recreational boats.

Licensed-by-rule boats can get a MMSI from a private MMSI-issuing agency if they prefer instead of from the FCC.

The only difference in the MMSI is how widely the data about the registrant of the MMSI will be shared. Since the registrant for a private agency issuing MMSI's has declared that his ship does not make internationally voyages, his data won't be shared internationally. (This really makes quite good sense.) But the registrant's DSC radio will still work anywhere the ship goes.

[goboatingnow]

It was always a mistake that the US administration uniquely decided to create essentially an internal mmsi and an external mmsi. The reasons at the time where largely because the US has essentially a completely uncontrolled marine VHF arena and huge concerns were expressed about the “ doofus “ factor.

The rest of the world typically has a certification process and hence it was less of a concern as every radio operator ( in theory, if not in practice ) would receive specific training on DSC and GMDSS

of course many nations has a considerable body of unlicensed vhf users , but these don’t have mmsi numbers

[goboatingnow]

But his DSC radio will still work anywhere he goes.

Work as in technically function , yes , work as intended in a GMDSS scenario , not so effectively

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

The FCC one is free to transfer

I doubt that the FCC will process any paperwork these days without a fee. Generally the FCC imposes two types of fees: regulatory fee and application processing fee. While there may not be a regulatory fee associated with certain categories of license, there generally are application processing fees.

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

There is no requirement to cancel [an FCC-issued ship station license upon the sale of the boat]...

I have doubt about this. Generally a licensee of an FCC-issue station license has obligation to inform the FCC if there is a change in ownership of the station. I would expect this applies to stations in the Maritime Service.

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

...the license can be transferred by filling in FCC form 603...with the signatures of both [assignor] and assignee

In addition to "filling in" the form, the form has to filed with the FCC. The filing of a form with the FCC by the prior owner indicating he has sold the radio station to a new owner is in effect a notice of cancellation of the original license and request to transfer to a new licensee.

Here is the form:
https://www.fcc.gov/sites/default/fi...c-form-603.pdf

Excerpt:

Types of Filings
Assignment of Authorization
An Assignment of Authorization involves a change in the identity of the holder of the License and generally entails the changing of the Licensee’s name...

Both the Assignor and Assignee must sign the form. ...

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by continuouswave

I have doubt about this. Generally a licensee of an FCC-issue station license has obligation to inform the FCC if there is a change in ownership of the station. I would expect this applies to stations in the Maritime Service.


In addition to "filling in" the form, the form has to filed with the FCC. The filing of a form with the FCC by the prior owner indicating he has sold the radio station to a new owner is a notice of cancellation of the original license and request to transfer to a new licensee.

Here is the form:
https://www.fcc.gov/sites/default/fi...c-form-603.pdf

Excerpt:

I meant you don’t have to specifically cancel , you can transfer , ie a cancellation would suggest the issuance of a new different mmsi , whereas a transfer would suggest the number remains

Looking at part 80 fees, there is certainly no fee for the transfer process , there are clearly fees for the issuance and renewal of the license

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Work as in technically function , yes , work as intended in a GMDSS scenario , not so effectively

Yes, I agree. The radio keeps working. I don't know how a proper rescue authority would behave if they received a distress alert DSC call from a ship and couldn't look up the registrant.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by continuouswave

Yes, I agree. The radio keeps working. I don't know how a proper rescue authority would behave if they received a distress alert DSC call from a ship and couldn't look up the registrant.

As a former RNLI lifeboat station chairman , I can tell you , that rescue agencies will respond to unregistered DSC distress and urgency calls in exactly the same way. However lack of ships detail means they can’t determine the nature of the vessel and hence the response type or contact the emergency contact numbers to verify details.

This means delays and incorrect responses can occur, clearly voice follow up is always present , both in the mandated distress calls ( it’s never supposed to be DSC only ) and in the CG/ rescue agency responses. But if no voice contact is made, rescue assets will be deployed anyway

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Looking at part 80 fees, there is certainly no fee for the transfer process , there are clearly fees for the issuance and renewal of the license

Thanks for that clarification. I spent about 15 minutes trying to find the specific fee schedule. Can you give a link to the document you found?

