What's the state of SSB

[jordanbigel]

Originally Posted by phorvati

Thanks for your input, this is very confusing to me. Why cant you email a marina? Is there a description of policies for winlink emails somewhere on line. I do see that sysops read your email because on some stations swear words could come with a warning and even result in a dropped email.

The way I understand it is that Ham radio cannot be used for commercial purposes. So the test for what you can and can't write in an email and send via WinLink is "Is this email for a commercial purpose?" - if the ham gatekeepers of WinLink feel your email is for a commercial purpose, they can and will spike it (ie. not deliver it to the recipient).

Specifically, no one said you cannot email a marina via Ham, but, if your email is determined to be for a commercial purpose, then it may be spiked.

My understanding is that the criteria used to determine "Is this email for commercial purposes" has changed over the years as others have said.

Again, as others have said, it used to be that the determination was based on the potential for commercial gain of the Ham user (sender), now it seems to be based on whether either party in the email (ham sender or land-based receiver) has a commercial interest.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by derfy

Just wondering how to get Weatherfax on my Iridium Go. My carrier, PredictWind, pushed to sell me an expensive weather routing app (which was an okay grib viewer but terrible router) and [what a surprise] their tech support were never able to make plain weatherfax downloads work [even though they have an app to do this], and [mysteriously] they were unable to receive emails from the NOAA email ftp site service than can sent weatherfax attachments via email. I never got a weatherfax on Iridium from PredictWind. Just wondering who your Iridium carrier was? (for when I next buy a SIM card)

The carrier doesn't matter. I use Predictwind. I've used BlueCosmo in the past. You need to subscribe to sailmail, and download and use the Airmail software. That also solves the NOAA attachment issue as airmail allows attachments. The Airmail software works with the Iridium as well as SSB. The faxes are in the catalog somewhere. It has been years since I downloaded them so I don't recall exactly where. Or, subscribe to some other email service instead of the included and very limited Iridium email.

It takes significant practice to learn all the Predictwind features, and when you do, it is invaluable. If you don't learn them, it's just an expensive grib viewer. No weather routing software is going to give you a route that is the best route to follow. That isn't how they are used. But with multiple routes on multiple models, you can use the *text* reports Predictwind generates to evaluate a trip on what conditions you will see each day. What will be your AWA and AWS, Swell height, direction, and period, etc. Those will be very good, even if you choose to take a different route. A hint, in many cases the difference between following the ideal route, and sailing a straight line, is only a few hours over a course of a couple weeks. So, unless you are in a race, don't stress the route too much.

I know there is a lot of disagreement on this, but I feel the gribs and Predictwind are *much* better than fax. The argument that faxes have notes by real people and that is more reliable than a grib, is offset by the fact that even having taken a marine weather class that taught me how to somewhat read a fax, I only learned how little I can understand of them, and that you really need a background in meteorology to read a fax. If you really want human written notes, download the GMDSS reports, which are available in predictwind or via airmail.

Professional Meteorologists use the weather models to figure out what to write on the fax. That should tell you something.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by Jammer

Maybe it doesn't matter (because the outcome for sailors is the same either way), but I want to point out that this isn't strictly true from a legal standpoint. The law says amateur radio can't be used in furtherance of a trade or business and you can't provide communications for a fee. Up until about ten years ago the widespread interpretation of this was that you could use a VHF phone patch to order a pizza but if you owned the pizza place you couldn't take orders via VHF.



This is entirely about USA-based amateur radio operators disliking Winlink and insisting that Winlink sysops engage in this sort of overzealous enforcement. They see Winlink as competing for scarce HF spectrum and interfering with their contests and roundtables. If there's ever been any sort of court case or enforcement action based on this (which I doubt) I'd like to see the details.

I agree that it is mostly US HAMs disliking sailors using the bandwidth. The irony is that Winlink was developed largely by sailors, for sailors, and now are not welcome there. And I don't think there has ever been any FCC enforcement on sailors using winlink. However, in addition to the commercial use argument, I have had this quoted to me:

47 CFR Part 97 Subpart B
§ 97.113 Prohibited transmissions.
(a) No amateur station shall transmit:
(5) Communications, on a regular basis, which could reasonably be furnished alternatively through other radio services.

