NMEA depth sounder

[GreenHeaven]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Wow, great information!

Then that's probably a good solution for the op. This cheap set includes the transducer, so he doesn't have to worry about finding a display compatible with his old transducer.

But why does he actually need depth on his network? Who cares iso long as you see depth from the helm? Or you can get the cheap second display if you need it in another location. Lot to be said for freestanding depth which won't go down if there's a problem with the network.

YES! WOW! great information

I want all important data on the NMEA network. The future holds for alarms for position and depth, etc etc changes sent to mobile phone anywhere in the world, including the bedside while sleeping single handed

https://www.nasamarine.com/product/c...-depth-system/
How can a new, complete system cost 160 from clipper and a transducer replacement almost 500 from ripmarine?
Those days of crazy markups are rapidly coming to an end - thank goodness

To the argument about tablets for displays, yes a dedicated unit is better, preferable, more relaible in a storm, brighter, cooler looking and my first choice.... money no object. But I need to replace a 90s autopilot, actually TWO dead RayMarine autopilots, both of which ran on the famously bad fluxgate compass, and notriously unrelaible hardware.

So in 20 yrs will my nice new ideal chartplotter still be working? cos NONE of the RayMarine hardware is working on this boat and thats including Radar, fish finder, depth, 2 autopilots, wind angle, ruddereg angle dangle angle,etc etc. NOTHING!
Itsd all DEAD, OLD TECHNOLOGY not worth reviving.

My tablet however, will be replaced every 12mo or 24mo for the next 20 years with each one providing better screen, lower power usage, more memory, more computing power, better connectivity, charging options and possible even water resistence good enough for an occasional cockpit dousing. Its the future. It just is.

I loved Garmin hardware for vehicle navigation and i hate phone navigation with google, but the reality is, the smartphone ate Gamins lunch. NMEA wifi is going to eat RayMarines lunch, and im not sorry. They have made out like bandits for decades.

So if you look at this form a another angle... every dollar you spend is a vote, I am trying NOT to vote for RayMarine and trying to vote for simple, effective solutions like clipper and NMEA when I can.

That said, unless I can find something better, I will probably end up dropping 3k on a RayMarine auto pilot if I can get the linear actuator serviced becuase the new units are quite good, do not use the fluxgate compass and will save me a from a total install of a new system.

Originally Posted by duichan

Why NASA themselves don't sell an add-on for this is beyond me.

Im sure they will. They are probably not scaled to deal with that aspect yet.

Ideally, there would be a circuit that would create those NMEA sentences not code running somewhere or did I miss that on the web page yhou linked (in polish?)

[Dsanduril]

Unless you already have a removable transducer housing this may not help, but CruzPro makes a series of active depth transducers that output NMEA 0183 direct from the transducer. No display included, you have to have some device that reads the NMEA data and displays the value. The plastic transom mount units might work as an in-hull device (with some range reduction) depending on a lot of factors. $200-$400 depending on model.

For your tablet instrument display, we run a Raspberry Pi ($50, 4-6W power consumption typical) with SignalK. And the InstrumentPanel (IP) plugin. IP provides a webpage view of your data in whatever format you decide. You can configure multiple pages with different data sets and these page definitions can be stored on the server. Anything that will display a web page will show the data (whatever data is available - NMEA 0183 is trivial, NMEA 2000 works but requires a bit more hardware). You can also define new page views at the device, these are stored on the device and not available on other devices. We have a normal sailing page (SOG, COG, Wind, STW, Hdg, BTW, DTW, XTE) and a "coming into anchor" page that provides depth and a few other items. A couple of other semi-used pages, with getting engine data included next on the list (some year...). We have a Raymarine P70 that has a configured data page with most of the sailing data, but prefer our tablet view most of the time (there are occasions when the marine-environment specific device does win).

I have a work in (very slow) progress to make a useable Kindle display of the data. There are samples out there that work, but not quite as easily as I'd like. I can usually put up with the 1-second update rate in exchange for the perfect viewability.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by GreenHeaven

...To the argument about tablets for displays, yes a dedicated unit is better, preferable, more relaible in a storm, brighter, cooler looking and my first choice.... money no object. But I need to replace a 90s autopilot, actually TWO dead RayMarine autopilots, both of which ran on the famously bad fluxgate compass, and notriously unrelaible hardware.