I found this document:

https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/FCC-18-90A1.pdf

Under the Appendix, Service category 3 SHIP, under category e. Modification, there is no form 603 process listed. Most other processes charge a $70 fee.

However, at

https://www.fcc.gov/bureau-divisions...radio-stations

I did find this:

What to Do If Selling Your Ship

If you sell your ship, you may file FCC Form 605 requesting cancellation to:

Federal Communications Commission
1270 Fairfield Road
Gettysburg, PA 17325-7245

Once your license is cancelled, the new owner may apply for a NEW license.

Or you may request a transfer of control or assignment of the vessel to the new owner. See "Assigning or Transferring a Ship Station License."


Assigning or Transferring a Ship Station License

Subject to the FCC's advance approval, [emphasis added] you may assign a Ship Station License (as when you are selling a vessel) or transfer control of a Ship Station License (as when there is a change in the ownership of the licensee or its parent company). To obtain the FCC's approval for the assignment or transfer of control, [emphasis added] you must file FCC Form 603. There is no fee required.

It is not clear if filing FCC Form 603 is just to get advance approval of a transfer. And then there is another form to make the transfer. The government is never simple to work with.

[jjccp]

Originally Posted by wholybee

If your issues is specifically with Boat US, you could try Power Squadron.
https://www.usps.org/php/mmsi_new/

I believe it is free.

Thanks for that suggestion. I contacted the local person from the Power Squadron that inspected my boat this summer, but they seem to be clueless at the moment.

I tried that link, but I can't see any way to actually make a transfer.

[continuouswave]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

It was always a mistake that the US administration uniquely decided to create essentially an internal [MMSI] and an external [MMSI].

I disagree. The more significant difference between the USA and other maritime nations with regard to maritime mobile service identity (MMSI) registration is the number of SHIPS that will require an MMSI.

In the USA there are millions of recreational boaters whose boats have digital selective calling (DSC) radios. In fact, due to regulations, any recreational boater who wants a new radio is going to be buying a DSC radio. If you have a DSC radio, you need a MMSI in order for the radio to work correctly.

It is clear that in the USA the USCG is strongly encouraging recreational boaters to get a DSC radio, and thus they need an MMSI

This result is that the USA is unique among maritime nations in needing potentially to have millions of boats obtain an MMSI. The FCC has permitted a few private agencies to administer and register MMSI for recreational boaters who operate "only domestically." The FCC defines "operating domestically" as boats that "do not travel to foreign ports or do not transmit radio communications to foreign stations."

On that basis, there is nothing intrinsically in error with the FCC practices. The FCC practice of authorizing private agencies to register recreational boats that operate domestically with an MMSI at a very low cost service or for no cost is a very useful service, and I am sure it is much appreciated by most recreational boaters who "operate domestically."

The confusion occurs when a boater who intends to make international voyages and to transmit to foreign station makes an error and registers with the private agency. This is a mistake by the recreational boater, not a mistake by the "US administration."

To make the opposite argument, that is, to suppose that the FCC should have never provided a low-cost or no-cost method for recreational boaters who operate domestically to obtain an MMSI from a private MMSI-issuing agency, could be easily seen as a mistake. One could argue that the USA was consuming millions of MMSI registrations and flooding the international data base with boats that would never make an international voyage.

Any premise that so easily could be argued in diametrically opposed views is probably not a particularly valid premise.

Regarding other FCC procedures related to ship radios

I don't know how every other maritime nation handles licensing of SHIP STATIONS, but in the USA most recreational boaters can avoid getting a formal ship station license if they meet the criteria for being a "licensed-by-rule" ship station. The criteria for being a "licensed-by-rule" ship station includes the criteria for "operating domestically."

Again, if you are not qualified for a licensed-by-rule exemption from getting a ship station license, you must get a ship station license from the FCC. When the FCC issues a ship station license, it all also issue at no additional cost an MMSI. So on that basis, the MMSI is a no-cost addition to the ship station license.