Given that there is a service specifically provided for Maritime Communications, regularly using HAM radio for Maritime Communications is thus prohibited.

[derfy]

Originally Posted by wholybee

The carrier doesn't matter. I use Predictwind. I've used BlueCosmo in the past. You need to subscribe to sailmail, and download and use the Airmail software. That also solves the NOAA attachment issue as airmail allows attachments. The Airmail software works with the Iridium as well as SSB. The faxes are in the catalog somewhere. It has been years since I downloaded them so I don't recall exactly where. Or, subscribe to some other email service instead of the included and very limited Iridium email.

It takes significant practice to learn all the Predictwind features, and when you do, it is invaluable. If you don't learn them, it's just an expensive grib viewer. No weather routing software is going to give you a route that is the best route to follow. That isn't how they are used. But with multiple routes on multiple models, you can use the *text* reports Predictwind generates to evaluate a trip on what conditions you will see each day. What will be your AWA and AWS, Swell height, direction, and period, etc. Those will be very good, even if you choose to take a different route. A hint, in many cases the difference between following the ideal route, and sailing a straight line, is only a few hours over a course of a couple weeks. So, unless you are in a race, don't stress the route too much.

I know there is a lot of disagreement on this, but I feel the gribs and Predictwind are *much* better than fax. The argument that faxes have notes by real people and that is more reliable than a grib, is offset by the fact that even having taken a marine weather class that taught me how to somewhat read a fax, I only learned how little I can understand of them, and that you really need a background in meteorology to read a fax. If you really want human written notes, download the GMDSS reports, which are available in predictwind or via airmail.

Professional Meteorologists use the weather models to figure out what to write on the fax. That should tell you something.

Sorry, were you actually able to receive NOAA radiofax attachments over Iridium GO?

Specifically from nws.ftpmail.ops@noaa.gov? Recently (in the past year or two)?

The answer sounded like "years ago", or it ought to work with Airmail?

I tried this with the Iridium Mail app (which also claims support of compact tif or gif attachments) and worked many hours with PredictWind tech support to make it work. Also tried their XWeb Weatherfax app, which utterly failed.

They, like you, gave many reasons why I really should not want NOAA Weatherfax images, and that I should appreciate their app and be happy I bought it. I did not resubscribe.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by derfy

Sorry, were you actually able to receive NOAA radiofax attachments over Iridium GO?

Specifically from nws.ftpmail.ops@noaa.gov? Recently (in the past year or two)?

The answer sounded like "years ago", or it ought to work with Airmail?

I tried this with the Iridium Mail app (which also claims support of compact tif or gif attachments) and worked many hours with PredictWind tech support to make it work. Also tried their XWeb Weatherfax app, which utterly failed.

They, like you, gave many reasons why I really should not want NOAA Weatherfax images, and that I should appreciate their app and be happy I bought it. I did not resubscribe.

Yes, it has been a few years. The Iridium mail app will not work afaik. I have never heard of the Predictwind Xweb Weatherfax app.

My subscription is off for the season, so I can't test for you, but I am positive that with the Airmail software and a subscription to sailmail you can download weatherfaxes. Airmail has a catalog built in with about 1000 weather related files and reports you can download from all over the world. Sailmail is an email provider that would replace your Iridium email address and is specifically marketed to this. You select what you want, and airmail will automatically create the request email for it. It does the same for gribs. Just highlight a section on a world map, and it will create the message to request the grib from saildocs.

[sv_pelagia]

Yes, with Airmail AND Sailmail (or HAM Winlink) you can download weatherfaxes... and gribs

[Pegu Club]

Originally Posted by goeasy123

Before I invest time and money in SSB is it still relevant with other means of comms coming along?

We are new to the SSB/HF world, it is easy enough to join in, and there are multiple daily nets on SSB on top of what can be accessed via the Ham frequencies with appropriate certification, we use our SSB radio to listen to and communicate with Chris Parker, east coast and Caribbean weather guru, usually twice a day, we have been using his services for four years, plus we listen to three different cruising nets, as has been mentioned up thread one can link their laptop to the radio for more functionality. I mentioned in another thread, here at the Vero beach city Marina there was an impromptu SSB “how to” gathering the other day, good info was provided, there is a sizable community of Knowledgeable folk on HF out there.