So in 20 yrs will my nice new ideal chartplotter still be working? cos NONE of the RayMarine hardware is working on this boat and thats including Radar, fish finder, depth, 2 autopilots, wind angle, ruddereg angle dangle angle,etc etc. NOTHING!
Itsd all DEAD, OLD TECHNOLOGY not worth reviving...

Funny you talk as if money is critical ("if money no object") yet you won't even consider fixing the old stuff and want to spend $3k on a new autopilot and talk about 4 tablets replaced periodically etc etc.

I've heard that kind of talk before, in technology, when people would rather buy new than even go to the trouble of understanding the old stuff. It was called, THE NOT INVENTED HERE SYNDROME.

I think you are doing the old stuff a disservice. I'm not big fan of RayMarine, but I've got a 20 year old Raymarine autopilot and two of the flux gate compass units, and they work fine. In fact my previous ST4000 unit, which is 25 years old, still was working when I replaced it with an X5 system. My 30 year old Lowrance plotter works perfectly, and my 30+ year old B&G Hercules instruments all still work and do stuff that only the priciest new stuff can match. My stand alone signet depth sounder is 38 years old and still works fine.

I like new stuff too and in fact plan to install a new B&G Hercules system later this summer, but I don't kid myself by saying I have to, or that it even makes sense. I just want it.

And don't try to defend doing all your navigation on a tablet. It's risky and inexcusable. Just don't go there.

Spend your money any way you want to, but don't kid yourself that you have to. That old technology will still provide 90% of what the new stuff does, and you could probably make it work. You just don't want to.

[duichan]

Originally Posted by GreenHeaven

Im sure they will. They are probably not scaled to deal with that aspect yet.

Ideally, there would be a circuit that would create those NMEA sentences not code running somewhere or did I miss that on the web page yhou linked (in polish?)

The NASA unit has been around now for a good many years, so unfortunately I think if they had any intention of making a NMEA0183 interface they would have done so by now.

The conversion is all done in software (on a dirt cheap Arduino). It would not be cost effective to do it with "a circuit", which in any case would just be a locked-in version of the same code. At least the source code on the link I referenced is written in English.

[mlydon]

https://www.thegpsstore.com/Marine-E...xoClZYQAvD_BwE

The itc5 takes speed, wind, and depth analog instruments and converts all 3 signals to nmea2000. The savings is in when you need to replace a transducer - a nmea2000 speed transducer is $200, an analog one is $80.... same for depth, etc.

Matt

[GreenHeaven]

Originally Posted by wingssail

Funny you talk as if money is critical ("if money no object") yet you won't even consider fixing the old stuff and want to spend $3k on a new autopilot and talk about 4 tablets replaced periodically etc etc.

I've heard that kind of talk before, in technology, when people would rather buy new than even go to the trouble of understanding the old stuff. It was called, THE NOT INVENTED HERE SYNDROME.

I think you are doing the old stuff a disservice. I'm not big fan of RayMarine, but I've got a 20 year old Raymarine autopilot and two of the flux gate compass units, and they work fine. In fact my previous ST4000 unit, which is 25 years old, still was working when I replaced it with an X5 system. My 30 year old Lowrance plotter works perfectly, and my 30+ year old B&G Hercules instruments all still work and do stuff that only the priciest new stuff can match. My stand alone signet depth sounder is 38 years old and still works fine.

I like new stuff too and in fact plan to install a new B&G Hercules system later this summer, but I don't kid myself by saying I have to, or that it even makes sense. I just want it.

And don't try to defend doing all your navigation on a tablet. It's risky and inexcusable. Just don't go there.

Spend your money any way you want to, but don't kid yourself that you have to. That old technology will still provide 90% of what the new stuff does, and you could probably make it work. You just don't want to.

Sounds like my opinion riled you a little.
I appreciate your thoughts, but I dont agree.
My 25yo hardware is unusable - FACT
My head units are unreadable - FACT
My head units all had covers - FACT
My autopilot was manfr in the 90s - FACT and probably designed with 80s tech
My autopilot is NOT working - FACT

If your stuff is all readable and working perfectly, thats great. Good for you.

