Need Feedback on Autopilot problem

[S/V Elusive]

Chuck - You are a long time and often very informative member of the forum. Tom was right to be pissed. ANY disparaging characterizations of another member is NOT allowed - please read your forum rules. I would STRONGLY suggest that you (Chuck) retract your statement.

We now RETURN this thread to it's original intended purpose. Thank you ALL for your cooperation.

[AnchorageGuy]

If someone will tell me what specific comment I made to "piss" him off I will consider it and I can't see where anything I posted is considered a personal attack. Also which of the posting rules have I violated? I supposed that I could consider some of your (Thomas) posts to my inquiries over the top today also but also maybe not. If making observations based on an individuals post is indeed against the rules then I do apologize and think that a very large number of posts on the board are against the rules. Sorry for posting here and getting off the subject but a PM to me would have kept this off the thread. As for the link on my signature, it does not automatically open so anyone without the time or inclination to read them should avoid clicking on it. However the over 400 folks that have read them, some must have enjoyed it. And where is the admonishment about the personal attack on me posted prior to yours?

[Tom967]

"Tom, Perhaps you and this yacht stuff are not compatible. This is not the merchant marine and you sound like this whole boat owner thing is going to give you a stroke. You will need to get used to it or find a different pastime."

Well I apologize too..just found this to be a bit over the top and off point..."in a frustrating sitution"that I haven't satisfactorily resolved as yet

[AnchorageGuy]

Tom, I have 30 years as a Marine Service tech and 10 years as a yacht broker. I understand the frustrations you are experiencing and was trying to convey that this is indeed not unusual and will continue to be a source of aggravation. But that is the nature of the beast and we learn to live with it and not let it diminish the positive aspects of this lifestyle. Apology accepted.

[Tom967]

Originally Posted by Chuck Baier

Tom, I have 30 years as a Marine Service tech and 10 years as a yacht broker. I understand the frustrations you are experiencing and was trying to convey that this is indeed not unusual and will continue to be a source of aggravation. But that is the nature of the beast and we learn to live with it and not let it diminish the positive aspects of this lifestyle. Apology accepted.

Thomas J. Colligan :Seaman/Naval Architect/ Marine Surveyor..."Tell me about it.".LOL


A Few Good Boats .Com

[GordMay]

Gentlemen:
I hope that we can understand this personal misunderstanding to have been resolved, and put to bed - with no further action required.
However, if you (Tom & Chuck) desire, I could edit the thread to delete (what as I see as) the personal discussion, or you could do it yourselves (individually). Let me know.
Gord

[mudnut]

Thomas,first off I will tell you your link is now in my favorites and in time will be put to disk.You simplify celestial navagation to a point that even I can understand with no knowledge of charts and what-not.I intend to read the link thourghly at a time more conveinient to my work hrs.I do wonder though that a person of your knowledge would post a question to such a simple solution.A solution that I would expect a person with your vast experience to be able to deduce relativley easy.Who knows what stumps peoples train of thought.Mudnut.

[Tom967]

Originally Posted by mudnut

Thomas,first off I will tell you your link is now in my favorites and in time will be put to disk.You simplify celestial navagation to a point that even I can understand with no knowledge of charts and what-not.I intend to read the link thourghly at a time more conveinient to my work hrs.I do wonder though that a person of your knowledge would post a question to such a simple solution.A solution that I would expect a person with your vast experience to be able to deduce relativley easy.Who knows what stumps peoples train of thought.Mudnut.

The celestial ..was relatively easy.."I've had a lot of practical experience with it..and when it's in the minds eye it's easy to relate..When you do the complete designs of 47 boats..you can do it on a piece of used toilet paper ...it's 90% same ole...same ole..10% inspiration

I just ordered a new engine today..the help I got on the Thread I started "I want a new engine was invaluable"...made perfect sense..and acted on it..To get a new Yanmar..

We get distracted..as well..but there is nothing like "experience"..The benefits of sites like this..for people to "Impart their experience"..brings us the ability to save time, effort and focus..