Fair winds,

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by sv_pelagia

Yes, with Airmail AND Sailmail (or HAM Winlink) you can download weatherfaxes... and gribs

OpenCPN has generators for Grib and Weather Fax files, with HF and Internet links and displays as chart overlays.

[wsmurdoch]

Originally Posted by phorvati

Thanks for your input, this is very confusing to me. Why cant you email a marina? Is there a description of policies for winlink emails somewhere on line. I do see that sysops read your email because on some stations swear words could come with a warning and even result in a dropped email.

Carefully read https://winlink.org/terms_conditions paying particular attention to the section "Prohibited Message Content". If you have questions or can offer advice, the place to do that is the Winlink Programs Group https://groups.google.com/g/winlink-programs-group . Searching back through the older threads you can find much discussion of the subject.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by wsmurdoch

Carefully read https://winlink.org/terms_conditions paying particular attention to the section "Prohibited Message Content". If you have questions or can offer advice, the place to do that is the Winlink Programs Group https://groups.google.com/g/winlink-programs-group . Searching back through the older threads you can find much discussion of the subject.

It isn't up to them.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by Jammer

It isn't up to them.

Of course it is. Winlink is a privately owned system and they can set whatever rules they want, above and beyond any FCC requirements.

[wholybee]

Originally Posted by Tupaia

OpenCPN has generators for Grib and Weather Fax files, with HF and Internet links and displays as chart overlays.


Attachment 270025

Yes, but OpenCPN doesn't have an email client to send and receive those requests. Airmail is an email client, and Sailmail (and also winlink) the email service that works with it. Both are optimized for HF and Satellite links.

The process is to download the gribs and faxes with Airmail, then load them into OpenCPN.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by wholybee

Of course it is. Winlink is a privately owned system and they can set whatever rules they want, above and beyond any FCC requirements.

The problem is that they're doing it under the color of law, and pressuring individual Winlink station operators into compliance. Amateur radio operators generally prize order, loyalty, patriotism, and structure over justice and fairness and don't ask enough questions about who made the rules.

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by wholybee

Yes, but OpenCPN doesn't have an email client to send and receive those requests. Airmail is an email client, and Sailmail (and also winlink) the email service that works with it. Both are optimized for HF and Satellite links.

The process is to download the gribs and faxes with Airmail, then load them into OpenCPN.

Agreed but the most difficult part for many people is creating the messages and with Airmail set as the mail server (in windows) the process is as near to seamless as possible.

[AA3JY]

Just a FYI for those using a SCS DR7400 and the Airmail program ver. 3.5.. There is a possible problem where the mode is set for P3(a legal requirement when operating in CONUS) but reverts(not my doing) to P4 when it connects to a P4 Winlink station(not in CONUS).



..as a result I've been receiving "WARNING" correspondence from a ARSFI rep.



````````````````````````````````````````

I pointed your use of PACTOR 4 out as a curtesy to help you avoid issues with your license.  Others are managing to avoid PACTOR 4.  YOU are responsible for the operation of your station.  Suggest using Express where this is not a problem.

N5TW out
From: Clay <aa3jy>
Sent: Monday, January 9, 2023 8:31 AM
To: amature.abuse@arsfi.org
Cc: amateur.abuse@arsfi.org
Subject: Re: FW: Possible illegal use of PACTOR 4 by a US Station


Again as I’ve pointed out earlier this is a program/software issue. We end users in particular we marine mobile users expect error free issues when using these digital communication modes such as PACTOR. Placing additional burdens such as watching a particular program settings or having to change stations to insure its legal mode conforms to a certain legal requirement places undue burdens where one is expected to manage a marine vessel. Please place your attention on the program developer as the issue is with them and how it should conform when used legitimately.



Clay AA3JY
s/v Tango


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


I've also gone ahead and informed the program developer of Airmail concerning this possible issue and also forwarded INI.files for his purview. At this time I have not heard back nor have seen an update to possibly correct this issue..


Clay AA3JY
s/v Tango