Investing in old design and old hardware is foolhardy at best - OPINION

Old hardware falure vs Tablet failure is probably tipped in the Tablets favor - OPINION

Your milage may vary.

[GreenHeaven]

Originally Posted by mlydon

https://www.thegpsstore.com/Marine-E...xoClZYQAvD_BwE

The itc5 takes speed, wind, and depth analog instruments and converts all 3 signals to nmea2000. The savings is in when you need to replace a transducer - a nmea2000 speed transducer is $200, an analog one is $80.... same for depth, etc.

Matt

THx Matt. I have looked at this several times. Its an option, but in my opinion, not quite worth the price.

Unless you already have a removable transducer housing this may not help, but CruzPro makes a series of active depth transducers that output NMEA 0183 direct from the transducer. No display included, you have to have some device that reads the NMEA data and displays the value. The plastic transom mount units might work as an in-hull device (with some range reduction) depending on a lot of factors. $200-$400 depending on model.

Thank you for that link
I looked at these products. The shallowest depth transducer is gonna be 300 euro with tax and shipping. Thats a little pricey IMO.
It should not be that expensive to convert the analog data to NMEA IMO

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by GreenHeaven

Sounds like my opinion riled you a little.

I appreciate your thoughts, but I dont agree.

My 25yo hardware is unusable - FACT

My head units are unreadable - FACT

My head units all had covers - FACT

My autopilot was manfr in the 90s - FACT and probably designed with 80s tech

My autopilot is NOT working - FACT



If your stuff is all readable and working perfectly, thats great. Good for you.



Investing in old design and old hardware is foolhardy at best - OPINION



Old hardware falure vs Tablet failure is probably tipped in the Tablets favor - OPINION



Your milage may vary.

Certainly in your case a new system is in order.

I would use the tablet at the nav table if the budget is tight, but not at the helm. For outdoor use you want an instrument which is water proof, rugged, daylight visible, hard wired for power, and - dedicated. A piece of fragile consumer electronics for that job is just wrong in my opinion. And anyway a 7" Vulcan or equivalent on sale doesn't even really cost more than a tablet.

If even a new Vulcan on sale is still too expensive, find a lightly used one. You should get 10 years out of it.

[GreenHeaven]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Certainly in your case a new system is in order.

I would use the tablet at the nav table if the budget is tight, but not at the helm. For outdoor use you want an instrument which is water proof, rugged, daylight visible, hard wired for power, and - dedicated. A piece of fragile consumer electronics for that job is just wrong in my opinion. And anyway a 7" Vulcan or equivalent on sale doesn't even really cost more than a tablet.

If even a new Vulcan on sale is still too expensive, find a lightly used one. You should get 10 years out of it.

Would love to, but for now autopilot takes priority

[GreenHeaven]

Originally Posted by nohal

None you could directly use.

Yes, the MFD or instrument the sensor is connected to usually does that.
In case of a Raymarine system, if nothing on your network has usable NMEA output, you may still convert SeaTalk to NMEA using a separate device.
.

Just to clarify, the units are all ST50 plus RayMarine. I am not yet sure how this data is all gathered, esp speed (I assume from the GPS) but all the 3 head units depth, speed, wind direction are connected with seatalk

(There is a manual for a ZO96/Z134 sender unit)

I have a Seatalk to Nmea converter. Your statement implies that I will be able to get all the data on NMEA network FROM THE GUAGES SEATALK by daisy chaining into the NMEA converter, and I do not need an ITC5 converter.

Did I understand that right?

[nohal]

Yes, you can connect the SeaTalk-NMEA converter anywhere on the SeaTalk bus.
You basically have 3 options:
- You have a spare SeaTalk cable and an available connector to connect it to.
- You don't have the spare SeaTalk cable, but there is an available SeaTalk connector to connect to (It is a bus, so there always should at least be one on the devices at the ends of the bus). Small female spade terminals at the end of the wires you connect work pretty fine.
- No connector accesible. Cut the SeaTalk cable anywhere and splice to the 3 wires T style, no rocket science.

You do not need ITC5, you would need it only if you did not have the ST50s that in your case take care of the conversion from the analog transducer signal to SeaTalk.

Speed (through water) does not come from GPS, it comes from a transducer, which may be, and often is, combined - depth & speed or depth, speed & water temperature.