I started the thread specifically to put the issue out there for those who have dealt with the issue to impart their experience in resolving same...

[mudnut]

Haven't read the new engine thread yet,but there is a lot of people allover going to Yanmar when repowering.Horse's for course's,hpe ya happy with the new donk.Mudnut.PS,if there is any quirey's on ya link may I PM ya without recourse?.Cheers.

[No Strings]

Tom,
If the hydraulic actuators and motor is fine, then just replace the electronics with something from Alpha or B&G. No, it isn't free, but it shouldn't break the bank either. Just for point of reference, our group of singlehanded racers here in Norcal usually carry along a couple of extra motors as spares for the race to HI and a switchable backup control processor. Frankly I'm a little surprised that a merchant mariner and naval architect isn't aware of the MTBF of these systems.

[Antares]

I've been researching a new autopilot and agree with No Strings. Any head and computer that are compatible with each other should drive your existing hydraulics. Check the compass because there is a chance if it is ok, it will be useable if the new computer can read it's output language. I'm not sure on the rudder position indicator. Best bet would be to check with Simrad as much of the NAVICO could be upward compatible with their newer items. In your case I would look into Simrad first just to be able to use as many of the existing bits as possible.

[No Strings]

One additional note. More modern autopilots (at the top end anyway) allow the use of rate gyro sensors that permit the autopilot processor to adjust for the changes in pitch, roll, and yaw caused by changes in sea state. IOW, it makes it much easier for the autopilot to steer, greatly reducing the energy consumption.

[btrayfors]

Tom,

OK, you're on :-)

Here's my advice, based on over 50 years of sailing experience on many of the world's oceans, and on a prolonged experience with old and cranky "junk" autopilots.

You're headed on a very long trip...to Ecuador and across the Pacific (your own postings).

An autopilot is a VERY IMPORTANT piece of gear. It's just not something nice to have.

BUY A NEW AUTOPILOT UNIT! Sounds like the hydraulics (cylinder, pump, reserve tank, etc.) are all OK. Keep them.

Chuck's advice was good: W-H Autopilots are the best around. And, they've been around a long time. Their designer, owner, and chief cook and bottle washer is an engineer of the old school: W. Hamm. He provides tech assistance BY TELEPHONE 24/7. His autopilots are extensively used on fishing and commercial vessels, as well as sailing vessels. And, of course, on my vessel. I installed a P-3C on my boat (42' 27K displacement sloop) a couple of years ago. Now, when underway I often wonder what it is I used to do aboard :-)

You can see pix of this pilot here: Gallery :: Born Free's New W-H Autopilot

I'm not selling anything. I don't have any vested interest in W-H Autopilots or in your venture. But, I can tell you from over 15 years dealing with a cranky autopilot (Autohelm 5000 which I'd certainly put in your category of "junk") which tried several times to kill me, it's well worth the investment for a new, quality autopilot. Strike something else off the list, if you must.

Hope your refit and upcoming voyage goes well.

Bill
S/V Born Free

[first42]

I know this thread is old, however, I have encountered a similar problem with a Cetrek autopilot, where the elctronics died, leaving the hydraulics in decent condition.

(This is not an unsolicited commercial, as I have no ties to either of the two references I give.)

I had luck with the people at psicompany.com in that they will sell the elctronics for use on existing hydraulic units. They had a Simrad "corepack" and control head that could be used on my, or any other manufacture's hydraulics, and where very helpful.

As a side note, for any that have problems with the hydraulics, a company with a website octopusmarine.ca manufactures complimentary hydraulics to be used with any electronics packages.

Wish you the good luck with resolving your issue.

Curt

[Songline]

I have to agree with a lot of what Tom has to say. A lot of the electronics sold is not very good. I had newish B&G instruments with cold solder joints, Garmin GPS with tiny wire fall across the input rendering a no signal condition. I too was a senior engineering tech in electronics for a lot of years and know just from looking that most of the equipment is "pro-sumer" at best. It's true it has to work in a difficult environment but it's still not very good. Can't say it would keep me from going sailing but I don't have a very high confidence level of it.

Peter